IBM's PC business up for sale

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.intel,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

On Tue, 07 Dec 2004 17:31:59 -0500, George Macdonald
<fammacd=!SPAM^nothanks@tellurian.com> wrote:

>>Anyone have any experience with
>>Fujitsu notebooks in general or the S2020 in particular?
>
>It may not matter if you never travel out of your country with it but one
>thing I've noticed is that Fujitsu has completely different line-ups in
>different places - e.g. in Europe they market as Fujitsu-Siemens... with
>models we don't see in the U.S. Emergency repairs out of country *could*
>be impossible.

I seldom travel for business and never outside the U.S., so
international support isn't an issue. But warranty service is an
issue. I've had good luck with warranty repairs from IBM; typically
with 2 day turn-around. I have no idea what Fujitsu's repair service
is like. I also wonder about the availability of parts such as
batteries.

>I also didn't like their demarcation between Home/SOHO models which could
>only be found with WinXP Home and business models with WinXP Pro; a couple
>of the former I'd have liked to see with a Pro version - made no sense to
>me.

They seem to have quite a profileration of models for no apparent
reason. The models I looked at all offered either Home or Pro (as an
extra cost option), but I didn't look at any "desktop replacement" or
"multimedia" machines.

>At one time Toshiba used to make notebooks with cases about as well
>designed as IBM Thinkpads but the ones I've seen recently just didn't cut
>it for me.

That was my impression as well, but that was in comparison to what I
could get in a ThinkPad.

> I've been wondering more about Asus and MSI who both make
>excellent mbrds but it's difficult to lay your hands on one to check it
>out.

I've never seen one in person.

What I *really* want is a thin and light notebook with a simple,
sturdy plain monochrome case. No silvery-plastic multimedia buttons
and no curvy plastic case with a glow-in-the-dark product badge. No
pre-loaded AOL, no try-it-for-30-days-and-buy-it-software, no
pre-loaded MS Works and MS Money. In other words, a ThinkPad.

IBM discontinued my favorite buckling spring keyboard. And they
discontinued my favorite operating system (OS/2). Now they are going
to discontinue the notebook computer that I've relied on for years.
This is beginning to affect my brand loyalty.
- -
Gary L.
Reply to the newsgroup only

 

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.intel,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

On Tue, 07 Dec 2004 23:27:13 GMT, Gary L. <nospam@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

>On Tue, 07 Dec 2004 17:31:59 -0500, George Macdonald
><fammacd=!SPAM^nothanks@tellurian.com> wrote:

>>At one time Toshiba used to make notebooks with cases about as well
>>designed as IBM Thinkpads but the ones I've seen recently just didn't cut
>>it for me.
>
>That was my impression as well, but that was in comparison to what I
>could get in a ThinkPad.

Well yes, the shiny, black, flexy plastic case I saw in a Toshiba recently
shocked me compared with what they used to do a few years ago - it didn't
look like a serious business "road-warrior" machine at all.

>> I've been wondering more about Asus and MSI who both make
>>excellent mbrds but it's difficult to lay your hands on one to check it
>>out.
>
>I've never seen one in person.
>
>What I *really* want is a thin and light notebook with a simple,
>sturdy plain monochrome case. No silvery-plastic multimedia buttons
>and no curvy plastic case with a glow-in-the-dark product badge. No
>pre-loaded AOL, no try-it-for-30-days-and-buy-it-software, no
>pre-loaded MS Works and MS Money. In other words, a ThinkPad.

I'll bet you can live without the blinking blue lights as well.🙂 What
the hell is HP thinking?

>IBM discontinued my favorite buckling spring keyboard. And they
>discontinued my favorite operating system (OS/2). Now they are going
>to discontinue the notebook computer that I've relied on for years.
>This is beginning to affect my brand loyalty.

It's difficult to sort out what the final outcome will be. Keith seems to
suggest that IBM would not easily give up the Thinkpad brand name and that
makes sense to me. Whoever makes them and under what arrangements, if the
systems are still available at the same quality level and under similar
terms, which still seems a possibility, this may all be just a storm in a
teacup.

Rgds, George Macdonald

"Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who, me??

 

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.intel,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

In article <O9qtd.38009$bP2.21752@newssvr12.news.prodigy.com>,
redelm@ev1.net.invalid says...
> In comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:
> > FWIG, this isn't in the cards. The reports were apparently
> > a tad premature. *YOY* would IBM give up their name?
> > Why would anyone buy the line without it?
>
> Two excellent questions. I can see some fit (IBM design expertise
> matched with Lenovo mfg cost advantage) but the marketing side
> is scarey as always. Lexmark may be the pattern.

Lexmark was a management buyout. This one is more complicated. The
official word (email from the top dog) is that IBM gets an stake (~20%)
in Lenovo and $650M in cash. Lenovo gets the PC division, "Think"
brand, and $500M in liabilities. Someone around here said Lenovo
would use the "IBM" logo for five years, but I don't see that anywhere
in the official stuff. Apparently the two will market each other's
products.

> Perhaps the Chinese only want the skills? Does White
> Plains have any qualms selling lifers down the river?

C/White Plains/Armonk, and are you kidding?! In this case 10,000
employees (Something like 2500 in the US and ~4000 in China) went with
the deal.

http://www-1.ibm.com/press/PressServletForm.wss?
TemplateName=ShowPressReleaseTemplate&SelectString=t1.docunid=7450

--
Keith

 

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.intel,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

On Mon, 06 Dec 2004 20:20:05 -0500, keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:
>FWIG, this isn't in the cards. The reports were apparently a tad
>premature. *YOY* would IBM give up their name? Why would anyone buy the
>line without it?

Well, it's official now, Lenovo has purchased IBM's PC line:

http://www-1.ibm.com/press/PressServletForm.wss?TemplateName=ShowPressReleaseTemplate&SelectString=t1.docunid=7450


Looks like Lenovo will get not only the Thinkpad brand name, but also
the "IBM PC" brand name, at least for 5 years.

I wonder if this deal will see the old IBM desktop systems back in the
North American market? Maybe we'll get a new competitor to the
Dell/HPaq duo that are really the only choice for commercial-grade PCs
these days? It does jump Lenovo from the #9 PC seller in the world up
to the #3 spot, just behind Dell and HPaq but ahead of
Gateway/eMachines.

Anyway, I suppose it's too early to make too many guesses as to just
what will come of this all, but I just hope that the deal goes better
than the HP/Compaq merger.

-------------
Tony Hill
hilla <underscore> 20 <at> yahoo <dot> ca

 

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.intel,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

In article <085dr0dvd2keloll8jhr15fvdk7j1ajgdd@4ax.com>, hilla_nospam_
20@yahoo.ca says...
> On Mon, 06 Dec 2004 20:20:05 -0500, keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:
> >FWIG, this isn't in the cards. The reports were apparently a tad
> >premature. *YOY* would IBM give up their name? Why would anyone buy the
> >line without it?
>
> Well, it's official now, Lenovo has purchased IBM's PC line:
>
> http://www-1.ibm.com/press/PressServletForm.wss?TemplateName=ShowPressReleaseTemplate&SelectString=t1.docunid=7450

Old news. I posted that link four hours ago in this thread. ;-)

> Looks like Lenovo will get not only the Thinkpad brand name, but also
> the "IBM PC" brand name, at least for 5 years.
>
> I wonder if this deal will see the old IBM desktop systems back in the
> North American market? Maybe we'll get a new competitor to the
> Dell/HPaq duo that are really the only choice for commercial-grade PCs
> these days?

IBM has the ThinkCentres and IntelliStations, which are "commercial
grade" systems. Note the IntelliStation line is not part of this deal
(nor is the XServer).

> It does jump Lenovo from the #9 PC seller in the world up
> to the #3 spot, just behind Dell and HPaq but ahead of
> Gateway/eMachines.

Yep! Lenovo took the number three slot away form, Ta-Da... IBM! ;-)

> Anyway, I suppose it's too early to make too many guesses as to just
> what will come of this all, but I just hope that the deal goes better
> than the HP/Compaq merger.

Could it go worse? If people printed only in red ink, would HP show any
black ink. ;-)

--
Keith

 

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.intel,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

In comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips Keith R. Williams <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:
> Lexmark was a management buyout. This one is more complicated.

Good point.

> C/White Plains/Armonk, and are you kidding?! In this case
> 10,000 employees (Something like 2500 in the US and ~4000
> in China) went with the deal.

My deep condolences to all those sold down the river.

-- Robert

 

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.intel,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

On Wed, 8 Dec 2004 09:00:58 -0500, Keith R. Williams <krw@att.bizzzz>
wrote:


>Lexmark was a management buyout. This one is more complicated. The
>official word (email from the top dog) is that IBM gets an stake (~20%)
>in Lenovo and $650M in cash. Lenovo gets the PC division, "Think"
>brand, and $500M in liabilities. Someone around here said Lenovo
>would use the "IBM" logo for five years, but I don't see that anywhere
>in the official stuff. Apparently the two will market each other's
>products.

The NY Times article states that:

"Under Lenovo's ownership, the I.B.M. personal computer business will
continue to be based in the United States and run by its current
management team. I.B.M. will take a stake of 18.9 percent in Lenovo,
which is based in Beijing but plans to have headquarters in New York."

"Besides management expertise, Lenovo would be acquiring five-year
brand-licensing rights to a computer business best known for its
I.B.M. Thinkpad notebooks, its sleek black desktops and the product
line's distinctive tricolor I.B.M. logo."

- -
Gary L.
Reply to the newsgroup only

 

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.intel,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

On Tue, 07 Dec 2004 19:27:19 -0500, George Macdonald
<fammacd=!SPAM^nothanks@tellurian.com> wrote:

>>What I *really* want is a thin and light notebook with a simple,
>>sturdy plain monochrome case. No silvery-plastic multimedia buttons
>>and no curvy plastic case with a glow-in-the-dark product badge. No
>>pre-loaded AOL, no try-it-for-30-days-and-buy-it-software, no
>>pre-loaded MS Works and MS Money. In other words, a ThinkPad.
>
>I'll bet you can live without the blinking blue lights as well.🙂 What
>the hell is HP thinking?

It seems that the intended market for computer systems these days is
15 year old kids who want glowing alien faces on the front of their
systems. Maybe I'm getting old, but I really don't want to buy a
system that looks like a cheesy Halloween costume.

>It's difficult to sort out what the final outcome will be. Keith seems to
>suggest that IBM would not easily give up the Thinkpad brand name and that
>makes sense to me. Whoever makes them and under what arrangements, if the
>systems are still available at the same quality level and under similar
>terms, which still seems a possibility, this may all be just a storm in a
>teacup.

Now that the official announcement has been make, it appears that
Lenovo may retain some link to the existing ThinkPad line, at least
for a few years. There is a possibility that the ThinkPad line could
prosper once it is liberated from IBM central command. Stranger things
have happened. So I will wait and see what grows from this seed that
was planted today.
- -
Gary L.
Reply to the newsgroup only

 

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On Wed, 08 Dec 2004 17:12:05 GMT, Gary L. <nospam@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

>On Tue, 07 Dec 2004 19:27:19 -0500, George Macdonald
><fammacd=!SPAM^nothanks@tellurian.com> wrote:
>
>>>What I *really* want is a thin and light notebook with a simple,
>>>sturdy plain monochrome case. No silvery-plastic multimedia buttons
>>>and no curvy plastic case with a glow-in-the-dark product badge. No
>>>pre-loaded AOL, no try-it-for-30-days-and-buy-it-software, no
>>>pre-loaded MS Works and MS Money. In other words, a ThinkPad.
>>
>>I'll bet you can live without the blinking blue lights as well.🙂 What
>>the hell is HP thinking?
>
>It seems that the intended market for computer systems these days is
>15 year old kids who want glowing alien faces on the front of their
>systems. Maybe I'm getting old, but I really don't want to buy a
>system that looks like a cheesy Halloween costume.

Cheesy is still cheesy, even if you're 15, 21 or whatever.🙂 I just want
them to keep the serious user in mind when they decide to embrace tacky -
IOW keep it separate.

>>It's difficult to sort out what the final outcome will be. Keith seems to
>>suggest that IBM would not easily give up the Thinkpad brand name and that
>>makes sense to me. Whoever makes them and under what arrangements, if the
>>systems are still available at the same quality level and under similar
>>terms, which still seems a possibility, this may all be just a storm in a
>>teacup.
>
>Now that the official announcement has been make, it appears that
>Lenovo may retain some link to the existing ThinkPad line, at least
>for a few years. There is a possibility that the ThinkPad line could
>prosper once it is liberated from IBM central command. Stranger things
>have happened. So I will wait and see what grows from this seed that
>was planted today.

After the info has been filtered through the usual bunch of brain damaged
analysts and inept reporters, it's kinda difficult to fathom what the
bottom line really is. If "Thinkpad" has been transferred to Lenovo, I'm
surprised. We'll see how the deal evolves, I guess.

Rgds, George Macdonald

"Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who, me??

 

[keith]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.intel,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

On Tue, 07 Dec 2004 19:27:19 -0500, George Macdonald wrote:

> Keith seems to
> suggest that IBM would not easily give up the Thinkpad brand name and that
> makes sense to me.

Actually, I was referring more specifically to the *IBM* brand, rather
than the "Think..." brand. According to the information we have now
they've licensed this for five years, which isn't a first either. GE
licnesed their name/logo to B&D (IIRC) for small appliances under sorta
the same circumstances.

--
Keith

 

[keith]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.intel,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

On Wed, 08 Dec 2004 14:41:58 +0000, Robert Redelmeier wrote:

> In comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips Keith R. Williams <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:
>> Lexmark was a management buyout. This one is more complicated.
>
> Good point.
>
>> C/White Plains/Armonk, and are you kidding?! In this case
>> 10,000 employees (Something like 2500 in the US and ~4000
>> in China) went with the deal.
>
> My deep condolences to all those sold down the river.

THis isn't the first time, nor will it be the last. Worse things have
happened, though perhaps my view is somewhat colored becase I'm past my
sell-by date. ;-)

--
Keith

 

[keith]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.intel,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

On Wed, 08 Dec 2004 14:22:05 -0500, Keith R. Williams wrote:

> In article <085dr0dvd2keloll8jhr15fvdk7j1ajgdd@4ax.com>, hilla_nospam_
> 20@yahoo.ca says...
>> On Mon, 06 Dec 2004 20:20:05 -0500, keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:
>> >FWIG, this isn't in the cards. The reports were apparently a tad
>> >premature. *YOY* would IBM give up their name? Why would anyone buy the
>> >line without it?
>>
>> Well, it's official now, Lenovo has purchased IBM's PC line:
>>
>> http://www-1.ibm.com/press/PressServletForm.wss?TemplateName=ShowPressReleaseTemplate&SelectString=t1.docunid=7450
>
> Old news. I posted that link four hours ago in this thread. ;-)
>
>> Looks like Lenovo will get not only the Thinkpad brand name, but also
>> the "IBM PC" brand name, at least for 5 years.
>>
>> I wonder if this deal will see the old IBM desktop systems back in the
>> North American market? Maybe we'll get a new competitor to the
>> Dell/HPaq duo that are really the only choice for commercial-grade PCs
>> these days?
>
> IBM has the ThinkCentres and IntelliStations, which are "commercial
> grade" systems. Note the IntelliStation line is not part of this deal
> (nor is the XServer).
>
>> It does jump Lenovo from the #9 PC seller in the world up
>> to the #3 spot, just behind Dell and HPaq but ahead of
>> Gateway/eMachines.
>
> Yep! Lenovo took the number three slot away form, Ta-Da... IBM! ;-)
>
>> Anyway, I suppose it's too early to make too many guesses as to just
>> what will come of this all, but I just hope that the deal goes better
>> than the HP/Compaq merger.
>
> Could it go worse? If people printed only in red ink, would HP show any
> black ink. ;-)

Just to follow up on this last slam... I read later today that according
to Carly, HP's printer revenue is 30% of HP's total, but accounts for 80%
of its profit! Ink is expensive.

--
KEith

 

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On Wed, 08 Dec 2004 18:57:51 -0500, George Macdonald
<fammacd=!SPAM^nothanks@tellurian.com> wrote:

>After the info has been filtered through the usual bunch of brain damaged
>analysts and inept reporters, it's kinda difficult to fathom what the
>bottom line really is. If "Thinkpad" has been transferred to Lenovo, I'm
>surprised. We'll see how the deal evolves, I guess.

The official press release from IBM is here:

http://www-1.ibm.com/press/PressServletForm.wss?TemplateName=ShowPressReleaseTemplate&SelectString=t1.docunid=7450

The IBM brands including "IBM ThinkPad" have been licensed to Lenovo,
for at least an initial period of 5 years. The existing operations,
including the management in Armonk, the design facilities in Raleigh
and Japan, and the manufacturing facility in China, will continue to
operate in place as before; it's just that 80% of the ownership is
transferred to Lenovo. They also claim a "minimal" impact on
employment. Time will tell, and we'll see if they can handle more
gracefully than HP-Compaq. It could have been much worse.

Also see:

http://www.pc.ibm.com/ww/announcement.html

- -
Gary L.
Reply to the newsgroup only

 

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On Wed, 08 Dec 2004 23:34:34 -0500, keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:

>On Wed, 08 Dec 2004 14:22:05 -0500, Keith R. Williams wrote:
>
>> In article <085dr0dvd2keloll8jhr15fvdk7j1ajgdd@4ax.com>, hilla_nospam_
>> 20@yahoo.ca says...

<<snip>>

>>> Anyway, I suppose it's too early to make too many guesses as to just
>>> what will come of this all, but I just hope that the deal goes better
>>> than the HP/Compaq merger.
>>
>> Could it go worse? If people printed only in red ink, would HP show any
>> black ink. ;-)
>
>Just to follow up on this last slam... I read later today that according
>to Carly, HP's printer revenue is 30% of HP's total, but accounts for 80%
>of its profit! Ink is expensive.

Hey, maybe IBM should buy back Lexmark.🙂

Rgds, George Macdonald

"Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who, me??

 

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.intel,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

On Wed, 8 Dec 2004 14:22:05 -0500, Keith R. Williams <krw@att.bizzzz>
wrote:

>In article <085dr0dvd2keloll8jhr15fvdk7j1ajgdd@4ax.com>, hilla_nospam_
>20@yahoo.ca says...
>>
>> Well, it's official now, Lenovo has purchased IBM's PC line:
>>
>> http://www-1.ibm.com/press/PressServletForm.wss?TemplateName=ShowPressReleaseTemplate&SelectString=t1.docunid=7450
>
>Old news. I posted that link four hours ago in this thread. ;-)

Blame it on reading news offline! A throw-back to my days gone by of
using a modem to access the internet (aka "the dark ages").

>> Looks like Lenovo will get not only the Thinkpad brand name, but also
>> the "IBM PC" brand name, at least for 5 years.
>>
>> I wonder if this deal will see the old IBM desktop systems back in the
>> North American market? Maybe we'll get a new competitor to the
>> Dell/HPaq duo that are really the only choice for commercial-grade PCs
>> these days?
>
>IBM has the ThinkCentres and IntelliStations, which are "commercial
>grade" systems. Note the IntelliStation line is not part of this deal
>(nor is the XServer).

Hmm.. for some reason I had thought that IBM had discontinued those
systems along with their consumer line. Guess I missed that... I sure
don't see many companies buying these anymore though!

>> It does jump Lenovo from the #9 PC seller in the world up
>> to the #3 spot, just behind Dell and HPaq but ahead of
>> Gateway/eMachines.
>
>Yep! Lenovo took the number three slot away form, Ta-Da... IBM! ;-)

Yes, but they're a third that might actually try to compete with Dell
and HPaq on desktops, unlike IBM (or at least IBM in North America).

>> Anyway, I suppose it's too early to make too many guesses as to just
>> what will come of this all, but I just hope that the deal goes better
>> than the HP/Compaq merger.
>
>Could it go worse? If people printed only in red ink, would HP show any
>black ink. ;-)

That depends on whether or not you're using an HP printer :>

-------------
Tony Hill
hilla <underscore> 20 <at> yahoo <dot> ca

 

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.intel,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:

>Come on! Cordless mice are the "cat's" ass. Optical *and* cordless is
>even better.

Optical is much better, for sure. Not so sure cordless would make my
life any better...

 

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.intel,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> writes:

> keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:
>
> >Come on! Cordless mice are the "cat's" ass. Optical *and* cordless is
> >even better.
>
> Optical is much better, for sure. Not so sure cordless would make my
> life any better...

I just didn't notice the extent to which the mouse cord was dragging
until I got a cordless; now, the difference between my machine at home
(cordless) and my machine in my office (cord) is like night and day.

I don't see a whole lot of use for cordless keyboards, though (I've
got one of those, too). For me, the best of all possible worlds would
be a cordless mouse and cord keyboard, with the mouse receiver in the
keyboard.
--
Joseph J. Pfeiffer, Jr., Ph.D. Phone -- (505) 646-1605
Department of Computer Science FAX -- (505) 646-1002
New Mexico State University http://www.cs.nmsu.edu/~pfeiffer

 

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On Fri, 10 Dec 2004 09:26:27 -0600, chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid>
wrote:

>keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:
>
>>Come on! Cordless mice are the "cat's" ass. Optical *and* cordless is
>>even better.
>
>Optical is much better, for sure. Not so sure cordless would make my
>life any better...

Personally, I'm not going back to a wired mouse for sure 😛pPpPp

--
L.Angel: I'm looking for web design work.
If you need basic to med complexity webpages at affordable rates, email me
Standard HTML, SHTML, MySQL + PHP or ASP, Javascript.
If you really want, FrontPage & DreamWeaver too.
But keep in mind you pay extra bandwidth for their bloated code

 

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On Fri, 10 Dec 2004 01:05:12 -0500, Tony Hill <hilla_nospam_20@yahoo.ca>
wrote:

>On Wed, 8 Dec 2004 14:22:05 -0500, Keith R. Williams <krw@att.bizzzz>
>wrote:
>
>>In article <085dr0dvd2keloll8jhr15fvdk7j1ajgdd@4ax.com>, hilla_nospam_
>>20@yahoo.ca says...
>>>
>>> Well, it's official now, Lenovo has purchased IBM's PC line:
>>>
>>> http://www-1.ibm.com/press/PressServletForm.wss?TemplateName=ShowPressReleaseTemplate&SelectString=t1.docunid=7450
>>
>>Old news. I posted that link four hours ago in this thread. ;-)
>
>Blame it on reading news offline! A throw-back to my days gone by of
>using a modem to access the internet (aka "the dark ages").
>
>>> Looks like Lenovo will get not only the Thinkpad brand name, but also
>>> the "IBM PC" brand name, at least for 5 years.
>>>
>>> I wonder if this deal will see the old IBM desktop systems back in the
>>> North American market? Maybe we'll get a new competitor to the
>>> Dell/HPaq duo that are really the only choice for commercial-grade PCs
>>> these days?
>>
>>IBM has the ThinkCentres and IntelliStations, which are "commercial
>>grade" systems. Note the IntelliStation line is not part of this deal
>>(nor is the XServer).
>
>Hmm.. for some reason I had thought that IBM had discontinued those
>systems along with their consumer line. Guess I missed that... I sure
>don't see many companies buying these anymore though!
>
>>> It does jump Lenovo from the #9 PC seller in the world up
>>> to the #3 spot, just behind Dell and HPaq but ahead of
>>> Gateway/eMachines.
>>
>>Yep! Lenovo took the number three slot away form, Ta-Da... IBM! ;-)
>
>Yes, but they're a third that might actually try to compete with Dell
>and HPaq on desktops, unlike IBM (or at least IBM in North America).

Yep, to me this is the interesting part of the deal - I'm sure they're
crunching numbers at Dell right now to figure what kinda price Lenovo is
going to hit the U.S. market with and what sectors they'll go after
aggressively... and of course Lenovo has recently signed up for AMD CPUs.

Rgds, George Macdonald

"Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who, me??

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.intel,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

On Thu, 09 Dec 2004 22:21:56 -0500, keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:

>On Tue, 07 Dec 2004 17:32:00 -0500, George Macdonald wrote:


>> Hmm, I'm resistant to cordless mice - batteries... bah! I currently have a
>> Logitech Click! corded and I like it.
>
>Come on! Cordless mice are the "cat's" ass. Optical *and* cordless is
>even better. The neat thing about the Logitech MX700 is that the NiCds
>are standard AAs and are *easily* replaced, if need be. It's a great
>design.

Optical is the only way to go now but... sorry but I can't get past the
idea of batteries. When the 'phone ones go low we always seem to be out;
often as not we don't have a working flashlight when we most need it and
have to search out the candles... in the dark🙂; the digital camera one
seems to spend more time plugged in the wall than it does in the camera. I
don't need another device which goes "hungry" when I really need it... when
the cord is no inconvenience to me.

>> The T42s really are very nice... once you get used to the idea of no
>> PS/2 port and no floppy spindle. Yeah, USB is ugly but the USB floppy
>> drives work fine... when the need is there, which is not that often.
>> Make a bootable USB flash drive and the need is slim to non-existent.
>
>I think I've used a floppy drive a *total* of once in the past three
>years. I'm not even sure why a put a floppy drive in this system, other
>than I had it rotting on the shelf. Email is easier than floppies, and
>flash drives now make them totally useless.

Yeah we're almost there on elimination of floppies but the USB ones are
$25. or so, *if* you really need one. When they offer you a T42P I'd say
"yes please".🙂

BTW we have two dead A2x models in the office. Similar symptoms: lock-up
after they get warmed up; I've had the CPUs out, since I read at
www.thinkpads.com that this can be a badly seated CPU but... no joy.:-(
They both had a hard life and for all I know have had a coke, coffee (or
even whisky or beer) bath so I'm not agonizing over them.

>> About what I'd have thought... so I'm not sure what IBM is supposedly
>> brewing here acording to the reports. Without the Thinkxxx name the
>> line is just baggage.
>
>The "facts" are now out. I think they'll keep the "Think" brands, though
>the IBM logo is another thing entirely.

From what I read, it seemed we'll be able to buy IBM branded Thinkpads for
5 years or so at least - IOW Lenovo is just taking over management of the
U.S. operation and the already exisiting sub-contracted mfr. in China.

Rgds, George Macdonald

"Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who, me??

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.intel,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

On Thu, 09 Dec 2004 22:21:56 -0500, keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:

>Optical *and* cordless is even better.

Cordless and ball is really tragic - I had a client who spent up on
exactly that; geez, the shop must have been happy. I'd rather live
with a cord than have to add batteries, and at least one Logitech
keyboard+mouse stings you there. The blurb made big noise about
rechargable mouse batteries, with charging station etc., but guess
what? The keyboard's batteries weren't rechargeable!

>I think I've used a floppy drive a *total* of once in the past three
>years. I'm not even sure why a put a floppy drive in this system, other
>than I had it rotting on the shelf. Email is easier than floppies, and
>flash drives now make them totally useless.

We're still in transition on that one. You can't use email to boot a
PC, recover data from it, and clean up malware 🙂

More to the point, the NT installation procedure still prompts for
boot-needed drivers (S-ATA, RAID, SCSI etc.) off diskette. Until BIOS
support for USB is solid enough, I can't see a fix, as the optical
drive may well be on the same controller you are trying to drive.

Once USB sticks are as cheap as 1.44M (they are already for laptops,
but that's because laptop 1.44M are so costly) then we may see the
shift - but there's another gotcha to be fixed first.

If a USB stick is bootable (as would be more often the case if we
ditch 1.44M) and is in the PC on boot or when OS is installed, it
sometimes scrambles drive letter allocation.



>--------------- ----- ---- --- -- - - -
Tech Support: The guys who follow the
'Parade of New Products' with a shovel.
>--------------- ----- ---- --- -- - - -

 

[keith]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.intel,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

On Fri, 10 Dec 2004 09:26:27 -0600, chrisv wrote:

> keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:
>
>>Come on! Cordless mice are the "cat's" ass. Optical *and* cordless is
>>even better.
>
> Optical is much better, for sure. Not so sure cordless would make my
> life any better...

I went to cordless long before optical. I can't stand rat-tails. They
keep getting hung up in the stuff on the desk (or in the crack between the
desk and wall).

--
Keith

 

[keith]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.intel,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

On Thu, 09 Dec 2004 19:08:50 -0500, George Macdonald wrote:

> On Wed, 08 Dec 2004 23:34:34 -0500, keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:
>
>>On Wed, 08 Dec 2004 14:22:05 -0500, Keith R. Williams wrote:
>>
>>> In article <085dr0dvd2keloll8jhr15fvdk7j1ajgdd@4ax.com>, hilla_nospam_
>>> 20@yahoo.ca says...
>
> <<snip>>
>
>>>> Anyway, I suppose it's too early to make too many guesses as to just
>>>> what will come of this all, but I just hope that the deal goes better
>>>> than the HP/Compaq merger.
>>>
>>> Could it go worse? If people printed only in red ink, would HP show any
>>> black ink. ;-)
>>
>>Just to follow up on this last slam... I read later today that according
>>to Carly, HP's printer revenue is 30% of HP's total, but accounts for 80%
>>of its profit! Ink is expensive.
>
> Hey, maybe IBM should buy back Lexmark.🙂


....and what's in it for Lexmark? Remember, they escaped once. ;-)

--
Keith

 

[keith]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.intel,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

On Fri, 10 Dec 2004 21:52:58 +0200, cquirke (MVP Win9x) wrote:

> On Thu, 09 Dec 2004 22:21:56 -0500, keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:
>
>>Optical *and* cordless is even better.
>
> Cordless and ball is really tragic - I had a client who spent up on
> exactly that; geez, the shop must have been happy. I'd rather live
> with a cord than have to add batteries, and at least one Logitech
> keyboard+mouse stings you there. The blurb made big noise about
> rechargable mouse batteries, with charging station etc., but guess
> what? The keyboard's batteries weren't rechargeable!

No batteries in my keyboard. It's a '91 vintage Model-M. ;-)

The mouse I replaced (both at home and work) was a M$ cordless. The
balls were starting to act up and I got tired of feeding them AAA
batteries. The nice thing about the Logitech 700 mouse batteries is that
they're standard NiCd AAs, thus easily and cheaply replaceable.

>>I think I've used a floppy drive a *total* of once in the past three
>>years. I'm not even sure why a put a floppy drive in this system, other
>>than I had it rotting on the shelf. Email is easier than floppies, and
>>flash drives now make them totally useless.
>
> We're still in transition on that one. You can't use email to boot a
> PC, recover data from it, and clean up malware 🙂

One can boot a PC off a CDROM, so where's the beef?

> More to the point, the NT installation procedure still prompts for
> boot-needed drivers (S-ATA, RAID, SCSI etc.) off diskette. Until BIOS
> support for USB is solid enough, I can't see a fix, as the optical drive
> may well be on the same controller you are trying to drive.

Again, CDROM.

> Once USB sticks are as cheap as 1.44M (they are already for laptops, but
> that's because laptop 1.44M are so costly) then we may see the shift -
> but there's another gotcha to be fixed first.

Dunno, a friend snagged a 256MB USB stick from Staples for $10. Last I
checked that was pretty close to a floppy drive's cost and a tad larger.

> If a USB stick is bootable (as would be more often the case if we ditch
> 1.44M) and is in the PC on boot or when OS is installed, it sometimes
> scrambles drive letter allocation.

SMOP. But again, don't all systems have CDROM drives? DOn't 90% of the
new ones (where floppys could be eliminated) have CD-R or CD-R/W drives?

--
Keith

 

[keith]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.intel,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

On Fri, 10 Dec 2004 19:35:20 -0500, George Macdonald wrote:

> On Thu, 09 Dec 2004 22:21:56 -0500, keith <krw@att.bizzzz> wrote:
>
>>On Tue, 07 Dec 2004 17:32:00 -0500, George Macdonald wrote:
>
>
>>> Hmm, I'm resistant to cordless mice - batteries... bah! I currently have a
>>> Logitech Click! corded and I like it.
>>
>>Come on! Cordless mice are the "cat's" ass. Optical *and* cordless is
>>even better. The neat thing about the Logitech MX700 is that the NiCds
>>are standard AAs and are *easily* replaced, if need be. It's a great
>>design.
>
> Optical is the only way to go now but... sorry but I can't get past the
> idea of batteries. When the 'phone ones go low we always seem to be out;
> often as not we don't have a working flashlight when we most need it and
> have to search out the candles... in the dark🙂; the digital camera one
> seems to spend more time plugged in the wall than it does in the camera. I
> don't need another device which goes "hungry" when I really need it... when
> the cord is no inconvenience to me.

Hang up the mouse when you're not calling, err mousing. It's
rechargeable. I've also noticed (because I don't always remember to hang
it up) that it will run about a day (at least eight hours) begging for a
recharge. There is a blinkin' red LED on its back to signal when it needs
a fix.

As far as cords go, I'm always getting them tangled or wedged between the
desk and wall. They're kinda like the old-style automobile seatbelts.
Rather pythonesque (and it's not at all funny).
>
>>> The T42s really are very nice... once you get used to the idea of no
>>> PS/2 port and no floppy spindle. Yeah, USB is ugly but the USB floppy
>>> drives work fine... when the need is there, which is not that often.
>>> Make a bootable USB flash drive and the need is slim to non-existent.
>>
>>I think I've used a floppy drive a *total* of once in the past three
>>years. I'm not even sure why a put a floppy drive in this system, other
>>than I had it rotting on the shelf. Email is easier than floppies, and
>>flash drives now make them totally useless.
>
> Yeah we're almost there on elimination of floppies but the USB ones are
> $25. or so, *if* you really need one. When they offer you a T42P I'd
> say "yes please".🙂

As I said in another article, a friend snagged a 256MB stick for $10
at Staples last weekend. At the stores here they were $30. I'll take
the T42p IFF my dock still works (or they fork over for that too). ;-)

> BTW we have two dead A2x models in the office. Similar symptoms:
> lock-up after they get warmed up; I've had the CPUs out, since I read at
> www.thinkpads.com that this can be a badly seated CPU but... no joy.:-(
> They both had a hard life and for all I know have had a coke, coffee (or
> even whisky or beer) bath so I'm not agonizing over them.

May they rest in peace.

>>> About what I'd have thought... so I'm not sure what IBM is supposedly
>>> brewing here acording to the reports. Without the Thinkxxx name the
>>> line is just baggage.
>>
>>The "facts" are now out. I think they'll keep the "Think" brands,
>>though the IBM logo is another thing entirely.
>
> From what I read, it seemed we'll be able to buy IBM branded Thinkpads
> for 5 years or so at least - IOW Lenovo is just taking over management
> of the U.S. operation and the already exisiting sub-contracted mfr. in
> China.

The issue of the "Think" brand was murky, IMO. It was clear that
Lenovo was going to use the color IBM logo for five years. BTW, they
also get the manufacturing iin Mexico (I think it's still there for the
'T' series) and the Sanmina-SCI sub-contracts.

--
Keith