I just had an idea about wizard talents

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

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Because wizards have such a great amount of mana, the mana talents and
book caster talents are not important. However, to kill monsters that
shrug bolts, a good bow IS important. So, picking the missile talents
is better than picking the mana talents!

The shield and defensive talents also look like great picks. For the
late game (after clearing bugville before a final dive), the speed
talents could also be great.

Overall, I just don't see the point of the mana talents for wizards.
They should give a +% boost to mana instead of (3,6,9). After defence
tactics, the shield talents amount to about 10 DV, which is a LOT
better than 18 more mana, which is just about a single level's worth!
More missile damage is also very nice because wizards are often elven
and great at bows.

The mana and book cast talents just seem suited for mindcrafters
instead of wizards. Just something I now realized.
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

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(Is spoiler space needed for a non first post?)

Certain potions can give spells to mindcrafters, making book casts
possible. They would be late game picks anyway, after getting some of
these potions. I would pick missile talents first.

1.0 was a little easier. There were no talents, but the game was harder
in other ways. Apples and oranges.

And I thought my idea was good. I hadn't read it anywhere else.
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

Higher Game wrote:
> SPOILS
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> Because wizards have such a great amount of mana, the mana talents and
> book caster talents are not important. However, to kill monsters that
> shrug bolts, a good bow IS important. So, picking the missile talents
> is better than picking the mana talents!
>
> The shield and defensive talents also look like great picks. For the
> late game (after clearing bugville before a final dive), the speed
> talents could also be great.
>
> Overall, I just don't see the point of the mana talents for wizards.
> They should give a +% boost to mana instead of (3,6,9). After defence
> tactics, the shield talents amount to about 10 DV, which is a LOT
> better than 18 more mana, which is just about a single level's worth!
> More missile damage is also very nice because wizards are often elven
> and great at bows.

If you think this idea is revolutionary or something, think again. If
you don't like the mana talents, then don't take them.

This isn't a blog. We don't need you to document every little epiphany
you have. If you manage to win with a wizard that doesn't take wizard
talents, then say whatever you want about it in the VP to show everyone
what a good idea it turned out to be. Keep in mind that there were no
wizard talents, or any talents whatsoever, in previous versions of ADOM
and people won with wizards just fine. Not having the wizard talents is
no new idea; in 1.0.0 and earlier, there was no choice in the matter.

> The mana and book cast talents just seem suited for mindcrafters
> instead of wizards. Just something I now realized.

Mindcrafters can't learn spells in the first place. They're the worst
spellbook readers in the game. The book talents are a waste. They can't
even learn Light. They are an extremely bad choice for a casting class.

Just so you don't hope to get that intended mindcrafter by with magic.

--
Curry Bucket's Controversial Web Presence:
The Birthplace of Teenage Angst
http://chat.carleton.ca/~jsingh3/
or http://www.currybucket.cjb.net/
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

Higher Game wrote:
> .
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> (Is spoiler space needed for a non first post?)

YES, yes it is. And I don't know where your attributions and quotes are
ending up, but you'd better figure it out, because people *WILL* tire of
you, regardless of your excuses.

You also need more spoiler space.












> Certain potions can give spells to mindcrafters, making book casts
> possible. They would be late game picks anyway, after getting some of
> these potions.

I don't know how many potions and wands of wonder you're hoping to find
in a game, and I sure don't know how you expect to necessarily get
something useful out of each drink or zap. And I don't know how you
expect to find the appropriate books for the spells you get stuck with,
considering mindcrafters get very few of them.

A spellcasting mindcrafter is a pipe dream, unless you are a profoundly
talented player. Bluntly put, you don't qualify as anything close to a
profoundly talented player.

> 1.0 was a little easier. There were no talents, but the game was harder
> in other ways. Apples and oranges.

That's a subjective call.

> And I thought my idea was good. I hadn't read it anywhere else.

I didn't say it wasn't a good idea. I said it's no revolution in ADOM
gaming. That's exactly why you haven't read it anywhere.

--
Curry Bucket's Controversial Web Presence:
The Birthplace of Teenage Angst
http://chat.carleton.ca/~jsingh3/
or http://www.currybucket.cjb.net/
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

Josh Singh wrote:

>This isn't a blog. We don't need you to document
> every little epiphany you have.

Wow, somebody needs to switch to decaf.

>From the FAQ, question numero uno:

"All things pertaining to ADOM are acceptable here,
including requests for help locating and playing the
game, announcements of new versions of the game,
and so forth."

I think discussion of strategy and technique is very
much on-topic.

Cheers --
-- Quothz
quothz@yahoo.com
Making little vegetables out of big vegetables since 2002.
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

Malte wrote:

> I think Josh was more annoyed by the general tone
> and lack of netiquette of those posts.

I'm not sure how a plural snuck in; the post looks
fine to me. Got spoiler space, an appropriate
topic, and it's in the correct newsgroup. From here
it looks like -Josh- can't tell netiquette from a napkin -
his tone in this thread seems a bit over the top. If his
problem is with the poster, rather than the post, well,
that's why Kibo gave us killfiles.

Cheers --
-- Quothz
quothz@yahoo.com
Making little vegetables from big vegetables since 2002.
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

Higher Game wrote:

> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> (Is spoiler space needed for a non first post?)

Yes. People who want to avoid spoilers do not necessarily skip over a
whole thread just because the initial post contained spoilers. Besides,
posts often arrive out of sequence, so this post might arrive before
your first post.

Malte
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

Quothz wrote:

> Josh Singh wrote:
>
>
>>This isn't a blog. We don't need you to document
>>every little epiphany you have.
>
> Wow, somebody needs to switch to decaf.
>
>>From the FAQ, question numero uno:
>
> "All things pertaining to ADOM are acceptable here,
> including requests for help locating and playing the
> game, announcements of new versions of the game,
> and so forth."
>
> I think discussion of strategy and technique is very
> much on-topic.

I think Josh was more annoyed by the general tone and lack of netiquette
of those posts. The posts are certainly on-topic, but some attention to
the posting style would be well advised.

Malte
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

The last two undead greater vaults I encountered had more than 1
emperor lich (in 1.1.1).
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

Quothz wrote:
> Malte wrote:
>
>
>>I think Josh was more annoyed by the general tone
>>and lack of netiquette of those posts.
>
>
> I'm not sure how a plural snuck in; the post looks
> fine to me. Got spoiler space, an appropriate
> topic, and it's in the correct newsgroup. From here
> it looks like -Josh- can't tell netiquette from a napkin -
> his tone in this thread seems a bit over the top. If his
> problem is with the poster, rather than the post, well,
> that's why Kibo gave us killfiles.

Survey the regulars and old hands in the group and see which ones can't
stand me. In fact, find a few who haven't enjoyed having my off-colour
sentiments thrown in now and then over the past 2 years, just keeping
things interesting.

And, believe me, if John Rowat were around, I'd stand down and let him
handle all this. He has a way with words that sets fools aflame. He's
not around, so somebody has to do the dirty work. I'm not nearly as
skilful, but what the hell.

Besides, Malte's right. I was already well-biased against Higher Game
when I got to this thread. If I wasn't, I probably wouldn't have said
anything here.

--
Curry Bucket's Controversial Web Presence:
The Birthplace of Teenage Angst
http://chat.carleton.ca/~jsingh3/
or http://www.currybucket.cjb.net/
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

Rob F wrote:
> The last two undead greater vaults I encountered had more than 1
> emperor lich (in 1.1.1).

I think there are greater vaults with several "boss" monsters, I think.
By "more than 1", do you mean a few or more than a dozen (like in the
olden days)?

Malte
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

"Higher Game" <sidneyg83@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:1107665721.587957.309190@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com:

> SPOILS
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> Because wizards have such a great amount of mana, the mana talents and
> book caster talents are not important. However, to kill monsters that
> shrug bolts, a good bow IS important. So, picking the missile talents
> is better than picking the mana talents!
>
> The shield and defensive talents also look like great picks. For the
> late game (after clearing bugville before a final dive), the speed
> talents could also be great.
>
> Overall, I just don't see the point of the mana talents for wizards.
> They should give a +% boost to mana instead of (3,6,9). After defence
> tactics, the shield talents amount to about 10 DV, which is a LOT
> better than 18 more mana, which is just about a single level's worth!
> More missile damage is also very nice because wizards are often elven
> and great at bows.
>
> The mana and book cast talents just seem suited for mindcrafters
> instead of wizards. Just something I now realized.
>

I'd like to note that the Book Caster talents might be better for Wizards
than they appear at first glance. While most of the time I have plenty
of castings for any spell I want, there are some rarer books, such as
Teleportation, Invisibility, Mystic Shovel, Identify, Remove Curse, etc
where the amount I might want to use them greatly exceeds the number of
castings that I might find for them. In that cast, being able to Book
Caster properly comes in handy.

Also, when you encounter monsters that shrug off bolts, you might
consider a few other approaches before wasting slaying ammo. For
instance, Burning Hands is powerful enough to be almost broken, and I use
it extensively (one of the things that makes the ToEF hardest for my
Wizards is that it doesn't work there!). Later on, work with ball
spells, which also cannot be shrugged off.

If I recall correctly, shrugging off is also a function of skill level.
Thus it is often better to specialize in a few attack spells before
branching out. Besides the aforementioned Burning Hands, I'd really
reccomend using Magic Missile as much as possible throughout the game --
monsters won't resist it generally, and it doesn't destroy objects on the
ground. Be careful about bouncing bolts though! I've lost many
excellent characters to just that, and it is so depressing when it
happens.

Brian
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

Netbrian wrote:
> "Higher Game" <sidneyg83@yahoo.com> wrote in
> news:1107665721.587957.309190@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com:
>
> > SPOILS
> > .
> > .
> > .
> > .
> > .
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> > .
> > .
> > .
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> > .
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> > .
> > .
> > .
> > .
> > .
> > .
> > .
> > .
> > .
> > .
> > .
> > .
> > Because wizards have such a great amount of mana, the mana talents
and
> > book caster talents are not important. However, to kill monsters
that
> > shrug bolts, a good bow IS important. So, picking the missile
talents
> > is better than picking the mana talents!
> >
> > The shield and defensive talents also look like great picks. For
the
> > late game (after clearing bugville before a final dive), the speed
> > talents could also be great.
> >
> > Overall, I just don't see the point of the mana talents for
wizards.
> > They should give a +% boost to mana instead of (3,6,9). After
defence
> > tactics, the shield talents amount to about 10 DV, which is a LOT
> > better than 18 more mana, which is just about a single level's
worth!
> > More missile damage is also very nice because wizards are often
elven
> > and great at bows.
> >
> > The mana and book cast talents just seem suited for mindcrafters
> > instead of wizards. Just something I now realized.
> >
>
> I'd like to note that the Book Caster talents might be better for
Wizards
> than they appear at first glance. While most of the time I have
plenty
> of castings for any spell I want, there are some rarer books, such as

> Teleportation, Invisibility, Mystic Shovel, Identify, Remove Curse,
etc
> where the amount I might want to use them greatly exceeds the number
of
> castings that I might find for them. In that cast, being able to
Book
> Caster properly comes in handy.
>
> Also, when you encounter monsters that shrug off bolts, you might
> consider a few other approaches before wasting slaying ammo. For
> instance, Burning Hands is powerful enough to be almost broken, and I
use
> it extensively (one of the things that makes the ToEF hardest for my
> Wizards is that it doesn't work there!). Later on, work with ball
> spells, which also cannot be shrugged off.
>
> If I recall correctly, shrugging off is also a function of skill
level.
> Thus it is often better to specialize in a few attack spells before
> branching out. Besides the aforementioned Burning Hands, I'd really
> reccomend using Magic Missile as much as possible throughout the game
--
> monsters won't resist it generally, and it doesn't destroy objects on
the
> ground. Be careful about bouncing bolts though! I've lost many
> excellent characters to just that, and it is so depressing when it
> happens.
>
> Brian
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I find I have plenty of mana for book casting teleportation when it's
necessary (D30 or deeper when I want to save time.) Invisibility is
rarely needed and not too expensive anyway. Mystic shovel isn't needed
much either, and there are always wands of digging. Scrolls of identify
are common, too.

I just now realized that the sword of Nonnak gives resistance to death
rays, and I had it in my inventory, only thinking of the willpower
boost when I got to 43 and needed 5 more. I'll have my next wizard use
swords just to use this weapon. Death ray resistance on a weapon is
very nice.
 
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