[SOLVED] Connecting upto 10 routers in a home network

[haanijj]

Hello,

This is going to be long. I'm trying to share a single internet connection with about 10 apartments in an apartment building. I watched and read a few tutorials I could find online and they all mentioned do NOT connect a LAN cable from the main router to the WAN port of the other routers. However, this hasn't worked out for me. The current set up I have works well. The reason I'm posting this here is because I'm trying to understand why this works (along with a few other questions I have).
Here's how my connections are set up:

• Main modem from ISP is connected to an Orbi RBR50 (including 1 satellite connected to this through 5GHz)
• 3 LAN cables from the main Orbi connected to the WAN ports of Router#1,2,3.
• 2 LAN cables from the Orbi Satellite connected to the WAN ports of Router#4,5.

I'm assuming its ok to post local IP addresses here. I read from the tutorials that the first 3 parts of the IP addresses of the extra routers should be similar to the main ones (apologies for using complicated wording, I don't know the technical words).
The main Orbi has 192.168.10.1 which is different from the IP of the main modem (the WAN port of the Orbi is connected to a port in this modem). When I go into the modem's page, I can see that it has DHCP enabled and has 1 device connected to it, the Orbi. The Orbi also has DHCP enabled. All the routers other than the Orbi have their own IP addresses which is completely different from the style the guides mentioned. On the individual router setup pages, I set IP addresses such as 192.168.11.xx, 192.168.12.xx, etc. (I didn't know what I was doing). These routers also have DHCP enabled with their default gateway set as the IP of the main Orbi (192.168.10.1). But on the Orbi's setup page, I can see all these routers connected to it and has DHCP addresses assigned by the Orbi (192.168.10.xx).

Is this just a different way of setting up multiple routers or does this just work due to some miracle? A few questions I have are:

• How should I proceed if I wanted to add another router (Router#6) but get the internet connection for it from Router#5?
  • Do I connect a LAN cable from Router#5 to a LAN port on Router#6 with DHCP disabled like the guides mentioned?
  • Or can I connect a LAN cable from Router#5 to the WAN port of Router#6 and set it to have an IP like 192.168.20.xx with DHCP enabled and gateway set to 192.168.10.1 ?
• Can Router#1 and Router#2 have the same IP address since they're not related to the main Orbi's IP ? Will this cause issues on the network? Why so?

 

[RealBeast]

Hello,

This is going to be long. I'm trying to share a single internet connection with about 10 people in an large apartment. I watched and read a few tutorials I could find online and they all mentioned do NOT connect a LAN cable from the main router to the WAN port of the other routers. However, this hasn't worked out for me. The current set up I have works well and I'm trying to understand why (along with a few other questions I have).
Here's how my connections are set up:

• Main modem from ISP is connected to an Orbi RBR50 (including 1 satellite connected to this through 5GHz)
• 3 LAN cables from the main Orbi connected to the WAN ports of Router#1,2,3.
• 2 LAN cables from the Orbi Satellite connected to the WAN ports of Router#4,5.

I'm assuming its ok to post local IP addresses here. I read from the tutorials that the first 3 parts of the IP addresses of the extra routers should be similar to the main ones (apologies for using complicated wording, I don't know the technical words).
The main Orbi has 192.168.10.1 which is different from the IP of the main modem (the WAN port of the Orbi is connected to a port in this modem). When I go into the modem's page, I can see that it has DHCP enabled and has 1 device connected to it, the Orbi. The Orbi also has DHCP enabled. All the routers other than the Orbi have their own IP addresses which is completely different from the style the guides mentioned. On the individual router setup pages, I set IP addresses such as 192.168.11.xx, 192.168.12.xx, etc. (I didn't know what I was doing). These routers also have DHCP enabled with their default gateway set as the IP of the main Orbi (192.168.10.1). But on the Orbi's setup page, I can see all these routers connected to it and has DHCP addresses assigned by the Orbi (192.168.10.xx).

Is this just a different way of setting up multiple routers or does this just work due to some miracle? A few questions I have are:

• How should I proceed if I wanted to add another router (Router#6) but get the internet connection for it from Router#5?
  • Do I connect a LAN cable from Router#5 to a LAN port on Router#6 with DHCP disabled like the guides mentioned?
  • Or can I connect a LAN cable from Router#5 to the WAN port of Router#6 and set it to have an IP like 192.168.20.xx with DHCP enabled and gateway set to 192.168.10.1 ?
• Can Router#1 and Router#2 have the same IP address since they're not related to the main Orbi's IP ? Will this cause issues on the network? Why so?

Well, first how fast is your single ISP connection? You can connect a whole bunch of routers to one primary router that is attached to the ISP modem.

By way of example, let's say that your primary router is 192.168.0.1, just buy a 16 port switch to attach to that router, then attach the other 8 routers to the switch ports. Give each an address of 192.168.x.1 (incrementing x by one for each attached router so .1.1 up) and set each attached router to use a gateway address of the main router -- 192.168.0.1. That will allow each router to connect to the Internet through the primary router but isolate each from all of the others.

You will not have control over the bandwidth that each uses, and that will likely be a problem. There is no magic to networking, but everything must be correct or you will have issues. Each independent subnet can have its own DHCP for just that subnet.

A major issue will be wireless density, you will need to coordinate the channels used to minimize interference, although it will be an issue.

Let's just say this is a pretty "third world" approach to providing Internet service to your tenants unless it is free and they will not use much bandwidth (and that is a HUGE bad assumption).

If you actually already have some of the hardware, you should post a diagram of what you have currently set up. The best approach is not to "daisy chain" but to to have a line to each device from the switch attached to the primary router.

 

[haanijj]

Well, first how fast is your single ISP connection? You can connect a whole bunch of routers to one primary router that is attached to the ISP modem.

By way of example, let's say that your primary router is 192.168.0.1, just buy a 16 port switch to attach to that router, then attach the other 8 routers to the switch ports. Give each an address of 192.168.x.1 (incrementing x by one for each attached router so .1.1 up) and set each attached router to use a gateway address of the main router -- 192.168.0.1. That will allow each router to connect ot the Internet through the primary router but isolate each from all of the others.

Another issue will be wireless density, you will need to coordinate the channels used to minimize interference, although it will be an issue.

Let's just say this is a pretty "third world" approach to providing Internet service to your tenants unless it is free and they will not use much bandwidth (and that is a HUGE bad assumption).

I only have a speed of 300Mbps but it's not an issue here as most people don't use it at the same time and even if they do, it's simple web browsing or sending WhatsApp messages.

I'm sorry if I'm not explaining things properly in the questions I'm asking but I'm new to this but I'm interested in learning. I'm also just doing this to help my dad set up WiFi for everyone there. Everything works fine now, I just posted this to figure out why it works when the guides kept warning that it wont. So from what I understand, what I've done here is create multiple isolated networks that use the primary router to connect to the internet.
What would happen if two secondary routers had the same IP? Would it not matter as they're isolated from each other?

Also, using your example, if I had set the extra routers up by connecting LAN port to LAN port, with DHCP disabled and having an IP 192.168.0.x (outside the DHCP range of main router), I would be creating an extension of the same main network? Like, connecting to any of the extra routers would behave the same as connecting the primary router itself?

Finally, can I create another isolated network by connecting a router to any of the secondary routers (lets say Router#5)? (I can't this new router to the primary directly as it's too far away) If I could, would I set it's gateway to the IP of Router#5 or the IP of the primary router?
Or do I have to set it up the DHCP disabled LAN to LAN way (I'm sure there's a more professional way to say this).

I'll try to draw a diagram on paint if that'll help haha..

https://imgur.com/0JhUBy3

View: https://imgur.com/0JhUBy3
(skipped the satellite part as i thought it was not important)

 

[RealBeast]

Yes, the picture helps. The routers labeled 1-6 can either all be set as access points by turning off DHCP and using an LAN to LAN connection with a gateway address of the main router if you want one large network (with router 6 connected LAN to LAN to router 5).

Or you can make them all separate subnets that can only access devices on that particular router by leaving DHCP on and using a different number for the third octet (so like 192.168.x.1 where X is different for each router) and connect routers 1-5 to the primary router LAN port to their WAN port and Router 6 WAN to an LAN port on Router 5.

The problem part will be that you only have 3 non-overlapping 2.4GHz channels for their radios (1, 6, and 11) so set them up such that each channel is as far from another radio using the same channel. You will still get some interference that will slow the network. 5GHz works better because it does not travel as far through walls so would have less interference.

HERE is what it would look like with just one primary and one secondary router when each has its own subnet for privacy.

Overall the performance expected will not be very good though as there are too many users for a small home connection. Any single user can overload the whole connection by streaming a movie or trying to play a game.

 

[haanijj]

Yes, the picture helps. The routers labeled 1-6 can either all be set as access points by turning off DHCP and using an LAN to LAN connection with a gateway address of the main router if you want one large network (with router 6 connected LAN to LAN to router 5).

Or you can make them all separate subnets that can only access devices on that particular router by leaving DHCP on and using a different number for the third octet (so like 192.168.x.1 where X is different for each router) and connect routers 1-5 to the primary router LAN port to their WAN port and Router 6 WAN to an LAN port on Router 5.

The problem part will be that you only have 3 non-overlapping 2.4GHz channels for their radios (1, 6, and 11) so set them up such that each channel is as far from another radio using the same channel. You will still get some interference that will slow the network. 5GHz works better because it does not travel as far through walls so would have less interference.

HERE is what it would look like with just one primary and one secondary router when each has its own subnet for privacy.

Overall the performance expected will not be very good though as there are too many users for a small home connection. Any single user can overload the whole connection by streaming a movie or trying to play a game.

Thank you so much for the detailed information! This helped a lot. I'll try to setup something more professional later on.

 

[USAFRet]

10 apartments could easily be 30-50 devices.
1 PC, 1 laptop, 2x cell phones, 1 playstation.
5 devices per connection.

All going through that one pipe to the outside world.

 

[SamirD]

10 apartments could easily be 30-50 devices.
1 PC, 1 laptop, 2x cell phones, 1 playstation.
5 devices per connection.

All going through that one pipe to the outside world.

This isn't too much different than a hotel though--and we usually had far less bandwidth to boot. But most people didn't depend on hotel wifi as their primary service either.

 

[haanijj]

Or you can make them all separate subnets that can only access devices on that particular router by leaving DHCP on and using a different number for the third octet (so like 192.168.x.1 where X is different for each router) and connect routers 1-5 to the primary router LAN port to their WAN port and Router 6 WAN to an LAN port on Router 5.

Quick question, if I wanted router 5 and 6 to be a single network, I would connect them LAN to LAN and give Router 6 an IP outside the DHCP range of Router 5. In this case, what would be the default gateway for 6? Would it be the IP of Router 5 or should it be the one of the primary router?

 

[RealBeast]

If you connect 5 and 6 LAN to LAN, router 6 has no default gateway and primary is the default for 5. 6 would just be acting as an AP and it needs no default it uses the device that provides its DHCP service when just LAN to LAN. Just set the 6 IP address in the 5 range but outside the 5 DHCP assignable range.

 

[haanijj]

If you connect 5 and 6 LAN to LAN, router 6 has no default gateway and primary is the default for 5. 6 would just be acting as an AP and it needs no default it uses the device that provides its DHCP service when just LAN to LAN. Just set the 6 IP address in the 5 range but outside the 5 DHCP assignable range.

Ah, got it. The router6 (Linksys EA2700) I was using was kinda weird and only had a "bridge mode" setting that I could use and if I wanted to set its IP i had to enter default gateway as well. I put in an IP in the range of 5 and also a default as the IP of 5. Seems to work fine...for now. It's just a spare I had lying around I thought I'd use at home to improve range.