Intel & AMD Processor Hierarchy

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M42

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Thanks for the link. Pretty amazing what happens with the whole story rather than cherry-picked test results.

Looks like the conclusion is absolutely NOT worth the price-premium of high end DDR5.
It's a common theme in almost every area. Take high-end stereo equipment for example. You can spend 10x the money for 5% improvement. People buy high-end usually because they can. To some people, none of the highest-performing CPUs are worth the price. To others, price does not matter. For those people, the fastest gaming CPU is not actually the 5800X3D.
 
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It's a common theme in almost every area. Take high-end stereo equipment for example. You can spend 10x the money for 5% improvement. People buy high-end usually because they can. To some people, none of the highest-performing CPUs are worth the price. To others, price does not matter. For those people, the fastest gaming CPU is not actually the 5800X3D.
This is going to vary based on what games are being tested, how they are tested, and the exact specs of the test systems. So logically, different review sites are going to come to different results. The charts Shady provided don't really support their argument, in that the fraction of a percent performance difference shown there is well within the margin of error. A less than 1% average performance difference at anything resembling real-world resolutions is completely meaningless, and could swing either way depending on test conditions. And if you look at the individual charts for each game, you would see that the 5800X is the fastest in some of the games they tested, the 12900KS is the fastest in others, and overall, the two end up relatively even, at least in the context of the selection of games and hardware they tested with there. Each processor performs differently at different tasks, and neither is fastest at everything.
 

M42

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This is going to vary based on what games are being tested, how they are tested, and the exact specs of the test systems. So logically, different review sites are going to come to different results. The charts Shady provided don't really support their argument, in that the fraction of a percent performance difference shown there is well within the margin of error. A less than 1% average performance difference at anything resembling real-world resolutions is completely meaningless, and could swing either way depending on test conditions. And if you look at the individual charts for each game, you would see that the 5800X is the fastest in some of the games they tested, the 12900KS is the fastest in others, and overall, the two end up relatively even, at least in the context of the selection of games and hardware they tested with there. Each processor performs differently at different tasks, and neither is fastest at everything.
Sure, results will vary, but the 5800X3D cannot be overclocked to any great extent, but a good sample of 12900K or KS can be nicely overclocked. With well-selected components, a 12900k/ks system will easily outperform the best reviews. That said, it was easier to obtain high-performing CPUs when Silicon Lottery was in business, but it is still possible. So, there is no doubt that for well-heeled users that this tips the gaming performance crown to the 12900k/ks.
 
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guru7of9

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Still no updated CPU GAMING HIERARCHY LIST ! been like 6 months or so!
I dont know why they dont just add a Windows 11 on it and put it at the top and leave the current Windows 10 directly underneath it!
Still view it as biased towards Intel ! i bet if Intel is on top again it will updated straight away!
We shall see!
 

shady28

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The iGPU chart would benefit greatly putting a couple of the laptop class SKUs in there. . Something along the lines of 5700U / 6700U, and 1165G7 / 1260P. I know these are 'laptop' parts, but these types of CPUs appear in AIO desktops all the time and seeing them in relative performance to the full power desktop versions would be relevant IMO.
 

Awev

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I would like to see an update to everything around the end of the year. Kind of like with a personal or business computer, the best is based on what you are going to use it for. Budget and types of games to be played will have a big effect on a lot of things. A turned base system with time limits for the NPC (computer based opponents) will most likely benefit more from more threads, while a FPS will be determined by a proper balance of resolution, refresh rate, CPU, GPU, and budget I think we all know that.

I have not invested in a 4K monitor yet, so I am not worried about hitting 60 FPS at 4k, and which combination of CPU, RAM, SSD, and GPU is going to give me the best for Minesweep. Ok, for a screen that large Micro$oft's unpatched Flight Simulator that was release in the last couple of years would be a better test at 4K. Who is up for a round of Star Citizen, and can your system get you in-game in under 2 minutes (and some people are using Threadrippers (y) to play the game).

Find a website that you feel gives good honest reviews, and uses the software/programs and games that you play, to test things. And remember folks, your results will differ, no "may" to it. And the better the funding for the tests, the more tests that can be conducted, with more combinations, such as different sizes and clockings of RAM.
 
Just curious...why would the 5600X have a higher Gaming Score than the 5800X?
Is this related to the 1 CCx vs 2CCX issue?
I am assuming that the 5600X uses 6 CPUs from one 8-CPU CCX and that the 5800X uses 4 CPUs from each of 2 CCXs, hence the slowdown across the infinity Fabric?

Seems strange to me.
 

Eximo

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No, 5800X should be a single CCX with 8 cores. One of its few advantages. The 5900X uses two six core CCXs. Quad core dies seem to have only ended up with the 5300G (OEM only)

Probably just noise in the data. They should perform very similarly and they are within a 1% of each other on this chart.
 
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Just curious...why would the 5600X have a higher Gaming Score than the 5800X?
Honestly, I wouldn't read too much into the exact numbers in this chart, since they only base the results on performance in a handful of CPU-demanding games that are arguably not entirely representative of typical gaming performance...

We measured performance for the 1080p CPU gaming benchmarks with a geometric mean of Borderlands 3, Hitman 2, Far Cry 5, Project CARS 3, Red Dead Redemption 2, and Shadow of the Tomb Raider. We measured performance for the 1440p CPU gaming benchmarks with a geometric mean of Borderlands 3, Project CARS 3, Far Cry 5, Red Dead Redemption 2, and Shadow of the Tomb Raider.
So, the 1080p numbers are based on average frame rates in 6 games, and the 1440p results in just 5 games, with all but one title released upward of 3-4 years ago, not exactly a particularly large sample size.

And of course, the vast majority of games will not show any notable performance difference between most of these CPUs, as performance will typically be either limited by graphics hardware, or frame rates will exceed what your monitor can display. It's very possible that future demanding titles may perform notably better on one processor than another, but it's questionable whether a handful of several-year-old games will be in any way representative of that.
 
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Dr3ams

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When it comes time to purchase hardware, I'm not thinking about who's winning the benchmark race, instead I'm considering if the hardware I'm lookin at will do what I want it to.
 
When it comes time to purchase hardware, I'm not thinking about who's winning the benchmark race, instead I'm considering if the hardware I'm lookin at will do what I want it to.
That's fine, though if it comes down to two systems being priced similar but one being a little faster than the other, or one costing less while offering similar performance, then it arguably makes sense to know which will give you more performance for your money.

However, this hierarchy list is a bit weird, as I mentioned in my previous post, to the point where I would say it's a bit deceptive to someone shopping for hardware, so I wouldn't read much into the exact numbers, as the percentages don't really reflect real-world gaming performance.

Your 5600X is not going to perform 25-30% behind the top-performing CPUs in most games. In reality, you would be hard-pressed to notice much performance difference between your processor and today's highest-end CPUs in almost any title. With a 6700 XT running at 3440x1440 resolution, your performance is bound to be limited by the graphics hardware more than anything in just about any of today's games, making the choice of CPU far less relevant. See this review of the i9-13900K at Techpowerup for example...
https://www.techpowerup.com/review/intel-core-i9-13900k/20.html

The charts on this particular page show the relative average performance while running these processors paired with an RTX 3080 at 4K resolution at ultra settings, but that should not be too far off from the framerates you might expect with a 6700 XT at 3440x1440. Your graphics card isn't as fast as a 3080, but the resolution isn't as demanding either. What you'll notice is that nearly all of the processors in the list from the last several years run the games very similarly, within about 5% of one another as far as average frame rates are concerned. Even if you reduce settings to boost frame rates, making the CPU more of a limiting factor, the performance difference will increase, but typically not by as much the hierarchy chart here might have you believe.

On the positive side, they did recently update the list of games used here for these tests, and increased their number a bit. However, they still only test a relatively small selection of games that show the greatest differences between CPUs, and remove any games from 1440p resolution that become graphics limited even with an RTX 4090, and don't test 4K at all, the resolution a 4090 would be most suited for. That might ensure they are showing the absolute worst-case scenario differences between these processors, but it doesn't accurately depict the much smaller differences you will see in the vast majority of today's games when paired with a graphics card running at a resolution that makes sense for it.
 
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Dr3ams

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Your 5600X is not going to perform 25-30% behind the top-performing CPUs in most games. In reality, you would be hard-pressed to notice much performance difference between your processor and today's highest-end CPUs in almost any title. With a 6700 XT running at 3440x1440 resolution, your performance is bound to be limited by the graphics hardware more than anything in just about any of today's games...

The most graphic intensive game I play is The Division 2, which was released in 2019. The RX 6700 XT easily handles it with the display running 1440p at 165 Hz with the FPS capped at 160. In February, I'll get Hogwart's Legacy. My system will also easily handle that on high settings. I'm not looking at prices when I buy hardware. I look at what I need and what I want. I like AMD hardware, so I buy AMD. Even if the price is a little higher than Intel, as long as it does what I want, I will still buy AMD.
 
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pinkeye

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With a 6700 XT running at 3440x1440 resolution, your performance is bound to be limited by the graphics hardware more than anything in just about any of today's games, making the choice of CPU far less relevant. See this review of the i9-13900K at Techpowerup for example...
https://www.techpowerup.com/review/intel-core-i9-13900k/20.html
1000 ways to skin a cat, I spose. And everyone is in a different position, with different priorities.

For me, I'm a "one and done" kinda person. I can afford to do that with all components but the GPU.
CPUs available now will last me a decade, and I can buy a GPU upgrade or two in that time.... when their prices drop hard.
 

Ast1on

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If PBO for non 5800x3d is included you should include the undervolted 5800x3d in my opinion in the charts. With PBOTuner you can undervolt it in general -30 all cores and make it go till 4.4ghz with lower temperatures. In less then 5 minutes it is tweaked.
 
What no one is talking about is the incredible generational jump in cpu performance we've just seen

someone upgrading from a Ryzen 9 5950x to a ryzen 9 7950x 3D would see an amazing 61% improvement in a single generation of cpus. That's not small at all. in fact i can't remember the last time a single cpu generation saw that type of jump in performance... maybe from the core 2 quad to nelhem? maybe... though i think you'd almost have to go from a core2quad to sandy bridge to see a 60% uplift in performance. simply mind boggling stuff.

here i am sitting here with a ryzen 7 5700x... which was a huge 25% uplift over the ryzen 5 3600 i used to have... and i can't help but eye a 60% jump in performance a bit enviously.
 
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atomicWAR

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What no one is talking about is the incredible generational jump in cpu performance we've just seen

someone upgrading from a Ryzen 9 5950x to a ryzen 9 7950x 3D would see an amazing 61% improvement in a single generation of cpus. That's not small at all. in fact i can't remember the last time a single cpu generation saw that type of jump in performance... maybe from the core 2 quad to nelhem? maybe... though i think you'd almost have to go from a core2quad to sandy bridge to see a 60% uplift in performance. simply mind boggling stuff.

here i am sitting here with a ryzen 7 5700x... which was a huge 25% uplift over the ryzen 5 3600 i used to have... and i can't help but eye a 60% jump in performance a bit enviously.

I am coming from a Ivy-Bridge based Xeon 1680 V2 8C/16T CPU to a 7950X (soon a X3D varient and this one will go in my game/file server)....My performance boost is 203% (multi-core 101% single)...CPUs had become stagnate thanks to Intel's massive lead in the faildozer years and their milking of the market. We got gen after gen of 5-10% performance bumps that meant little to most users.

My old Xeon overclocked to 4.3GHz despite being two generation old at the time wasn't far off a first gen Ryzen in game and some app performance. Which was the only reason I didn't buy into gen one of Ryzen. Waiting a couple more generations after that bought me a huge performance bump. I haven't had this much increase in speed since the late 90s/early 00s when competition was fierce. Though I never kept a CPU platform this long in the past, lol..again do to Intel's stagnation of the market when they were ahead. Point being it is a great time to buy a CPU. The performance inscreases have been huge the last few gens on both sides.
 

SinisterMessiah

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What's with the 1080p gaming benchmarks? Who is buying flagship CPU's so they can play at 1080p lol...

Far more poeple are probably interested in how the performance of the new X3D's scale up to 1440p, 4K, ray tracing, etc.
 

King_V

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What's with the 1080p gaming benchmarks? Who is buying flagship CPU's so they can play at 1080p lol...

Far more poeple are probably interested in how the performance of the new X3D's scale up to 1440p, 4K, ray tracing, etc.

This question keeps coming up over and over again.

Low resolution and a high-powered graphics card are used because the tests are meant to isolate the performance to just the CPU. Once you start increasing the resolution, adding ray tracing, etc., then you are no longer testing the performance, because the GPU becomes the component that is holding you back.
 
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