Intel drops LaGrande

sargeduck

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I saw this post over at the <A HREF="http://www.techreport.com/ " target="_new">http://www.techreport.com/ </A>. Intel reliazed that consumers don't want LaGrande, and are taking it off their chips. It would seem that LaGrande will still appear in the Itanium chips, but at least this is a start. Now if only M$ would do the same with palladin.

As each day goes by, I hug my 9600Pro just a little tighter.
 
If true then that's a nice step forward. :)

<pre><A HREF="http://ars.userfriendly.org/cartoons/?id=20030905" target="_new"><font color=black>People don't understand how hard being a dark god can be. - Hastur</font color=black></A></pre><p>
 
Of course Law Enforcement, FBI and CIA have a back door even if u think u feel safe (even though Intel says they opted out of that, do u believe them?) :wink: Ever wonder why all those holes exist in MS? (Well maybe there are shitty programmers and maybe there are devious govt agents).
:evil:
Maybe you believe IRAQ has WOMD? I have great beachfront property for you on Iceland. It'll be all the rage soon. Get it while it's cheap.

Privacy concerns. False sense of security.
Wonder what happens if the processor fails or you want to use an AMD?
Loss of control of data on your machine.
Do you think your debit card is safe?
<A HREF="http://schlafly.blogspot.com/2002_10_01_schlafly_archive.html" target="_new">BlogSpot</A>
Why is Msft doing Palladium? The obvious answer is for digital rights management of copyrighted audio and video, better control over its own software licensing, and an attack on the open source software movement. According to this Wired story, Msft denies that Palladium could be used to enforce software piracy, so Lucky Green applied for his own patents on ideas for using Palladium that way. Clever. But I suspect that Msft, IBM, Intel, and HP already have a lot of patents pending for applications of Palladium (which Intel calls LaGrande and the others call TCPA).
One of the points of interest during IDF was Intel's statement on its next generation of chips, saying that anti-hacking/piracy technology (dubbed LaGrande) will be integrated for "user protection purposes".


Originally aimed as protection against viruses and hackers, it appears it's attracting the attention of the motion picture and recording industry. Content owners, for example, could prevent PCs that run LaGrande and security-enabled software such as Microsoft's upcoming Palladium security technology from copying CDs, forwarding certain documents, or running unlicensed software.

Content creation software could theoretically then "tag" content created on a specific computer, and prevent it from being moved off that machine. Can you imagine not being able to transfer audio and video files?

Where Internet security technologies already protect information in transit
between a PCs and remote servers, LaGrande and Palladium attempt to
safeguard information and software once it is already on a PC. The idea is to
partition off parts of a computer into protected sections dubbed "vaults,"
and protect the pathways between those areas and keyboards, monitors and
other accessories.

All of this "innovative" technology should be included in Intel's Prescott chip design, which will succeed the Pentium 4 in the second half of 2003.

I hoping this will turn out like Intel's Pentium III serial number "feature". Otherwise, I'd gladly pay a premium for a CPU that doesn't contain these added "features".
<A HREF="http://
http://comment.cio.com/soundoff/091202.html" target="_new"> Some comments </A>

<A HREF="http://www.idg.com.sg/idgwww.nsf/0/FADB602B07631C8948256DA400214FD7?opendocument" target="_new">Intel Side</A>



The loving are the daring!
 
You are so naive and at the same time paranoid...

Of course Law Enforcement, FBI and CIA have a back door even if u think u feel safe...
If anyone discovers back doors in the technology that are meant to be used by these instances, Intel is dead. Besides, today it's very easy to get privacy information. So do you feel safe now? Besides, if CIA/FBI want information from you then you're probably a drug baron?

Do you trust Microsoft that they are not sending bits of private information in every IP packet? Do you trust every manufacturer of hardware components that they are not abusing anything? Sigh. You just have to accept that you lay your so-called security in the hands of these companies.

Why fear Iraq for the sequrity of your personal computer? What will they do, steal the nude pictures of your girlfriend? And again, it's easier for them to get access/take control over your computer now than it will be with La Grande technology.

I use my debit card daily. Is there any reason to doubt its security? No, I don't think it's total 100% secure, and I don't have to trust the companies that are involved in my money transactions. And if the government want's my account status they have it in a snap. But does that stop me from using my debit card?

So, if you fear La Grande, you'd better never use any kind of electronic money transaction. Better even, lock yourself in an underground bunker without any connection to the live above. Only then you have total privacy. Maybe...

I have nothing to hide. What do you have to hide that La Grande could leak undetectedly?
 
A-freaking-men!

Damn it people are truly paranoid over Palladium and LaGrande, seriously.


--
<A HREF="http://www.lochel.com/THGC/album.html" target="_new"><font color=blue><b>Are you ugly and looking into showing your mug? Then the THGC Album is the right place for you!</b></font color=blue></A>
 
What? This technology is to give you extra security and -not- adding it is a step forward?
Damn f-ing straight that's a step forward!

<b>"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Benjamin Franklin</b>

It's <i>my</i> data and <i>no one</i> is going to restrict how I can and can't use it <i>especially</i> if that use falls very clearly within my rights under Fair Use laws.

Added security? As if! If you want a secure PC then get a damned external firewall appliance and take the time to set it up correctly. If you want a secure PC then actually take the time to go through what services it's loading up on startup. If you want a secure PC then stop making your primary logon account have administrator-level access to the whole damned PC. If you want a secure PC then for f-ing sake stop leaving it plugged into the internet 24/7 and actually only plug it in to that enormous outside network full of hackers when you <i>actually use</i> the internet.

I'm sure as hell not about to give up <i>my</i> rights just because Joe Blow is too <i>stupid</i> to properly set up their own PC to be safe. At least not while I actually still have a choice in the matter.

<pre><A HREF="http://ars.userfriendly.org/cartoons/?id=20030905" target="_new"><font color=black>People don't understand how hard being a dark god can be. - Hastur</font color=black></A></pre><p>
 
**applause**

---
<font color=red>The preceding text is assembled from information stored in an unreliable organic storage medium. As such it may be innacurate, incomplete, or completely wrong</font color=red> :wink:
 
So what about the rest of the world that doesnt know anything about security. Your view is to narrow you need to look at the big picture. They want to secure their end users/partners anyway they can, this is what general/corporate/industrial/military/educational/finacial/energy/aeronautic ect. users demand they are tired of virus, hackers, and data theft. You dont want it dont run it.

Jesus you guys made a huge deal about this when they first announced it. Its a option and will be for a short time.

You know who I think will be up to bat on LaGrande first the USA. Home Land Security has the US soo uptight about everything all Intel has to say is it keeps terrorist at bay. The US public will accept this regardless as will the world, It's needed plain and simple.

-Jeremy

:evil: <A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k1=6940439" target="_new">Busting Sh@t Up!!!</A> :evil:
:evil: <A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k3=1228088" target="_new">Busting More Sh@t Up!!!</A> :evil:
 
This is not entirely true.

Intel has stated they will be including LaGrande on some desktop chips. The consumer will have the choice to buy chips with or without LaGrande. The chips that come with it will also have the ability to turn it off in the bios much like hyperthreading.

<font color=white>---</font color=white>
Wanted: Large breasted live-in housekeeper. Must be a good cook, organized, and willing to pick up after me.
 
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Benjamin Franklin
Franklin has never seen the computer era so this quote has absolutely no relevance to today's situation.

It's my data and no one is going to restrict how I can and can't use it especially if that use falls very clearly within my rights under Fair Use laws.
Damn right it's your data. La Grande doesn't change a thing about that. On the contrary, it protects it from chages made by programs and users that unrightfully try to access it. I don't see where your paranoia comes from.

Added security? As if! If you want a secure PC then get a damned external firewall appliance and take the time to set it up correctly. If you want a secure PC then actually take the time to go through what services it's loading up on startup. If you want a secure PC then stop making your primary logon account have administrator-level access to the whole damned PC. If you want a secure PC then for f-ing sake stop leaving it plugged into the internet 24/7 and actually only plug it in to that enormous outside network full of hackers when you actually use the internet.
Three problems: time, money and knowledge. You need to take extra time to get this added level of sequrity. You might be willing to spend that time, many people don't. These sequrity programs can cost quite a lot. You might be willing to spend that money, many people don't. To setup, use and maintain these programs, you need to have extra knowledge besides what you need to know to actually -work- with your computer. You might be willing to learn all that, many people don't.

For the people that "don't", there's an easy solution to keep hackers and viruses away. It's called La Grande. Period.

I'm sure as hell not about to give up my rights just because Joe Blow is too stupid to properly set up their own PC to be safe. At least not while I actually still have a choice in the matter.
Stop being to paranoid. Joe Blow is not the cause of any loss of rights. Joe H4x0r is the cause of your loss of sequrity, not Intel.
 
I prefer to look at myself as a realist and not be nearly naive as you. :smile: Paranoid, perhaps. But look at some of the worlds gov'ts. They prefer Linux to MS, even though MS opens it code. Why?

Anyway, the point here is that someone is grabbing more control and constraining me. I'm not sure that it will be to my general welfare and would prefer that they stop thinking for me.

The Benjamin Franklin quote is as applicable to the time and world of computers as it was in the day was uttered. (and opinion of course).


The loving are the daring!
 
I prefer to look at myself as a realist and not be nearly naive as you. Paranoid, perhaps. But look at some of the worlds gov'ts. They prefer Linux to MS, even though MS opens it code. Why?
What do you want to prove with that?
Anyway, the point here is that someone is grabbing more control and constraining me. I'm not sure that it will be to my general welfare and would prefer that they stop thinking for me.
Ok, tell me, exactly what part of La Grande is grabbing mroe control or restraining you? If you're "not sure" then why do you condamn it before it's even used?
The Benjamin Franklin quote is as applicable to the time and world of computers as it was in the day was uttered. (and opinion of course).
No it isn't as applicable. For ordinary day life, maybe. But not to computer related stuff. There simply always has to be some trust, or you would have to invent your own computer and internet, but then everybody would have to trust you. You live in a paranoid world if you trust hackers more than Intel.

And if you still think I'm naive, then tell me, what is the worst thing that could happen to my "general welfare" if I trust Intel's La Grande technology?<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by c0d1f1ed on 09/19/03 09:50 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
 
Franklin has never seen the computer era so this quote has absolutely no relevance to today's situation.
I disagree completely. If anything it's more true because it came from someone whos thoughts haven't been affected by modern influences. Saying that it has no relevance because the idea came from someone who has never seen the computer era is like saying that the Constitution is worthless because its authors had never lived through the information age.

Damn right it's your data. La Grande doesn't change a thing about that. On the contrary, it protects it from chages made by programs and users that unrightfully try to access it. I don't see where your paranoia comes from.
On the contrary, it prevents me from being able to use my purchased data in ways that are well within my rights just because <i>some</i> people abuse those rights.

My 'paranoia' is that if I purchase a CD or a DVD, music, data, or otherwise, I have <i>every</i> right to both make a hard backup and to transport that data to a different media. I will <i>not</i> give up these rights while I have a choice.

Saying that any form of DRM is acceptable because of the behavior of some computer users is like saying that drivers licenses must become a microchip implanted in your skin because some people drive without a license or that auto insurance has to be a mandatory portion of people's car payments because some people drive without insurance. It's like saying that all telephones have to be operated by credit cards because some people don't pay their phone bills. It's like saying that VCRs require a digital photographic scan of the box that a video tape came in because some people copy videos or that VCRs can no longer have a specific line out for video and audio channels because those can be fed into devices other than TVs where they might be used to copy data, whether for legal uses or not. That's like saying that all internet service providers must now require some form of age verification every time a web page is accessed because some kids choose to look at things that they know they shouldn't.

Three problems: time, money and knowledge. You need to take extra time to get this added level of sequrity. You might be willing to spend that time, many people don't. These sequrity programs can cost quite a lot. You might be willing to spend that money, many people don't. To setup, use and maintain these programs, you need to have extra knowledge besides what you need to know to actually -work- with your computer. You might be willing to learn all that, many people don't.
Your argument is baseless. First of all PCs are hardly ever handed out for free, so money is a laughable excuse. Besides which, the use of a computer is not a constitutionally granted right inherant to all people. It's a privalege of money. If you can't afford it, then don't do it.

Second of all time is just as laughable. It hardly takes any time at all when compared to seting up a PC or even just installing something as simple as MS Office. And if people didn't have time then they wouldn't surf the internet in non-productive ways and wouldn't run non-productive software (I.E. games) on their PC.

Third is knowledge, which is just as pathetic of an excuse. If in the age of information a person can use a PC but <i>not</i> be capable of finding this knowledge then I dare say that they wouldn't even be able to use their PC in the first place.

And again, <i>all</i> of your arguments go back to one simple point: Is the user <i>willing</i>? Since when is willingness an acceptable opt-out for responsability? Say someone irresponsibly gets drunk at a bar and then drives home, well past intoxicated. Now say that someone in front of them slams on their brakes, and the drunken driver is too intoxicated to hit their own brakes in time to avoid causing an accident. Just because the driver wasn't <i>willing</i> to pay that extra money for a taxi or <i>willing</i> to take that extra time to walk home does not in any way make them less responsible for the accident and certainly not any less responsible for the damage that may happen to themself and their car.

Using a PC is no different from anything else. If you can't use it responsibly then at the very minimum you're at least partially responsible for any damages caused by your irresponsible usage.

For the people that "don't", there's an easy solution to keep hackers and viruses away. It's called La Grande. Period.
Actually, it's also called Palladin, DRM, and several other names. And so long as that's exactly what it is, an option, a <b>not required</b> feature to protect the people who are otherwise too irresponsible to properly use their own PC, then I have absolutely no problem with it. Let it be a non-required feature that I can either not buy or disable without in any way affecting any of my PC usage. Then it's a tool and it's <i>great</i>! Yes, I said that DRM as a <i>non-required tool</i> is great. However as a requirement that cannot be disabled and my software cannot run without it, <i>that</i> is just plain wrong.

Stop being to paranoid. Joe Blow is not the cause of any loss of rights. Joe H4x0r is the cause of your loss of sequrity, not Intel.
Completely incorrect as is all of your argument so far. Joe Blow is exactly the cause of the loss of rights by not standing up for his rights. Joe H4X0r is only responsible for the damage caused. Society is responsible for the reaction to that damage. RIAA has every right to sue individuals and reclaim damages. If <i>we</i> as members of society however allow big businesses to take away our rights, <i>we</i> are the ones responsible for our loss of freedom.

The problem with you and so many people in the world today is that no one wants to accept that they're actually responsible for anything anymore. The mentality is that it's always someone else's fault. No, I'm not responsible for my kids being so mentally warped that they walked into school with a gun and killed 32 people. No, it must be the fault of the people who made those evil video games that I purchased for them. It must be the fault of the evil Hollywood producers who made those awful movies that I let them watch even though the rating on the movie clearly states that it isn't intended for them at their young age. I'm not responsible. It's someone else's fault!

Well face the fact: If <i>you</i> allow someone to take your rights away without even putting up a fight, then <i>you</i> are just as responsible for the loss of those rights as everyone else who did the same.

I however take on the responsability to fight that abuse of power and to protect our rights.

And this is coming from a software engineer who loses money every time someone illegally copies my work. People's rights are far more important than a few dollars.

<pre><A HREF="http://ars.userfriendly.org/cartoons/?id=20030905" target="_new"><font color=black>People don't understand how hard being a dark god can be. - Hastur</font color=black></A></pre><p>
 
There simply always has to be some trust, or you would have to invent your own computer and internet, but then everybody would have to trust you. You live in a paranoid world if you trust hackers more than Intel.
Oh what a nice universe you must live in where everyone trusts one another so openly. What a wonderful place to live where you can trust that no one would ever mug you with a legally purchased gun. Where no one would ever charge you more at McFastFoods than what your meal should cost so that they can pocket the difference. Where no one would ever fiddle with gas pumps so that you pay for more gas than is actually put into your tank. Where you can trust that every airline mechanic and pilot <i>always</i> inspects the plane for any defect whatsoever so that every single flight is safe. Where everyone who goes out to drink at the pub always stops before they've reached the legal limit of intoxication. What a wonderful universe that must be to live in.

All I know is that <i>here</i>, in the <b>real</b> universe, you can't trust <i>anyone</i>. No matter how many laws, how many rules, how many regulations, you just <i>can't</i> blindly trust. Why? Because people have rights and <i>some</i> people abuse those rights.

Trust has nothing to do with DRM. Trust is no justification for throwing away people's rights. By your logic we should just all be lobotomized so that we can trust that we'll never ever stab anyone with a kitchen knife or run over someone with a car. We don't need any rights. We should just trust in some great power to control our every choice so that we can never do anything wrong. Why, that would fix <i>everything</i>!

<pre><A HREF="http://ars.userfriendly.org/cartoons/?id=20030905" target="_new"><font color=black>People don't understand how hard being a dark god can be. - Hastur</font color=black></A></pre><p>
 
On the contrary, it prevents me from being able to use my purchased data in ways that are well within my rights just because some people abuse those rights.
It does not limit you in your rights. If someone abuses it, that person has to be prosecuted. And with La Grande it's easier to detect abuse than without. For example it could detect when a program is attempting to read or write priviledged data. La Grande is not above the law.

My 'paranoia' is that if I purchase a CD or a DVD, music, data, or otherwise, I have every right to both make a hard backup and to transport that data to a different media. I will not give up these rights while I have a choice.
What makes you believe La Grande restricts you from doing these things, within the boundaries of law?

Saying that any form of DRM is acceptable because of the behavior of some computer users is like saying that drivers licenses must become a microchip implanted in your skin because some people drive without a license or that auto insurance has to be a mandatory portion of people's car payments because some people drive without insurance.
Digital Rights Management. Damn, it has the word 'rights' in it. Your rights, but also those of the company who created the data. And if you had a company yourself, wouldn't you want to prevent people from doing unrightful things with -your- stuff?

Driving a car without a lisence is a crime that has to be punished. Implanting a chip is no better than having it on paper so I don't see what you're trying to proof.

It's like saying that all telephones have to be operated by credit cards because some people don't pay their phone bills.
People that don't pay their telephone bills can't call. At least that how it works in my country...

It's like saying that VCRs require a digital photographic scan of the box that a video tape came in because some people copy videos or that VCRs can no longer have a specific line out for video and audio channels because those can be fed into devices other than TVs where they might be used to copy data, whether for legal uses or not.
Well, actually they should have protection as well. But... the problem is much smaller here than with computers. With internet you can do illegal stuff en masse without anyone noticing it and without knowing your identity. That's inacceptable.

That's like saying that all internet service providers must now require some form of age verification every time a web page is accessed because some kids choose to look at things that they know they shouldn't.
I don't see a need for that because there's no law that says they can't do it. Again, that's how it works in my country...

Your argument is baseless. First of all PCs are hardly ever handed out for free, so money is a laughable excuse. Besides which, the use of a computer is not a constitutionally granted right inherant to all people. It's a privalege of money. If you can't afford it, then don't do it.
Oh, many people do have the money. But I'd rather save 50 € and take my girlfriend to a romantic night out. But if you prefer to buy a firewall with that money... Actually, if I get you right, you'd rather have computer prices to be tenfold, so that only rich people like yourself who inherently are better people for working with computers can buy one.

Second of all time is just as laughable. It hardly takes any time at all when compared to seting up a PC or even just installing something as simple as MS Office. And if people didn't have time then they wouldn't surf the internet in non-productive ways and wouldn't run non-productive software (I.E. games) on their PC.
Yes, setup time is nothing. But it's the time you actually lose with protecting your data that concerns me. For example, suppose the whole world is harassing your firewall while you're working (or, say, playing Quake). What will you do, disconnect? The same goes for viruses. People that are not fully aware of the dangers can loose all their precious data. That can take days to recover. All lost time that might have been prevented with La Grande technology.

Third is knowledge, which is just as pathetic of an excuse. If in the age of information a person can use a PC but not be capable of finding this knowledge then I dare say that they wouldn't even be able to use their PC in the first place.
Ok, let me give an example. One of my friends is making a doctorate thesis about the vegetation patterns in an African reserve. He uses data from a NASA sattelite and uses a 100,000 € program for processing the data. He's nearly an expert at using this program. On the other hand, he's very bad at managing his computer, and maybe even a newbie hacker could get access to his precious data. So, he -could- learn how to manage and protect his stuff, but that's just lost time for him and it simply doesn't interest him. Regularly someone gives him a hand, but wouldn't it all be simpler if security was implicit with La Grande technology?

And again, all of your arguments go back to one simple point: Is the user willing? Since when is willingness an acceptable opt-out for responsability? Say someone irresponsibly gets drunk at a bar and then drives home, well past intoxicated. Now say that someone in front of them slams on their brakes, and the drunken driver is too intoxicated to hit their own brakes in time to avoid causing an accident. Just because the driver wasn't willing to pay that extra money for a taxi or willing to take that extra time to walk home does not in any way make them less responsible for the accident and certainly not any less responsible for the damage that may happen to themself and their car.
Oh, so if a hacker steals some of your data, it's your fault? The only one who did something wrong was the hacker. Unfortunately, without La Gande technology he can do things unnoticed and anonymously. With it, it's possible to detect any abuse and it might even retrieve identification data, from him!

Using a PC is no different from anything else. If you can't use it responsibly then at the very minimum you're at least partially responsible for any damages caused by your irresponsible usage.
Well, a virus or a hacker taking your data is not "your irresponsible usage", is it? It's the hacker's (ab)usage. What you suggest is that people without protection should rightfully get attacks. Sick.

Actually, it's also called Palladin, DRM, and several other names. And so long as that's exactly what it is, an option, a not required feature to protect the people who are otherwise too irresponsible to properly use their own PC, then I have absolutely no problem with it. Let it be a non-required feature that I can either not buy or disable without in any way affecting any of my PC usage. Then it's a tool and it's great! Yes, I said that DRM as a non-required tool is great. However as a requirement that cannot be disabled and my software cannot run without it, that is just plain wrong.
Don't mix the hardware with the software. La Grande is hardware, a bunch of transistors, and innocent in itself. That's why you should't reject it, especially since it can be turned off. It gives you new possibilities, and that's always a good thing. Period.

Now about Palladium, that's another story. It's a piece of software that can abuse the hardware. But... they simply can't do that. If a program requires it, and it's doing something unrightful, the program will not sell. It's as simple as that. New altenatives will appear that do use it rightfully, or not at all. Either way, La Grande nor Palladium is above the law.

Completely incorrect as is all of your argument so far. Joe Blow is exactly the cause of the loss of rights by not standing up for his rights. Joe H4X0r is only responsible for the damage caused. Society is responsible for the reaction to that damage. RIAA has every right to sue individuals and reclaim damages. If we as members of society however allow big businesses to take away our rights, we are the ones responsible for our loss of freedom.
What makes you think Joe Blow will not stand up for his rights? If the technology prevents him from doing something the rightfully could do without it, he has all the reason to sue who's responsible.

The problem with you and so many people in the world today is that no one wants to accept that they're actually responsible for anything anymore. The mentality is that it's always someone else's fault. No, I'm not responsible for my kids being so mentally warped that they walked into school with a gun and killed 32 people. No, it must be the fault of the people who made those evil video games that I purchased for them. It must be the fault of the evil Hollywood producers who made those awful movies that I let them watch even though the rating on the movie clearly states that it isn't intended for them at their young age. I'm not responsible. It's someone else's fault!
I completely agree... But it doesn't apply to this situation. If my data gets stolen because I did not install some sequrity program, it's really not my fault but the hacker's. If parents let young kids play ultra-violent games, they simply can't ignore responsability if anything goes wrong. That's something completely different. Go to court with the hacker, and you'll certainly win. Go to court with the game programmers and you might end up in jail yourself if you encouraged your kids to play games not meant for their age.

Well face the fact: If you allow someone to take your rights away without even putting up a fight, then you are just as responsible for the loss of those rights as everyone else who did the same.
Huray for La Grande then. Because it's a lot easier to put up a fight with a company that has a name, than with an anonymous hacker. Sure, you can block him, but you can't stop him. That's the problem. And like you just said, you're just as responsible if you don't try to catch him. La Grande could help.

And this is coming from a software engineer who loses money every time someone illegally copies my work. People's rights are far more important than a few dollars.
And isn't it a right that your software gets protected from illegal copying and cracking then? And this comes from a programmer who has not found a definitive way to protect programs with CD-Keys, epiration days and online registration. La Grande gives the hardware support that is supposed to make it uncrackable. Ok I'm a bit sceptic about that but...

All I'm asking for is: give it a chance. Me nor you have seen it in action and know exactly what it is capable of or not. That's why I do not applaud the news that Intel removes it from some chips. Maybe in a few years when it's introduced on every computer, nobody will want to go back to the time when you had to hack your own computer to see if it's safe. Maybe not...
 
Tell me something. Where do you think the home computer market would be today if everyone paid for each piece of software, music, information? Do you think it is convenient for certain companies to turn a blind eye?



The loving are the daring!<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by Flinx on 09/19/03 08:02 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
 
Tell me something. Where do you think the home computer market would be today if everyone paid for each piece of software, music, information? Do you think it is convenient for certain companies to turn a blind eye?
I knew someone was going to ask this. :smile:

The answer is quite simple. La Grande 'allows' free usage under certain restrictions.

Let me explain with an example. First I had a student license for using Visual Studio .NET, which costed me a little less than 50 €. That's not much, but the license only allowed me non-commercial development. But of course, Microsoft can't really check this so they have to trust me. On the other hand they want as many students as possible to use the program so they get used to it and later buy the commercial license version.

With La Grande, it might be possible for them to allow -everybody- to use it non-commercially, at no cost. That's good for both the students and Microsoft. So, if you have La Grande enabled, pay nothing if you use it non-commercially. I you want to keep it disabled, pay 50 € and use it on a trust basis.

Another example is if you want to try some software before you buy it. That's actually a right, isn't it? Still, many companies don't have 30-day trial versions because they know it's going to be cracked anyway. With La Grande, that might be secured and more companies will allow you to test before you buy.

Either way, La Grande gives companies and the end user new possibilities. So instead of hampering new technologies by being paranoid, we should welcome it and give it a fair chance... Like I said before, one day you might not want to live without it!
 
Why is your answer so redirecting and evasive?

Do you work for MS, Intel, the Gov't, music industry or other organization with an obvious vested interest in this garbage?

The loving are the daring!<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by Flinx on 09/20/03 05:10 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
 
Forget about Benjamin Franklin and the Constitution, and all that wrote it...that sh*t's all old...times have changed...it doesn't apply today. Thats right, times have changed...we have forgotten the people that founded this country just got done living under an oppressive government, and knew that if safegaurds weren't built into our Constitution, as time went by, we would be right back to where we started. Most people, if given power, will as time goes by, want more power (and think they deserve more power). That is just the nature of man. Look back in history, how many free countries have there been? If we want to keep this country free and great, we MUST maintain it. Everything made by man, if left unmaintained, will crumble. Big money/power will always try take over...one only has to take a quick look back in history. So forget about people like Benjamin Franklin and our Constitution ...it's old...things are different...it doesn't work today.....how quick we forget.

Bill


Just an after thought:
I think I just read something about a proposed luxury tax on high end coffee shops like Starbucks. I think an other beverage...tea I think...had something to do with the start of this country...not sure though...it was such a long time ago
 
(not really directed to anyone) but this really reminds me of the microcodes implimented on the PII(?) and piii's. But they could also be disabled, they never picked up much steam though.


Proud owner of DOS 3.3 :smile:
 
There is no need for this 'technology'. Educate as many people as possible on the virtures of safe computing... that's all that is necessary. If more people kept their software up to date, there would be less of this crap happening. The fix for the Blaster worm (for example) was available a month and a half BEFORE the worm hit.

<font color=red> If you design software that is fool-proof, only a fool will want to use it. </font color=red>
 

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