Exploring Below Ambient Water Cooling

[4Ryan6]

10c is my own safety zone I have absolutely zero condensation at 10c water temperature.

That will not be the case for someone living in a more humid environment, that's why anyone using this cooling will need to experiment to discover their actual water temperature vs ambient condensation forming temperatures.

Where I live condensation begins to form at 8c water temperature as a frosty look, the lower below 8c the worse it gets, until at 5c water droplets are clearly forming.

So 10c water temperature keeps me well above any condensation problems at all.

While typing this the water temp has dropped to 11.6c.

 

[4745454b]

Right, dew point plays a big part in this.

Have you considered dropping the voltage to the TEC? Not only would you not have to worry about shutting off the second PSU, but it could save you $$$ as well. Not sure how you would get less voltage/power out of it however.

 

[4Ryan6]

Right, dew point plays a big part in this.

Have you considered dropping the voltage to the TEC? Not only would you not have to worry about shutting off the second PSU, but it could save you $$$ as well. Not sure how you would get less voltage/power out of it however.

I have considered that, and maybe in the future will.

If I drop the voltage I'm back to the drawing board retesting fan airflow, if I have to go back to that testing route I'd like to be doing it with a lower wattage, lower amperage draw peltier and just start over.

I'm kinda at a testing point right now of satisfaction, but forced satisfaction, because I have so many other things I have to get accomplished, I don't have any extra time for more experimentation right now, plus we're now entering the silly season anyway.

Where did this year Go?

I cannot believe we are 2 1/2 weeks away from Thanksgiving!

 

[Motopsychojdn]

Not long now indeed, things are flowing nicely here mate, busy at work, only two weeks more overtime to go 😛
it'll be nice to get my weekends back, I'm considering a trials (Motor)bike for the snow this year so checking out options, I love riding in the snow hehe 😛
Pc-wise I removed the chiller from the loop yesterday and will resume my efforts in the new year after the snow has gone,
its too easy to get low D in winter and think you are all set, then see it fall apart in summer, I'd rather have it at max performance in summer when needed and its easier to remove parts to lessen the cooling effect when necessary I reckon,
I may find an 8350 in time and give the 975 to my other half, see if I can't offload the 435's on ebay
Moto

 

[4Ryan6]

A trials bike is a sweet piece of hardware, literally perfectly balanced, and you'll be using that for riding in the snow?

I've seen guys use those like acrobats jumping from rock to rock on the side of hills and such, amazing what a professional can do with one of those, is it new or used?

Nice!

I'd love to have another bike I really miss riding sometimes, my last bike was a 1987 Honda Magna, the one labeled the Super Magna, shaft drive, it was a monster in a can when you turned it loose, I miss those days!

 

[Motopsychojdn]

I've a mate who does the 60's era trials and he's pretty good (fer an old fella 😛)
yup, the only purpose of it is to ride to work and back in the snow, because I don't want to ride my 83 750c Magna (U.S. spec) this winter
and yes, they still are monsters heheh, more than one ninja has seen my back end unexpectedly hehe

She's a bit modified but what would you expect from me? 😛

I had the numberplate made up, the bottom line reads, 'K64-03 Classification: Firefly'

The bikes named Serenity and yes, I'm a proud Browncoat 😛
Moto

 

[4Ryan6]

Now you're really making me miss my bike!

I had also modified mine and changed the exhaust system to a tuned 4 into 1 header, it increased the performance more than I had anticipated.

That V4 engine is what gave the Magna so much torque, it would eat a Harley for breakfast!

I was riding with a friend one day that had just bought a Honda Valkyrie 6 cylinders, 6 carbs, he was high performance this, and high performance that, yap,yap,yap, while we were eating breakfast one morning that we were out for a full days ride.

After a while I got sick of listening to it and told him to do himself a favor and don't try to outrun that Magna out there or you'll have to drop the high performance bragging, well that was like a slap in the face to him.

To make a long story short before the day was over, he had a whole new respect for the Magna, and his high performance bragging was over.

I truly have wished on more occasions than I can recount that I had not sold that motorcycle!

This was the Magna labeled the Super Magna, Honda only produced it for 2 years 1987 & 1988, IMO it was a work of art, mine was a 1987 Royal Blue, bought it brand new off the showroom floor, it was love at first sight, it had 77,000+ miles on it when I sold it.

 

[Motopsychojdn]

The Magna was the original performance cruiser hybrid, many have questioned why I pour thousands onto maintaining a bike thats thirty next year, when you see the horror on a sportsbike riders face as 'that junky old black thing' tears them apart at the traffic lights, its worth every penny 😛
And if you've ridden a Magna, you just know why
I've done five winters on her and I'm just feeling a little old (250KG is a lot to pick up when you don't have any grip underfoot lol)
although winters here aren't anywhere as fun as up home (Cumbria) you still have to respect the cold white stuff, so if I can find a suitably cheap enduro to run through winter I can also get some essential work done, forks chromed, I have a new to me exhaust and sump to fit, maybe have my valves checked/shimmed, all the jobs that take it off the road but I normally can't do because its my work transport hehe
I have a rule about working on my bikes, I start in the morning and it has to be roadworthy again by six so I can go to work on it, if its a bigger job then I'm miserable until she's flying again but some things, like the forks do take time thats out of my control.
Moto

 

[4Ryan6]

The Magna is definitely not snow riding friendly, you're making the right call getting an easier to handle bike on slippery slopes.

 

[Motopsychojdn]

I adjust my route in winter to avoid hills anyhow and stick to more populated roads (If I'm off, theres more chance of a passerby helping/calling an ambulance 😛)
the low centre of grav with the torque does handle snow well, its just that I'm feeeling kinda off this year and don't fancy dropping it or doing myself some damage
As I age, I seem to be developing some kind of sensibility gland hehe
I wouldn't mind dropping a bike designed for it and my mate who does the trials has a very well stocked workshop and about forty years of fabrication behind him so if I'm stuck myself, any fast repairs could be arranged through him except aluminium welding
Moto

 

[4Ryan6]

As I age, I seem to be developing some kind of sensibility gland hehe
Moto

How old are you?

 

[4Ryan6]

Have you considered dropping the voltage to the TEC? Not only would you not have to worry about shutting off the second PSU, but it could save you $$$ as well. Not sure how you would get less voltage/power out of it however.

Second response because I had left out something to share.

I can additionally control the gaming temperature drop by not running my AC in my office, the fan airflow to cold output results can additionally be affected by ambient room temperature.

If I allow the air cooler to draw in warmer air then that slows the temperature drop, because it's balanced for a 22c ambient room temperature, that probably makes no sense at all, but that's what actually happens.

I've only been forced to shutdown the second power supply a couple of times.

The AC in my office is not there for the peltier cooler, it is there because the sun tracks across my office window all day, and I have to run the AC in my office even in the winter, of course lately in South Carolina we haven't had much of a winter anyway, especially last year.

 

[Motopsychojdn]

How old are you?

37 in February 😛
Moto

 

[4Ryan6]

60 in December, you're only as old as you feel!

As far as myself, I'm still a kid at heart, I'm beginning to wonder if I'll ever grow up! :lol:

 

[Motopsychojdn]

I'm not going to grow up and you can't make me! 😛
You don't stop playing because you get old, you get old because you stop playing.
Moto

 

[4Ryan6]

Hey! Another Motoism!

 

[4Ryan6]

Reached a month and a half of running this setup now, and the entire time it's been 100% peltier loop use, so the 360 rad is just sitting there, so I'm considering cutting the 360 rad from the CPU water loop.

I'm not using it and it's just not needed at all as far as the CPU loop is concerned, my intentions are to add the 360 rad back to the GPU loop to aid the 240 and lower the GPU temps further.

Picture Refresh;

This is a good side view of the Peltier sandwich, the Thermalright TRUE is on a cold plate I made from aluminum bar stock, 2" x 5/16", cut square 2" x 2" sitting between the TRUE and the hot side of the Peltier.

The Swiftech Apogee XT rev2 water block is upside down contacting the cold side of the peltier, the return from the CPU is going through the TEC assembly before dumping into the Reservoir Cooler, picking up the cold from the peltier.

Here is a Larger View of that picture.

Details of assembly.

There's only 1 gallon of water in the cooler, don't ask me what that white is on the temperature sensing line, it must be camera flash?

The above is a full view of the tubing routing.

When I rework the 360 back into the GPU loop I'll post some new pictures of the RadTecBox.

Ryan

 

[Motopsychojdn]

How about a front-mounted fan on there to help keep the pump a little cooler too?
you have room and I'm sure you have a fan or two lying around from the roundup,
might not drop temps by more than a percentile of a degree but every little helps
Moto

 

[rubix_1011]

The D5 is very efficiently cooled; the waterflow within the pump cools the entire unit quite well. The back of mine doesn't even register as being warm to the touch and I'm betting Ry's TEC cooler is more than making up for the 15w of heat dump off the pump. I bet his pump is actually cool to the touch.

 

[Motopsychojdn]

Nice
just didn't want him sitting on laurels too long hehe
Moto

 

[4Ryan6]

Moto, The pumps temperature is 27c or 80f at the hottest part of the motor body, do you think that's too hot?

I never considered my pump could be overheating?

I could loop the tubing around it? I guess, and cool it too?

V
V
V
V
V
V
V
V

Spoiler

Jking ROFLMAO :lol:

Ry

 

[Motopsychojdn]

Just putting ideas out there hehe
Moto

 

[4Ryan6]

Just putting ideas out there hehe
Moto

Well don't stop I need the ideas and suggestions!

Whether I follow them or not? 😗 :lol:

But I do need them because some may lead to success, like it was someone else idea to pursue the peltier cooling in the first place, he even drew up some diagrams and pictures of his proposed project but as far as I know he never actually did it.

I took his initial idea and combined it with another tested experiment I found on the net, and came up with my present cooling solution, so without those initial ideas, I would not be using the cooling I am today.

If it's a viable idea, I will test it!

So keep em coming! Moto

Ry

 

[4Ryan6]

Proposed upgrade:

Continue running 2 pump loops except, using peltier cooling on each loop, each pump will receive it's water intake from the insulated cooler.

Loop 1 will be the existing CPU loop using the Swiftech MCP655 with it's return line to the cooler, cooled by the existing peltier cooling.

Loop 2 will be the dual GPU loop using a Laing D5 variable speed pump, (same as the Swiftech), with it's return line to the cooler, cooled by another peltier setup, (Details to come regarding heat sink and water block I'll be using).

Meaning the RadTecBox will no longer be running any radiators, it will be completely cooled by peltier cooling.

Note to all:

I am not after destroying radiator cooling, it is a viable cooling solution but is limited in it's cooling capabilities because of it's dependence on ambient room temperature no matter how many radiators you run. My experiments are an attempt to discover a below ambient cooling solution that is dependable, and can be comfortably run without condensation concerns. This cooling is not for everyone and should never be looked at as such, there is quite a lot of work in pulling this off in the first place, testing, experimenting, modding, insulating, defending your insanity, etc., etc., etc,. However I believe this cooling is worth experimenting with so I continue, at my own expense.

Another step in our discoveries, meaning all of you that are interested in what is possible using this type of cooling.

I'm hoping to have this fully functional before Christmas as some of what I'm getting is a December 13th birthday gift from my wife.

Don't you just love birthdays!

I haven't exactly decided how I'm going to incorporate all the new setup into the existing RadBox/Gutted Super Micro server case, but once I have it all figured out I'll try to remember to take detailed pictures of the modifications and try to explain why they were needed.

For those that celebrate it, Happy Thanksgiving!

For those that don't, I hope you have a wonderful day!

Ryan

 

[4Ryan6]

"Look Ma! No Rads!"

I'll have to start this with an apology, when you get used to all your pictures coming out good you take for granted there will be no duds, unfortunately that was not the case with these batch of pictures, some of the best descriptive pictures had to be discarded.

So without further adieu, the TecBox build.

GPU Loop peltier/water block/heat sink assembly.

GPU Peltier Cooler Mounted

View of GPU and CPU peltier coolers

Pumps mounted with output lines

Pumps with intake lines added