Intel Core i7-7700K Retest: More Oveclocking, Less Heat

[razor512]

Can we get a few AIDA64 benchmarks when the 7700k is at 4.8GHz?

Hoping to compare it to what I was able to get with the 6700K at 1.415V
http://imgur.com/a/zSXzB

 

[alextheblue]

More than anything, I think this highlights the influence a mobo can have.

I've grown pretty complacent about mobo performance and typically shop based on features. I guess I'll have to start paying more attention to the benchies, from now on.

Performance should be the roughly the same at the same clocks, and it's pretty common knowledge (among those who overclock) that the board and BIOS can affect overclock potential. However I will definitely pay more attention to power consumption / temps at the same voltage on different boards/firmware than I have been.

 

[cats_Paw]

Well, Its not like we were expecting a revolution with kaby lake.
I mean, iPhones are the same over and over and they keep selling, right?

Anyway, If you have even a sandy bridge 4 core i7, Id say wait.

 

[Crashman]

Well, Its not like we were expecting a revolution with kaby lake.
I mean, iPhones are the same over and over and they keep selling, right?

Anyway, If you have even a sandy bridge 4 core i7, Id say wait.

Many people can wait, the only reason I upgraded to Haswell was that my Core 2 system was failing

This is definitely a good time for an upgrade if you're feeling the crunch of an 8GB limit on a DDR2 board 😀

 

[ledhead11]

3 gens on and I still don't see a credible reason to upgrade, oh wait, I guess I could put Gilmore Girls on for my wife.

 

[hixbot]

These ads by Revcontent are completely NSFW. They are sexist and inappropriate for a tech site. Can't install ad blocker on my work computer, but need to research tech for my job. I know your editors don't choose the ads, but you need to choose your ad sources more strictly to make sure the content is appropriate. Half naked images of women with click bait headlines are not appropriate.
Goodbye Toms, I've been a long time reader of this site but these clickbait "from the web" ads are truly the last straw.

 

[razor512]

These ads by Revcontent are completely NSFW. They are sexist and inappropriate for a tech site. Can't install ad blocker on my work computer, but need to research tech for my job. I know your editors don't choose the ads, but you need to choose your ad sources more strictly to make sure the content is appropriate. Half naked images of women with click bait headlines are not appropriate.
Goodbye Toms, I've been a long time reader of this site but these clickbait "from the web" ads are truly the last straw.

Use at least a script blocker, or if using firefox or chrome, set up a profile with adblocking already set up, then restart the office PC, and boot into a linux live USB, then from there, manually replace the profile folder for firefox or chrome.

Also be careful when using this site with a mobile device, as the ad service they use, regularly lets through malicious ads, e.g., the ones that redirect your mobile browser either to the play store, or an annoying page that causes it to vibrate and claim you are infected.

These issues have been going on for years and tomshardware has no intention of even looking into the issue.

 

[RedJaron]

Biggest reason to upgrade now, for me at least, would be the platform benefits: native USB 3.1 and type-C, PCIe 3.0 through the chipset, M.2 slots, etc.

 

[alidan]

My reason to upgrade is i'm on a nearing 7 year old phenom II, the mother board wont last forever, and there are a few applications that just will not run at an acceptable speed.

Im holding off on zen because of the systems im considering, it seems to be the less bs laden.

 

[Crashman]

My reason to upgrade is i'm on a nearing 7 year old phenom II, the mother board wont last forever, and there are a few applications that just will not run at an acceptable speed.

Im holding off on zen because of the systems im considering, it seems to be the less bs laden.

Are you holding off ON or FOR Zen? Because it looks great from afar, and we'd really like to see it up close.

 

[alidan]

My reason to upgrade is i'm on a nearing 7 year old phenom II, the mother board wont last forever, and there are a few applications that just will not run at an acceptable speed.

Im holding off on zen because of the systems im considering, it seems to be the less bs laden.

Are you holding off ON or FOR Zen? Because it looks great from afar, and we'd really like to see it up close.

holding off for an upgrade for zen, but zen is the deadline, if it cant deliver im getting a dual processor 32 thread server board as a pc, Hell only reason I didn't pick that up a few weeks back was seeing some of the programs I would get that kind of a computer for fail to use 2 cpus and if on stuck on only one cpu, zen would be worth waiting for.

that said, there is also the possibility of a future upgrade when if companies buy en mass 8+ core opterons, think intels older high end motherboards, where you could use an i7, or you could also use a xeon.

If it sells well, I'll get a future glut of old opterons that don't need specific socket number motherboards, and may be able to drop something even more monstrous into the computer, by then it would be a render box apposed to a normal use computer most likely but still.

 

[Crashman]

My reason to upgrade is i'm on a nearing 7 year old phenom II, the mother board wont last forever, and there are a few applications that just will not run at an acceptable speed.

Im holding off on zen because of the systems im considering, it seems to be the less bs laden.

Are you holding off ON or FOR Zen? Because it looks great from afar, and we'd really like to see it up close.

holding off for an upgrade for zen, but zen is the deadline, if it cant deliver im getting a dual processor 32 thread server board as a pc, Hell only reason I didn't pick that up a few weeks back was seeing some of the programs I would get that kind of a computer for fail to use 2 cpus and if on stuck on only one cpu, zen would be worth waiting for.

that said, there is also the possibility of a future upgrade when if companies buy en mass 8+ core opterons, think intels older high end motherboards, where you could use an i7, or you could also use a xeon.

If it sells well, I'll get a future glut of old opterons that don't need specific socket number motherboards, and may be able to drop something even more monstrous into the computer, by then it would be a render box apposed to a normal use computer most likely but still.

Hey, if Zen doesn't flip your switch, remember that there are X99 boards that support Xeons with 8 or more cores. You'd have to look at the approved processors for each board to figure of if any can support 16 though, because I can't remember everything

 

[razor512]

I was holding out hope for AMD zen, but ended up going over to intel when it became clear that they had no intention of supporting older versions of windows. I was hoping to use AMD zen while still on windows 7, and this will really harm their business.

If we look at the state of the windows 10 market share, we can see that the decision to not support older versions, will be cutting off a significant part of the market. They have restricted their product to people who want to use the CPU along with either windows 10 or a linux based OS., basically cutting off 75% of the market

 

[RedJaron]

I was holding out hope for AMD zen, but ended up going over to intel when it became clear that they had no intention of supporting older versions of windows.

This has been confused and misunderstood since the first announcement.

First, it's not Intel halting support, it's Microsoft. Secondly, it's not making newer chips incompatible with older Windows. MS is saying they want to simplify their support model and are not not going to add retroactive support to older Windows versions for newer CPU technologies. So if AVX 3 or AES-1024 comes out, MS isn't going to patch that into Windows XP or 7. They've already drawn out WinXP support for long enough and don't want to go through it again for Win7.

Windows is still x86 code, so it's not like you won't be able to run Win7 on a Cannonlake-E CPU. You simply won't get any support for newer hardware acceleration, newer SpreedStep, or Turbo Boost software. Worst that will happen is the UEFI model will change on newer hardware and drop legacy BIOS mode support or require you to use a GPT instead of MBR on your hard drive. That's extremely unlikely to happen in the next two years, however. However, if you check MSI, ASRock, or other mboard manufacturers, you'll notice they're already dropping driver support for Win8 ( though 8.1 is there ). Wouldn't surprise me at all if they drop Win7 drivers with the next generation platforms either.

Seriously, Apple, Google, Samsung, and LG do this every year with their phones, dropping off support for older platforms. Few people complain about it. But MS says it doesn't want to keep patching and updating 10+ year old software . . .

 

[razor512]

That is part of what worries me, it is likely that with no CPU support, we will end up with AM4 boards with no windows 7 drivers, as well as Microsoft potentially going with a similar plan to what they had originally wanted for skylake, where they wanted to withhold certain security updates if they would cause compatibility issues with skylake.

 

[RedJaron]

That is part of what worries me, it is likely that with no CPU support, we will end up with AM4 boards with no windows 7 drivers

Windows itself has enough baked in generic drivers to at least boot up. That is not going to change any time soon. If your mboard mfr doesn't have the drivers for older Windows on their site, you can either download OS specific drivers from the individual component mfr sites, or crack open the mboard driver packages and extract the drivers yourself for manual installation. However, I'm not sure how you plan to blame mfrs for not having drivers for their tech that support OSes that went out of mainstream support before their products ever reached market. Either way, stop acting like this is just Intel and MS intentionally trying to screw over customers. It's not true.

as well as Microsoft potentially going with a similar plan to what they had originally wanted for skylake, where they wanted to withhold certain security updates if they would cause compatibility issues with skylake.

You realize this is a total catch-22 for MS, right? They release a patch that's causes instabilities due to hardware incompatibility, they'll get harangued for once again having the BSOD show up every ten seconds. They don't release the secutrity patches, so as not to bork their consumes' machines, and they'll get lambasted for still having "the most unsecure OS in the history of ever."

These kinds of expectations, that a company should cater to everyone's whims, regardless how difficult, expensive, or time consuming it is, smacks heavily of entitlement. If you hate what MS is doing, fine. Use another OS or go prove them wrong and make your own. MS doesn't owe you or anyone anything. Same goes for Intel, AMD, NVidia, and just about every other company. If you're not paying them for a continual service contract, stop complaining that they're not giving you free crap.

 

[captaincharisma]

These kinds of expectations, that a company should cater to everyone's whims, regardless how difficult, expensive, or time consuming it is, smacks heavily of entitlement. If you hate what MS is doing, fine. Use another OS or go prove them wrong and make your own. MS doesn't owe you or anyone anything. Same goes for Intel, AMD, NVidia, and just about every other company. If you're not paying them for a continual service contract, stop complaining that they're not giving you free crap.

+1 to that

everyone here there complaining about MS dropping support because they stopped supporting there 7-10 years old computer. how about giving a kodos to MS for supporting your old hardware for such a long time which may be one of the reasons why you think windows is so messed up now because everyone expects them to keepup with backwards compatibility by supporting hardware all the way back from the beginning of the century.

Yes, computers and computer upgrades are expensive but don't expect everything to last forever

as for Zen CPU's who knows? for all we know AMD may still be running crippled Intel Core I5/I7 CPU's to make the zen look good

 

[valeman2012]

The Intel i5 and Intel 7 Keby Lake is good people who is switching away from AMD FX / AMD A-Series to use these 7th Gen CPU`s.

 

[razor512]

I am not saying that I am entitled to heir support, I am simply pointing out one aspect that will cost AMD a lot of business, regardless of who is at fault.

A large portion of the user base, is on versions of windows that are older than windows 10, and even after a year of them trying to give it away, the majority are still on older versions. Windows 10 was simply not as well received as windows 7.

Regardles of who is at fault, trying to sell AMD Zen CPUs will be an uphill battle for users who are on older versions, as even if windows 7, 8, and 8.1 will boot on that hardware, those users will likely not be willing to give up their security updates to use that hardware, and ZEN may not be enough to push them to install windows 10, especially if "free" was unable to get them to install it.

Microsoft is a private company, and they can do what they want with their development, but unless they get the kind of push-back that they got with skylake, it is unlikely that they will decide to extend support to older versions of windows.

Also, for my driver comment, usually these shifts such as companies abandoning an OS, happens when one major player takes the first step.

For example, Microsoft stopped updating windows XP, and around that time, most major companies stopped releasing windows XP drivers.

For motherboard driver support, the CPU maker, pretty much dictates driver support from motherboard makers.

For example, if Zen will have no windows 7 support, thus a high chance that certain security updates may be withheld if they cause stability issues with Zen, then there will be little value using that CPU with that operating system; this in turn will make the OS less attractive overall when it comes to driver development. If the AM4 CPU will not be getting proper support on older versions of windows, then there is less incentive to allocate development resources for motherboard drivers (with their requisite QA testing and validation) for said OS.

Overall, like me, users who want to want to or are in the process of upgrading from an old Phenom II, or FX CPU, will see Skylake as a more appealing option compared to Zen. https://www.w3counter.com/globalstats.php?year=2016&month=11

Some of us simply prefer an OS like windows 7, over windows 10.
I personally used it for a few months as my main OS, and encountered too many, and ultimately upgraded to Windows 7, and simply have an install of windows 10, on a separate SSD that I can switch to if I need DX12. Since I keep the documents, photos, and other bulk data on my HDD, I can remain productive on both platforms, though I have a better experience on windows 7.

 

[valeman2012]

I am not saying that I am entitled to heir support, I am simply pointing out one aspect that will cost AMD a lot of business, regardless of who is at fault.

A large portion of the user base, is on versions of windows that are older than windows 10, and even after a year of them trying to give it away, the majority are still on older versions. Windows 10 was simply not as well received as windows 7.

Regardles of who is at fault, trying to sell AMD Zen CPUs will be an uphill battle for users who are on older versions, as even if windows 7, 8, and 8.1 will boot on that hardware, those users will likely not be willing to give up their security updates to use that hardware, and ZEN may not be enough to push them to install windows 10, especially if "free" was unable to get them to install it.

Microsoft is a private company, and they can do what they want with their development, but unless they get the kind of push-back that they got with skylake, it is unlikely that they will decide to extend support to older versions of windows.

Also, for my driver comment, usually these shifts such as companies abandoning an OS, happens when one major player takes the first step.

For example, Microsoft stopped updating windows XP, and around that time, most major companies stopped releasing windows XP drivers.

For motherboard driver support, the CPU maker, pretty much dictates driver support from motherboard makers.

For example, if Zen will have no windows 7 support, thus a high chance that certain security updates may be withheld if they cause stability issues with Zen, then there will be little value using that CPU with that operating system; this in turn will make the OS less attractive overall when it comes to driver development. If the AM4 CPU will not be getting proper support on older versions of windows, then there is less incentive to allocate development resources for motherboard drivers (with their requisite QA testing and validation) for said OS.

Overall, like me, users who want to want to or are in the process of upgrading from an old Phenom II, or FX CPU, will see Skylake as a more appealing option compared to Zen. https://www.w3counter.com/globalstats.php?year=2016&month=11

Some of us simply prefer an OS like windows 7, over windows 10.
I personally used it for a few months as my main OS, and encountered too many, and ultimately upgraded to Windows 7, and simply have an install of windows 10, on a separate SSD that I can switch to if I need DX12. Since I keep the documents, photos, and other bulk data on my HDD, I can remain productive on both platforms, though I have a better experience on windows 7.

AMD not going be going anyway as Intel sort of helping AMD by allowing them nudge up their business...cause you know what once the Intel only company - they probably get spited.

 

[JamesSneed]

I am not saying that I am entitled to heir support, I am simply pointing out one aspect that will cost AMD a lot of business, regardless of who is at fault.

A large portion of the user base, is on versions of windows that are older than windows 10, and even after a year of them trying to give it away, the majority are still on older versions. Windows 10 was simply not as well received as windows 7.

Regardles of who is at fault, trying to sell AMD Zen CPUs will be an uphill battle for users who are on older versions, as even if windows 7, 8, and 8.1 will boot on that hardware, those users will likely not be willing to give up their security updates to use that hardware, and ZEN may not be enough to push them to install windows 10, especially if "free" was unable to get them to install it.

Microsoft is a private company, and they can do what they want with their development, but unless they get the kind of push-back that they got with skylake, it is unlikely that they will decide to extend support to older versions of windows.

Also, for my driver comment, usually these shifts such as companies abandoning an OS, happens when one major player takes the first step.

For example, Microsoft stopped updating windows XP, and around that time, most major companies stopped releasing windows XP drivers.

For motherboard driver support, the CPU maker, pretty much dictates driver support from motherboard makers.

For example, if Zen will have no windows 7 support, thus a high chance that certain security updates may be withheld if they cause stability issues with Zen, then there will be little value using that CPU with that operating system; this in turn will make the OS less attractive overall when it comes to driver development. If the AM4 CPU will not be getting proper support on older versions of windows, then there is less incentive to allocate development resources for motherboard drivers (with their requisite QA testing and validation) for said OS.

Overall, like me, users who want to want to or are in the process of upgrading from an old Phenom II, or FX CPU, will see Skylake as a more appealing option compared to Zen. https://www.w3counter.com/globalstats.php?year=2016&month=11

Some of us simply prefer an OS like windows 7, over windows 10.
I personally used it for a few months as my main OS, and encountered too many, and ultimately upgraded to Windows 7, and simply have an install of windows 10, on a separate SSD that I can switch to if I need DX12. Since I keep the documents, photos, and other bulk data on my HDD, I can remain productive on both platforms, though I have a better experience on windows 7.

You do realize every new CPU at this point will only have Windows 10 support and nothing older? Meaning Kaby Lake and AMD's Zen are in the same boat for Windows support. Personally if you want to use Windows 7 then run older CPU's. Don't get a cutting edge CPU expecting to run an old OS on it and also have support. Or get the new CPU and run it unsupported. Windows 10 is a far better OS than Windows 7 so whatever issues you had are going to be your own experience. There are ways to make Windows 10 work like Windows 7 and it takes about 5 minutes to do it i.e download classic shell(For anyone balking at classic shell, if you want a new OS to look/work like the old one this is your best option otherwise move on with the new).

Nobody ever expects to run an older iOS or Android version than the phone or tablet comes with so I don't understand why people expect this of Microsoft. It is an unreasonable expectation. Yes it could hurt Zen sales but Microsoft is not in business to help other companies out, well not anymore.

 

[razor512]

Yep, Kaby lake is in the same boat, but unlike intel, AMD has nothing other than Zen that offers performance up to modern standards, but they have other CPUs with performance that is up to modern standards.

For AMD, it is the equivalent of the car company Stutz (they made their last cat in 1934), pouring all of their resources into, and then trying to make a comeback in 2017, by releasing a car that is not street legal. They may get some sales, but it will not be nearly as many as if they make a street legal car.

I currently have one drive dedicated to windows 7, and another dedicated to windows 10, but since I use an older OS as my main, I am using the skylake platform. It may not be the latest, but there is a small chance that it could last me through 2017 without becoming completely obsolete.

On the other hand, for AMD, the newest CPU they offer that is not based on Zen, has IPC that is slightly lower than that of the Phenom II (Chips from late 2009). A long time ago, I am not sure if it was tomshardware or another site that did a clock for clock comparison between the AMD generations where each CPU was benchmarked at 3 GHz, but it showed that their first gen core module design took a major IPC hit, then increased with the next generation of the core module design, but did not match the Phenom II.

 

[JamesSneed]

Yes but your argument is saying since AMD has been doing poorly if they come up with something that is great they might have have poorer sales because people on older OS'es wont upgrade. I think that argument albeit has some truth is kind of pointless as there is no other path other than AMD to keep sucking so I think AMD would very much give up the old OS upgrade sales if they can become competitive. They simply have to pull themselves out of the ditch before they can get back on the highway so to speak. Then they have to stay competitive for another generation and all will be OK with AMD if not well they will be back to bleeding cash.

 

[ledhead11]

I'm still team green and have been for most of the last 15 years but I admit that could change in 2-5 years depending what really happens. . . . . . .

That being said I AMD is really just playing a somewhat less risky strategy with many markets. They're truly not obsessed with being the best cutting edge on anything at the moment. They've said it and that's what they're doing.

No truly dominating GPU to completely overthrow NVIDA at the moment . .
No truly dominating CPU to completely overthrow Intel at the moment . .

However,

They're in Xbox, Playstation, courting Intel to provide IGP, and courting Apple for Mac's. You don't even have to think twice about how big those markets are and the revenue to understand why being the fastest/best means nothing to them.

It wouldn't hurt my feelings if they really came out with something to crush my 2x1080's, I'd know what to upgrade to in the future when 8k matters. It does, unfortunately, allow Intel to be somewhat lazy with releases these Kaby's are seeming to be just that. It also allows NVIDIA to keep raising the price ceiling for high end GPU's and providing more bargaining space for AMD's mid-low range offerings.

 

[kwc813]

As a high end builder for a living I let the manufacturers pay for the marketing.. because that really is all I see here! Let's see.. I'm gonna put a 7700k on a 270 chipset and.. do what with it that I can't do do with a 170? Y'all, I'm running a 2x 1070 SLI RIGHT BESIDE a 2x 1080 SLI on exactly the same X99 Rampage Extreme board with exactly the same memory and volts. I've swapped out all the i7's I have for a 2011 v3, and the only one that falls behind is the 5930K in a gaming enviorn. So buy the new 7700K, it's the next 4790K, same price range/more toys...but give me a real reason to wait for a 270 board, because THAT'S where the rubber meets the road...GOD I hate beta software AND hype!!! You want to tinker, go buy a '68 Camaro! I'm guessing the the 270's are really good showing off led's (wink, wink!).