Question Deleting/removing firmware

[ihateliquorice]

Hi, everyone!

A novice as far as computer architecture and systems are concerned, I was thinking of firmware, about which I have the following questions:

– Can firmware be fully removed from a piece of hardware?

– Would removing firmware render the component's memory completely free, ie having X Gb of memory of the X Gb advertised?

– What can be done to the tabula rasa that is hardware without firmware?

Kindly asking fellow forum-dwellers for insight into the above,
Thank you

 

[Roland Of Gilead]

Hey there,

For the most part -

1. Most firmware cannot be removed. It is called embedded software. Perhaps in certain types of hardware this is possible. Of course firmware can be replaced updated, but this is controlled by the manufacturer.

2. If you could remove the firmware, the hardware would no longer function. It kinda makes it a moot point whether the capacity is the same as formatted drive (which it's not). You will lose some capacity formatting the drive for normal operations.

3. Again, it depends on which hardware you were able to run without a firmware. On ordinary PC components, there's always a layer of software interaction with the hardware, whether that's the bios/uefi, specific firmwares, drivers etc

 

[USAFRet]

Hi, everyone!

A novice as far as computer architecture and systems are concerned, I was thinking of firmware, about which I have the following questions:




Kindly asking fellow forum-dwellers for insight into the above,
Thank you

1. Generally, No

2. No. Be cognizant of the Base 2 vs Base 10 issue.

3. It would simply fail to work.

 

[ihateliquorice]

Hey there,

For the most part -

1. Most firmware cannot be removed. It is called embedded software. Perhaps in certain types of hardware this is possible. Of course firmware can be replaced updated, but this is controlled by the manufacturer.

2. If you could remove the firmware, the hardware would no longer function. It kinda makes it a moot point whether the capacity is the same as formatted drive (which it's not). You will lose some capacity formatting the drive for normal operations.

3. Again, it depends on which hardware you were able to run without a firmware. On ordinary PC components, there's always a layer of software interaction with the hardware, whether that's the bios/uefi, specific firmwares, drivers etc

Thank you for the answer.

Point 1. strangely elicits the 'chicken-or-egg' dilemma If the majority of hardware comes pre-installed with firmware, how is it embedded in the first place? And, if embedded, why can it be updated/replaced?

 

[USAFRet]

Thank you for the answer.

Point 1. strangely elicits the 'chicken-or-egg' dilemma If the majority of hardware comes pre-installed with firmware, how is it embedded in the first place? And, if embedded, why can it be updated/replaced?

It is written into some chips in the device during manufacture.

 

[hotaru.hino]

Point 1. strangely elicits the 'chicken-or-egg' dilemma If the majority of hardware comes pre-installed with firmware, how is it embedded in the first place? And, if embedded, why can it be updated/replaced?

These devices either have a permanent storage memory chip somewhere (such as flash, EEPROM, or straight up ROM) or it's built into the micro controller itself. In either case, if it's not a ROM type chip, there's a way to program them using a special tool and poking at the right pins.

Before you ask "but how does the memory chip know how to be programmed?" That functionality is likely baked right into the hardware itself using logic gates. This does present a problem with external memory chips for security reasons, as most of them are very simple and don't enforce any sort of permissions or whatnot as to who can reprogram them. For storage baked into the microcontroller itself, the microcontroller may have some rudimentary security functions to prevent a casual re-write of its program memory.