Question i9 and low frequency on idle ?

[diango]

Is that ok?
On image 1101.03 MHz Sometimes even 800 Mhz.
I believe it's connected with turbo frequency adjust, but I wonder what do you recommend guys?
I have concerns that it needs time to boost and maybe better if it runs always even at idle at min. 3-4Ghz?
What do you think?

 

[helpstar]

nope, @Idle it´s saving you money and lifetime of the components. Just let it do its thing, or the system will be always heated up and eventually the turbo won´t be that fast while you need it @ higher frequency, you won´t feel the switch from 800MHz to max. frequency at all

 

[uWebb429]

Is that ok?

Not really.

When the C states are enabled in the BIOS, any Intel Core i CPU will save power by entering one of the low power C states when they are idle. Slowing a CPU down when it is lightly loaded might have been necessary 20 years ago but it is not necessary today, especially with a desktop computer.

Switch to the Windows High Performance power plan if you want your CPU to run at full speed when it is lightly loaded.

Here is a good example. A 10 core CPU with all cores running at 5000 MHz Power consumption is minimal and the idle temperature of all cores is less than 30°C

I have concerns that it needs time to boost

Your concerns are real. A slow CPU increases latency. A fast CPU decreases latency. You paid for a fast CPU. Do not be afraid to use the performance you paid for.

 

[diango]

Switch to the Windows High Performance power plan if you want your CPU to run at full speed when it is lightly loaded.

Problem is that if I do it I have ...lower performance than on balanced 😉

 

[diango]

Annoying issue with Windows Power Plans options
Anyone experienced that with I9?
Happens in multi core only
- no temperature problem (max 65 celsuius)
- no power problem (enough for sure, no throttling)

I have tried all bios settings (b760), getting crazy with that.

 

[uWebb429]

I have ...lower performance than on balanced

Do some testing and find out why you have lower performance. Is the CPU thermal throttling or power limit throttling? What tests are showing lower performance?

 

[helpstar]

how do you recognize the lower power?
benchmark or game or feeling?

 

[diango]

how do you recognize the lower power?
benchmark or game or feeling?

Winrar 40% slower, when I switch to Balanced it goes fully ok over 50MB/s (on performance 34MB/s)

 

[diango]

Winrar 7.03 beta(ver does not matter any 6.x or 7.x same issue), look what a nonsense, power plan utilizes less cores.
PL2 is ok, I set to about 150 for reason(anyway with 200 no changes)
Looks like crappy P/E cores management in either BIOS/MB or Intel Processor.
In single core benchmarks of course performance mode is 5% better.


Power Plan (over 50% slower)
DATE TIME MULTI C0% CKMOD BAT_mW TEMP VID POWER
2025-02-12 14:32:15 53.65 6.5 100.0 0 57 1.3110 50.2 PL2
2025-02-12 14:32:16 53.89 40.4 100.0 0 57 1.4709 143.8
2025-02-12 14:32:17 55.65 31.9 100.0 0 61 1.4086 140.0
2025-02-12 14:32:18 54.36 38.7 100.0 0 59 1.3114 144.9 PL2
2025-02-12 14:32:19 54.34 37.7 100.0 0 59 1.2836 145.2 PL2
2025-02-12 14:32:20 54.99 35.1 100.0 0 57 1.2505 144.4 PL2
2025-02-12 14:32:21 52.51 21.2 100.0 0 41 1.4072 84.1
2025-02-12 14:32:22 40.16 0.4 100.0 0 39 1.4128 17.3
2025-02-12 14:32:23 46.47 0.6 100.0 0 55 1.4260 26.7
2025-02-12 14:32:24 49.80 0.8 100.0 0 38 1.4128 19.7



Balanced Power Plan (very good correct WinRar result)
2025-02-12 14:32:30 46.12 34.8 100.0 0 54 1.3748 83.9 EDP
2025-02-12 14:32:31 49.86 75.8 100.0 0 55 1.1912 146.4 PL2
2025-02-12 14:32:32 49.75 75.2 100.0 0 56 1.1912 145.6 PL2
2025-02-12 14:32:33 49.76 75.8 100.0 0 57 1.1815 146.5 PL2
2025-02-12 14:32:34 49.80 75.8 100.0 0 56 1.1987 146.8 PL2
2025-02-12 14:32:35 49.91 75.1 100.0 0 74 1.4473 146.1 EDP
2025-02-12 14:32:36 50.09 67.2 100.0 0 64 1.4530 137.3
2025-02-12 14:32:37 49.81 75.8 100.0 0 56 1.1909 146.4 PL2
2025-02-12 14:32:38 49.82 75.3 100.0 0 68 1.4307 146.0 PL2
2025-02-12 14:32:39 49.92 72.3 100.0 0 51 1.4734 143.3
2025-02-12 14:32:40 17.86 2.3 100.0 0 40 0.7327 16.0
2025-02-12 14:32:41 15.06 2.1 100.0 0 40 0.7347 12.8
2025-02-12 14:32:42 11.39 1.6 100.0 0 40 0.7352 12.1
2025-02-12 14:32:43 16.65 2.4 100.0 0 39 0.7352 13.6

 

[uWebb429]

Looks like crappy P/E cores management

That is exactly what it is.

The ThrottleStop TS Bench test has the exact same problem. This test creates up to 20 threads that need to be processed. The test itself does not specifically ask for a P core or an E core. If these threads randomly end up on the P cores, performance will be significantly better compared to if many of these tasks end up on the E cores.

Who is to blame? I am not sure if this is a Windows 11 issue or if Intel Thread Director is guilty of poor P and E core management.

https://www.intel.com/content/www/u...0097053/processors/intel-core-processors.html

I think tasks are being treated as if they were background tasks and they are being scheduled on an E core even when a P core is available.

You might want to look into the Process Lasso program.

https://bitsum.com/

I have not used this program. In theory it should give you better control of where tasks end up running.

 

[uWebb429]

I wonder if Windows 10 have same issue..

Windows 10 would likely be worse. It does not differentiate the P cores from the E cores. It just treats them all the same.

Ultra 9 Processor 285K

I have not tested one of these. It is likely that it would have the exact same issues. The 14th Gen CPUs are organized so all of the P cores come first and all of the E cores come after that. Intel noticed that this caused hot spots so the 285K is physically organized quite differently.

https://www.pcgamesn.com/intel/core-ultra-9-285K-arrow-lake-die-shots

No idea if this could be a problem for any older software that is not optimized for this setup or is optimized for how the 12th to 14th Gen CPUs were laid out.

 

[diango]

@uWebb429
ps. folks says that the latest updates to Windows 10 make also good management as 11,
but I'm not so sure Windows 10<>Windows 11 in many areas...

 

[diango]

Windows 10 would likely be worse. It does not differentiate the P cores from the E cores. It just treats them all the same.


I have not tested one of these. It is likely that it would have the exact same issues. The 14th Gen CPUs are organized so all of the P cores come first and all of the E cores come after that. Intel noticed that this caused hot spots so the 285K is physically organized quite differently.

https://www.pcgamesn.com/intel/core-ultra-9-285K-arrow-lake-die-shots

No idea if this could be a problem for any older software that is not optimized for this setup or is optimized for how the 12th to 14th Gen CPUs were laid out.

Are you 100% sure that's mobo 100% independent? What is your MB Chipset?

 

[uWebb429]

folks says that the latest updates to Windows 10 make also good management as 11

Microsoft has deliberately not updated Windows 10 to properly manage Intel 12th Gen and newer CPUs that have both P and E cores. Why would they update Windows 10 now? Microsoft would rather have all users update to Windows 11. This would allow them to stop wasting time and money updating Windows 10.

I do not know how to solve the problem you are having with WinRAR.

 

[diango]

That is not answer to my question (mainboard and chipset)

 

[uWebb429]

mainboard and chipset

I do not see how a different mainboard or chipset is going to change how Windows or the Intel Thread Director software assigns tasks to P or E cores.

Here is the motherboard and chipset for my MSI Vector 17 laptop. It has a 14900HX with P and E cores.

https://imgur.com/HZfV8j8

View: https://i.imgur.com/HZfV8j8.png