News Door slammed on last remaining easy Windows 11 local account setup workaround

[CmdrShepard]

Yes there are words "Sign in", and that is for an existing MS account in case you have already got one.
Below that is the "create account" link that you have to click in order to create a new MS account.

Yes, I clicked it and once it was created and I created a PIN I was automatically signed into the freshly installed Windows with that new MSA.

Clicking on a link in Settings app opened Microsoft Edge with onboarding process started in full screen without close and minimize button, with Alt+F4 disabled, and without ability to open a new tab. Text on the page indicated my account is being used to sync despite me choosing not to sync Edge earlier during setup.

I didn't get the chance to choose a different browser either or to download anything since once you open Edge either on purpose or by accident you are railroaded into onboarding process with user interface darkest possible patterns to present an illusion how this is mandatory for which majority of the users will fall hook, line, and sinker.

So unless you are an experienced user and unless you know how to kill a program from Task Manager and then download and install a different browser using just curl.exe from command line you won't be browsing or downloading anything using Microsoft Edge until you relent and go through that onboarding process.

Remember that just opening Microsoft Edge has created a browser profile linked to the MSA I used to finish Windows setup. Furthermore, declining sync again during onboarding in Edge after I already declined it during setup, and then going to Edge settings shows that sync is ON.

Creating this account is unavoidable. Creating a new account or using an existing one is a part of Windows 11 installation. There may be workarounds but they're not part of this. This is about installing Windows and using Windows with a MS account, and the sticky part is how the account is used and when exactly the user is signed into it.

The point of this article and this discussion we are having is that it wasn't this much unavoidable before -- turning off the network allowed you to skip both updates and MSA sign-in / creation by clicking I don't have internet button. Also the point is that it's going to become even more unavoidable for everyone except a chosen few who know their way around WIM image creation.

- you don't have to sign in except to use the features of a MS account

From what I have seen during setup today using latest May ISO image you aren't asked the first time if you want to or not, you need to do it at least once.

- you don't have to be signed in to your MS account in order to use Windows

Yes, but unless you know how to opt out you will keep using the MSA and then when you lose internet access you will also lose access to your PC like this guy:

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us...internet/bab176c4-577b-4e43-8aa1-9db57a2788bf

It's obvious for tech-savvy guys like you and me, but not for regular users (just try searching for ("can't login to windows 11 without internet" to see how many people got burned).

*truth is, using some services or parts of Windows will make signing in inevitable BUT it is opt-in.

No, it's opt-out. You are signed in the first time, then you can follow their guide to switch to local account and sign out of MSA.

Even though MS tries to trick people into opting in and giving consent, the option to opt-out is still there.

If it is there, then I haven't seen it. You will have to provide more details (like at which step you click what after creating an MSA to avoid signing in with it).

Show me, if you can, and if you want, some proof that at any point during MS installation, you are actually signed into your MS account if you chose skip, decline or not now to any of their options that require signing in, and if you declined to automatically sign into your MS account.

I already did, you have the screenshots and I told you what I clicked where. The only place I haven't clicked Skip for Now is when I was asked to verify the email. After that and after creating PIN I was signed in with MSA.

For example, contrary to your screenshot, i was never adressed by name. Only my chosen email adress was shown in places where a username normally would be. Also, it wasn't a microsoft email address fwiw.

I provided fake name and last name during MSA creation. If you didn't that may explain the difference.

The account is created and verified and that is the end of it. Unless you choose to sign in or allow Windows to sign you in automatically, you won't be signed in. You have to do it manually.

I haven't been asked to allow automatic sign-in, just to create a PIN.

I have never argued that Microsoft will not try their best to make people do this. You were never wrong about that, but you continue to not understand or not accept that despite MS BS and their tricks, using the required MS account is opt-in.

Again, show me how do you opt-in into it. Try a VM install from a freshly downloaded ISO image and tell me where I made a mistake. Make sure you are using latest ISO and consumer version of Windows 11 Pro, not business version.

Despite being so sure of yourself you fail to realize that at no point will you actually be signed in IF you don't wish to be signed in!

I did show you that I was signed in and I told you I didn't allow it because I wasn't asked. Now what? Can you allow that you are perhaps misremembering what's happening during setup or that there have been some changes since you last installed it?

...BUT after creating a new account you would still actually have to sign in to Microsoft. I know this because it asks for signing in.

What I am trying to tell you is -- no it doesn't, at least not in May Update of 23H2 Windows 11 consumer ISO which I used to test this and take those screenshots. If there was a "Do you want to sign in with your newly created MSA now?" do you honestly think I wouldn't include that screenshot, much less click allow or next instead of decline or skip for now?

You can continue defending them if you want but know one thing -- I am not some rabid anti-Microsoft hater and things I criticize them for are real, not imagined.

 

[USAFRet]

You can continue defending them if you want but know one thing -- I am not some rabid anti-Microsoft hater and things I criticize them for are real, not imagined.

After the install and initial setup with the MS account, did you try to create a Local user, and run with that user?
Local Admin and/or Standard.

 

[CmdrShepard]

After the install and initial setup with the MS account, did you try to create a Local user, and run with that user?
Local Admin and/or Standard.

As I said above -- yes you can switch to using local account (provided that you know how), but only after you have signed in once.

To be clear, nothing about this is a problem for me personally -- I know my way around Windows, I have customized hundreds of install images since Windows 7, know all about how it works under the hood. The problem is what they are doing to ordinary people who have no clue about this.

 

[USAFRet]

As I said above -- yes you can switch to using local account (provided that you know how), but only after you have signed in once.

To be clear, nothing about this is a problem for me personally -- I know my way around Windows, I have customized hundreds of install images since Windows 7, know all about how it works under the hood. The problem is what they are doing to ordinary people who have no clue about this.

And little here has actually changed.
It has been this way since Day 1 of Win 10.

Yes, they want you to use an MS account for daily ops.
And also yes, you can create Local accounts.
And you are still not forced to use the MS account for daily ops.

 

[CmdrShepard]

And little here has actually changed.
It has been this way since Day 1 of Win 10.

Yes, they want you to use an MS account for daily ops.
And also yes, you can create Local accounts.
And you are still not forced to use the MS account for daily ops.

Well the main change is the higher difficulty to get to create a local account.

I wonder if they are going also to add a truth detector to setup in 24H2... as it is now you can outright lie that you are setting it up for work or school and then click join domain instead which lets you create a local account without actually forcing you to follow through with domain joining. Seems hard to plug that particular hole.

Anyway, I personally never use vanilla images -- I always customize the crap out of them to remove and disable any and all consumer features and turn on all privacy and security by default. With all the rapid changes and additions of new baggage to the OS it is getting hard to stay on top of the game.

 

[open-standards-please]

When my current W10 machine reaches of end-of-support, I will be switching to Linux for my home desktop. I'm already fluent in Linux. I'm not a gamer. So I don't know why I'm waiting them to force me but there is no way in H I will login to something other than my endpoint to use it.

 

[kerberos_20]

so it seems local account still works through OOBE in 24H2
the trick is to be disconnected from internet (unplugged ethernet cable) and dont use personal account , it needs to be setup for work/school

https://imgur.com/6DsKztL

View: https://imgur.com/6DsKztL


dont enter anything, just pick "sign in options"

https://imgur.com/4WjsPjN

View: https://imgur.com/4WjsPjN


from options pick join domain

https://imgur.com/QEuc2lP

View: https://imgur.com/QEuc2lP


there just enter account name/password and three security questions

https://imgur.com/TlxqkgO

View: https://imgur.com/TlxqkgO

https://imgur.com/O5iPFRs

View: https://imgur.com/O5iPFRs

https://imgur.com/Qg2vwa2

View: https://imgur.com/Qg2vwa2


and thats it, OOBE continues, and local account gets created

 

[CmdrShepard]

and thats it, OOBE continues, and local account gets created

Well they can't really take that away yet without pissing a lot of domain admins off.

But once they deprecate on-prem AD and hybrid AAD, and I think it's just a matter of time before they manage to "entice" (read: blackmail) biggest corporate names into going full Azure, that will stop working too. Give it a year or two, and domain-join will require the PC to be online too.

 

[kerberos_20]

Well they can't really take that away yet without pissing a lot of domain admins off.

But once they deprecate on-prem AD and hybrid AAD, and I think it's just a matter of time before they manage to "entice" (read: blackmail) biggest corporate names into going full Azure, that will stop working too. Give it a year or two, and domain-join will require the PC to be online too.

thats very well possible, but there should be off shot enterprise edition for offline purposes if they go this route

 

[strongfinger]

i could stomach this for myself and all of my clients if it were not for the serious bug in local network shares.
using a live ms account really degrades the access across a local network. as in, up to 3 minutes to browse a single folder kind of degradation. i have tried the winver account caching but it doesn't recognize the account as valid. even the window patch meant for this issue doesn't work. fun fun fun...