News China's largest Core i9-14900K gaming cafe has suffered from instability issues since 2023 — the flagship store has 171 gaming PCs with Core i9-149...

[Makaveli]

Hmmm. AMD Zen5 chips (9000 series) is now rebranded to BulldoZen5. Isn't that fun?

Zen 5 not even remotely close to Bulldozer so I don't the connection.

 

[Amdlova]

Dead platform you want me spend 1000 us for 5% in power? Another 600us in cpu update
For another 10%

Nah I keep my 35w cpu kick the but of 9600x and if I need can increase the power to kick the 9700x

My target power is 200w for gpu + cpu

From 13600t for 14600t I think I will get 50% on multitasking and single 5 - 10% and this upgrade only draw 50us

 

[parkerthon]

Most people don't need cutting edge CPU performance and should consider buying CPUs that have been on the market for years, if the price is right.

Indeed, I keep asking what “10% better gaming performance” means to most gamers when it only matters if you’re chasing imperceptible levels of improvement on low visual fidelity, hardcore sweat competition 200+fps. I’d love to see some research on whether people can truly tell the difference between 100 and 200fps, much less 200-480fps.

 

[Mcnoobler]

What a loser. He would save so much money equipping them with 7800x3ds. And they perform better at gaming. And have a future upgradeable platform. But he obviously enjoys sucking Intel's lollies more than his own business efficiency

Maybe there's other uses he needs them for beyond 1080p gaming. Still, to each their own. Insulting people for not spending their own money the way you want to spend it, is a little low. Whatever hardware someone decides to buy for their own needs, it doesn't matter nor does it effect you. I get the corporate tribalism, but it's silly as they are both good CPUs, and one is a niche and the other is an all around fast CPU for everything, also comparable to AMDs main line of premium CPUs. The 7800x3d is an 8 core lower clock CPU that when it benefits from its extra cache, it looks good on paper at 1080p. When it doesn't, well it's not exactly topping the charts with every game. Dev target for gaming is currently a PS5 platform at 8 cores as well, so it works well for the current gaming market, and looks good on paper for most games. Overall though it isn't a strong CPU for using a PC outside of how you would use a console, which is why AMD still makes their premium line of CPUs.

Sure AMD split their market and now have to deal with the base wanting equal gaming performance on their all around CPUs with their niche gaming CPUs, but that's on them for splitting the market and expecting people to realize that there's multiple lines of CPUs for a reason, based on individual need. Doesn't make anyone stupid at all to pick one vs the other. Last Hardware Unboxed video I seen showed a +11fps average with a 7800x3d vs a stock 14900k (at 1080p), and the article states he overclocked his 14900k to 5.9Ghz all p core. How much of that 11fps average is now maintained? Who knows, but at least he can do fast installs and decompression/compression with the extra core performance for productivity. 7800x3d simply isn't good enough to insult people for getting something else, including AMDs all around great CPU line.

 

[Guardians Bane]

So The issues they suffered for a year on overvolted, overclocked CPUs with apparently dodgy PSUs and heatsinks is somehow Intel's fault?

Try reading again without a preconceived want for Intel to be faultless. Then do research with the ongoing issues with CPU degradation.

Plus, the article never stated all the problems were only from Intel. They never said how much actually.

But Intel does have faster degradation problems. Hence the reason they had their software engineers write a new microcode AND... Extended warranties, AND admitted themselves that 13-14 gen do have oxidation and degradation problems!!!... I know they "fixed" the oxidation in late 2023. But they themselves have said they have no clue as to how many CPUs, both tray and boxes, were released to the public and to mass private sector consumers.

People trying to say these issues aren't a problem and it's been blown out of proportion make me laugh almost as hard as AMD's Zen 5 pricing!!!

 

[Guardians Bane]

Internet/gaming cafe. lol

Have you ever left your country?

Different cultures do different things. Try to be a little more understanding of what others do that their people enjoy.

 

[Guardians Bane]

Broken computers!


Intel's old products are known good and far better than Bulldozer. 12th gen is working fine, as are the Alder Lake chips that got rebranded as 13th/14th gen. At the right prices (e.g. a cheap system on ebay), 10th gen Comet Lake or even the maligned 11th gen Rocket Lake are good.

Most people don't need cutting edge CPU performance and should consider buying CPUs that have been on the market for years, if the price is right.

That's my take also.... I'm building a new rig this fall to upgrade from my 6900hx based mini PC. With Zen 5 pricing so high currently I'm looking at the 7000 series. The price/performance is much much better. I am waiting on ARL just to make an informed decision.

Building with a gen or 2 older really is the way to go for making a strong DT and do it with less money. Most of the time the difference is negligible between AMD and Intel current offerings. And 12 gen vs 7000 series is pretty damn good still! And both are much better priced and can still last quite a while.

I wish more people would keep open minded like that.

 

[watzupken]

So The issues they suffered for a year on overvolted, overclocked CPUs with apparently dodgy PSUs and heatsinks is somehow Intel's fault?

Dodgy PSU aside, the 14900K are meant for overclocking as marketed by Intel. People are also paying a premium for the K series to allow CPU overclocking. So nothing too alarming here. Regardless whether there's overclocking or not, the Raptor Lake chip will eventually degrade. Hence you can somewhat tell people trust the brand a lot, so much so that their CPUs are all Intel based. But Intel dropped the ball by being elusive with the CPU issue. I wonder if the same store will still use Intel processors exclusively going forward.

 

[Sangheili112]

It doesn't say they were using dodgy PSUs. (power supply problems, heat dissipation problems, and CPU voltage problems)
Having the CPU overclocked is also perfectly fine as long as the CPU itself doesn't decide to override your settings and feed the CPU even more voltage causing instability and heat dissipation problems ... which is what the 13/14th gen is/was doing.

Saving an extra $200 on a cheap PSU doesn't make much sense when each computer potentially costs whatever $3700 in yen is! (Using Alienware r16 as a stand in)
More than likely each high end computer was ordered with the same model PSU as all the others.

We have a mixture of 10/11/12/13/14th gen Intel CPUs running at work (public library) on about 900 of our computers. (Mostly i5s so we dodged the bullet!)
Every few months we will get one that randomly gets an issue and sometimes that issue is with its power supply which is to be expected from our older computers since they are basically never shutdown for anything short of a hurricane.
What I'm getting at is if they have almost 700 PCs running high wattage hardware, 2-3 power supply issues a year wouldn't be out of the ordinary.

They are probably playing mobas on i9. Power could be lower wattage then what it requires or could be a whole building issiue with all those computers

 

[derekullo]

On a side note the Alienware R16 I linked earlier is now on sale!
$700 off!
Wonder if Dell knows something we don't like an imminent Geforce 5000 series release!!!!

 

[TheHerald]

There is no way in today's reality that I can recommend an Intel CPU.

Come on, let's face it, it's not like you ever reccomeneded an Intel cpu. Got plenty of amd lovers on the internet. Thank god normal people vote with the wallet.

 

[Pierce2623]

Got an z690 board and a 14600T for 310us still cheaper than one ryzen 9600x

The voltages are the limiting factor on long term stability. At or below 1.4v should be fine, and since the story doesn't specify how many cores are at 5.9, I find it completely plausible that they can have a few cores running at 5.9 and the rest at 5.6 or 5.7 and stay at or below 1.4v, if tuned. Which it sounds like they are. Just have to raise the LLC some and do a bunch of undervolting. My 13900kf does 5.5/6.0 and stays low enough.

The 8533 sounds more impressive.

Yeah 5.9 single core is fully in spec for a 14900k so I doubt they would call that overclocked. It genuinely seems like this guy bought enough 14900k chips to him them and get enough that can run 5.9 all core. With a custom loops it’s fairly doable if you’re willing to buy enough chips to bin them.

 

[Pierce2623]

On a side note the Alienware R16 I linked earlier is now on sale!
$700 off!
Wonder if Dell knows something we don't like an eminent Geforce 5000 series release!!!!

You do realize nobody on this site would buy from Alienware right?

 

[derekullo]

You do realize nobody on this site would buy from Alienware right?

You do realize you didn't read the last sentence right?

Having said that the price is cheaper than an equally built pcpartpicker build i put together.

https://pcpartpicker.com/list/YyvqcH

 

[YSCCC]

Well that's extremely tough settings. Because max stable clock for 14900k is around 5.5 GHz.
Plus there is no guarantee that ram will eventually be stable on that frequency.
I assuming that stability issues is because of this over clocking.

That is false... except doing AVX a stock setting 14900k runs at all P core 5.7Ghz by default, mine rock solid with hard undervolt at 1.32v sustained for long flight sim hours... that's only 200mhz overclock which I can do without upping voltage on air cooled noctua NH-U12A, but since it didn't bring me noticable speed bump but a lot more power consumption and 5C hotter after one trial I just revert back to stock.

 

[YSCCC]

Come on, let's face it, it's not like you ever reccomeneded an Intel cpu. Got plenty of amd lovers on the internet. Thank god normal people vote with the wallet.

yea, that's why intel sales dropped A LOT in recent months, and do you still buy them for your next PC?

 

[TheHerald]

yea, that's why intel sales dropped A LOT in recent months, and do you still buy them for your next PC?

Got any sales numbers that shows a huge drop in recent months?

Of course ill buy them for my next PC, if 15th gen is good why would I not?

 

[YSCCC]

Got any sales numbers that shows a huge drop in recent months?

Intel didn't release their numbers after the admitted issues, yet, but reports like this:

Intel CPU Market Share Drops Down Drastically In Korean DIY Market, AMD's Ryzen CPUs Fill In The Gap

Intel's CPU market share is starting to drop down drastically as consumers now deem AMD's Ryzen CPU offerings to be a much better option.

wccftech.com

are all over the place, maybe not in english, but at lease quite some countries have ppl "vote by the wallet"

Of course ill buy them for my next PC, if 15th gen is good why would I not?

Just a while ago you said you will by 9950X3D day 1, so now you think that internet is flooded by AMD fans and normal ppl vote by wallet? Interesting

 

[TheHerald]

Intel didn't release their numbers after the admitted issues, yet, but reports like this:

Intel CPU Market Share Drops Down Drastically In Korean DIY Market, AMD's Ryzen CPUs Fill In The Gap

Intel's CPU market share is starting to drop down drastically as consumers now deem AMD's Ryzen CPU offerings to be a much better option.

wccftech.com

are all over the place, maybe not in english, but at lease quite some countries have ppl "vote by the wallet"

Bruh, there is no drop in your link. They had a peak at end of May and then it normalized back to where it was at end of January. Amd follows a similar trend, it makes sense before the release of new generation sales halt a bit.

Just a while ago you said you will by 9950X3D day 1, so now you think that internet is flooded by AMD fans and normal ppl vote by wallet? Interesting

That was before the 9950x reviews. Now that I've seen the 9950x, im not so sure. Ill wait for both 15th and 9950x3d to release and go with whatever is best.

 

[YSCCC]

Bruh, there is no drop in your link. They had a peak at end of May and then it normalized back to where it was at end of January. Amd follows a similar trend, it makes sense before the release of new generation sales halt a bit.

let's face it, not month over month, the drop is overall year on year, and as the issue was only admitted by a bit less than 2 months, you wont have any sales figure trend showing otherwise, but overall Intel have fallen a lot compared to april, 2023, since then AMD sales switched with intel for most of the data. And sure, the denial ppl won't believe about shops saying ppl keep ask for AMD parts and not intel right now.

That was before the 9950x reviews. Now that I've seen the 9950x, im not so sure. Ill wait for both 15th and 9950x3d to release and go with whatever is best.

So, when ppl have doubt and would not recommend intel they are AMD fans, ppl vote with wallet, but then you are the clear minded guy when you hyped and say would go for 9950X3D even before any Zen 5 benchmarks are released, having such faith in AMD is.... logical.

Now I am obviously not your type of sane ppl, but in my mindset, when I have the 14900k, if it survives, the coming 2 gens have practically no reason to upgrade whatsoever, money better spend on other stuffs and not 5-15% gain in best case scenario and just use the existing high end platform for 2-3 gens before spend big for another TOTL PC upgrade. not sure about how this works in your place

 

[TheHerald]

let's face it, not month over month, the drop is overall year on year, and as the issue was only admitted by a bit less than 2 months, you wont have any sales figure trend showing otherwise, but overall Intel have fallen a lot compared to april, 2023, since then AMD sales switched with intel for most of the data. And sure, the denial ppl won't believe about shops saying ppl keep ask for AMD parts and not intel right now.

Man your numbers are from Korea DIY. That's like what, 0.005% of the cpu market? Come on now.

So, when ppl have doubt and would not recommend intel they are AMD fans, ppl vote with wallet, but then you are the clear minded guy when you hyped and say would go for 9950X3D even before any Zen 5 benchmarks are released, having such faith in AMD is.... logical.

Did I call someone an amd fan here?

Reviews were out when I said that, they were out on the 9700x. I expected the 9950x to have 2 very strong ccds able to hit high clockspeeds and dominate the competition, but they didn't.

Now I am obviously not your type of sane ppl, but in my mindset, when I have the 14900k, if it survives, the coming 2 gens have practically no reason to upgrade whatsoever, money better spend on other stuffs and not 5-15% gain in best case scenario and just use the existing high end platform for 2-3 gens before spend big for another TOTL PC upgrade. not sure about how this works in your place

I have a 12900k on my main rig. I'm not sure I'll upgrade, depends on how fast the 5090 is and if my 12900k is holding it back.

 

[YSCCC]

Man your numbers are from Korea DIY. That's like what, 0.005% of the cpu market? Come on now.

You ask for a number, and numbers except those smaller outlets arn't released in a monthly basis, but yearly or seasonal, so now the issue admission from intel started July, and you expect anyone can have any number published by now? that sounds very convincing arguement. If you want coporate numbers, please wait for another year to ask.

Did I call someone an amd fan here?

Post #36 as a reminder, or maybe you can argue amd lover and fan is different, others will judge

Reviews were out when I said that, they were out on the 9700x. I expected the 9950x to have 2 very strong ccds able to hit high clockspeeds and dominate the competition, but they didn't.

Well, but to intel's defense of their treatment and the whole RPL issue you stated that AMD have teething issues left and right, or is far worse in reliability or whatever other stuffs, so by that logic, even the 9950x did what you wanted it still have those issues where intel always do better no? and even with core parking issues, the 9950x still get quite a lot faster than 14900k in MT which you once think was really important metric when comparing zen4 to RPL, that is a product better than 14th gen unless you only do gaming, which, buying the TOTL CPUs makes little sense for most part. Of course, it's your money and your decision so I won't have an issue for your to vote with your wallet if the X3D is better than intel, but don't disregard ppl having concerns about Intel reliability or customer treatment after RPL saga and then just jump to AMD just because reviews said they are better

 

[TheHerald]

You ask for a number, and numbers except those smaller outlets arn't released in a monthly basis, but yearly or seasonal, so now the issue admission from intel started July, and you expect anyone can have any number published by now? that sounds very convincing arguement. If you want coporate numbers, please wait for another year to ask.

I didn't ask for a number, you claimed there is a huge drop on sales, I asked for some proof, now you are saying it doesn't exist. Okay.

Post #36 as a reminder, or maybe you can argue amd lover and fan is different, others will judge

Usually people that claim that in today's reality they can't recommend x usually never do, in any reality.

Well, but to intel's defense of their treatment and the whole RPL issue you stated that AMD have teething issues left and right, or is far worse in reliability or whatever other stuffs, so by that logic, even the 9950x did what you wanted it still have those issues where intel always do better no?

I never said that, I said the data (pugets data) show that yes, intel is more reliable than amd. It's not me claiming it, I just read the data available to me.

I don't care either way, both have warranties so whatever happens, I'll just RMA and get a new CPU. It's a big nothing burger

the 9950x still get quite a lot faster than 14900k in MT which you once think was really important metric when comparing zen4 to RPL, that is a product better than 14th gen unless you only do gaming, which, buying the TOTL CPUs makes little sense for most part. Of course, it's your money and your decision so I won't have an issue for your to vote with your wallet if the X3D is better than intel, but don't disregard ppl having concerns about Intel reliability or customer treatment after RPL saga and then just jump to AMD just because reviews said they are better

Quite a lot? I wouldn't say 10 to 15% is quite a lot. The 3d will probably be slower than 9950x so even closer to the 14900k, and since I'm not planning on buying the 14900k but the 15900k anyways, kinda moot point.

I totally disregard people having concerns about customer treatment. I have seen nothing to convince me otherwise.

 

[YSCCC]

I didn't ask for a number, you claimed there is a huge drop on sales, I asked for some proof, now you are saying it doesn't exist. Okay.

Usually people that claim that in today's reality they can't recommend x usually never do, in any reality.


I never said that, I said the data (pugets data) show that yes, intel is more reliable than amd. It's not me claiming it, I just read the data available to me.

I don't care either way, both have warranties so whatever happens, I'll just RMA and get a new CPU. It's a big nothing burger


Quite a lot? I wouldn't say 10 to 15% is quite a lot. The 3d will probably be slower than 9950x so even closer to the 14900k, and since I'm not planning on buying the 14900k but the 15900k anyways, kinda moot point.

I totally disregard people having concerns about customer treatment. I have seen nothing to convince me otherwise.

1) The Korean data is still data, it exist, but not in the big coporate scale, it IS data, also the local stores telling that sales of intel drops a lot relative to AMD is data, yet not auditor certified nos. mattering in millions, so I 朲have data, just not what you want as a worldwide, yearly sales no.

2) Puget sales is in the hundreds, at most thousands, much less than the small korean DIY seller would have sold, so if Puget data is reliable and repsentative, so do the korean DIY store

3) "Usually people that claim that in today's reality they can't recommend x usually never do, in any reality." you don't have proof either, just finger pointing, I myself did recommend go for intel for overall optimization and less minor issues to tackle with, at least since Sandy Bridge, but now, given how's intel layoff, employee furstration and the RPL handling, I won't recommend Intel anymore, just to give my own case.

5) you don't care is YOU, not others, others don't want down time and RMA have downtime, if RMA have a surge in complains, it is completely fine for those who have concerns and buy another competitor's product, so is that you are free to not care, don't mock on others who do care. RMA back and forth plus troubleshooting takes time, so it is not a nothing burger, unless your time worth nothing.

5) Gen on gen 10-15% is quite a lot, so the Ultra 9 (no 15900k FYI), won't likely get much further than that, it's moot to try upgrade every gen or two

 

[TheHerald]

1) The Korean data is still data, it exist, but not in the big coporate scale, it IS data, also the local stores telling that sales of intel drops a lot relative to AMD is data, yet not auditor certified nos. mattering in millions, so I 朲have data, just not what you want as a worldwide, yearly sales no.

2) Puget sales is in the hundreds, at most thousands, much less than the small korean DIY seller would have sold, so if Puget data is reliable and repsentative, so do the korean DIY store

No. Korean DIY sales are a drop in the ocean. They don't have to be representative of wide world sales. A producing selling well of badly in one tiny part of the world says absolutely nothing about the world wide sales.

Puget data on the other hand are representative of the real world. There is no reason why failure rates between puget and an off the shelf cpu will be different. They are the exact same cpus.

3) "Usually people that claim that in today's reality they can't recommend x usually never do, in any reality." you don't have proof either, just finger pointing, I myself did recommend go for intel for overall optimization and less minor issues to tackle with, at least since Sandy Bridge, but now, given how's intel layoff, employee furstration and the RPL handling, I won't recommend Intel anymore, just to give my own case

Intels layoff and employee frustration? Lol. I don't really care, they could lay off every single person, if the products are good I'll buy them.

5) you don't care is YOU, not others, others don't want down time and RMA have downtime, if RMA have a surge in complains, it is completely fine for those who have concerns and buy another competitor's product, so is that you are free to not care, don't mock on others who do care. RMA back and forth plus troubleshooting takes time, so it is not a nothing burger, unless your time worth nothing.

You are asking me why would I buy an Intel cpu. So obviously I'm talking about me. The chances of having a faulty cpu are tiny in the first place so in the offchance, you have warranty. 3 years for amd and 5 for Intel.

5) Gen on gen 10-15% is quite a lot, so the Ultra 9 (no 15900k FYI), won't likely get much further than that, it's moot to try upgrade every gen or two

10 to 15% after 2 years is horrible. 12th to 13th was over 40% in a single year.