Review Nvidia GeForce RTX 4070 Ti Review: A Costly 70-Class GPU

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chalabam

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For CPU reviews, you can make the argument that testing at high makes more sense, because you want to shift the bottleneck back to the CPU if possible. This is also why Paul tests with a 4090 now, and conversely why I test with a 13900K. Put the focus on the component you're testing as much as possible. In an ideal world, with infinite time and systems and parts, you'd test each GPU on each CPU. But just gathering the data for GPUs from one CPU can take weeks, depending on how many GPUs you want to test.
Unfortunately, in the real world, customers have a limited budget, so the real question is about deciding between spending that budget in the GPU, or in the CPU.

Because a weaker CPU can bottleneck a powerful GPU, knowing the benchmarks only for the best hardware available has low utility.

It is wrong to assume that a mid range CPU should be accompanied with a mid range GPU. Sometimes a low range CPU paired with the highest GPU is better (or worse, or the other way)

Educated guesses can be made about it, but educated guesses never have the confidence provided by actual tests.
 
Unfortunately, in the real world, customers have a limited budget, so the real question is about deciding between spending that budget in the GPU, or in the CPU.

Because a weaker CPU can bottleneck a powerful GPU, knowing the benchmarks only for the best hardware available has low utility.

It is wrong to assume that a mid range CPU should be accompanied with a mid range GPU. Sometimes a low range CPU paired with the highest GPU is better (or worse, or the other way)

Educated guesses can be made about it, but educated guesses never have the confidence provided by actual tests.
This is why people have to do research. We show the maximum performance you can expect from the GPUs using the fastest CPU available, and we show the maximum performance you can expect from CPUs using the fastest GPU available. So, if you're looking at an RTX 3080 as an example, look at the results from the resolution you want to run, then reference the CPU tests and find a CPU that gets a higher value than the 3080 achieved. In practice, that generally means you won't end up very CPU limited with that particular GPU. I should possibly write an article on this, with limited benchmarking... except I really only have access to a few CPUs and they're all pretty high-end. I suppose I can break out the 9900K still as a stand in for modern i3/i5/Ryzen 5.
 

chalabam

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I'm not going to try to make things pretty, but I do have the data. (1) = 1080p medium, (2) = 1080p Ultra, (3) = 1440p Ultra, and (4) = 4K Ultra (in the file names on the left). Here are the DLSS numbers:
Thanks for the data. This is the best bang for the Watt ever.

I had seen on Youtube, even when it cannot play more than 60 fps, that DLSS 3 looks smoother, probably because more frames can be rendered closer to the pace of 60 fps frames.
One reason for which games look smother, is because most mouses are implemented in games in such a way that screen rotation only allows discrete jumps in rotation, so no matter how high the fps, rotations never look smooth. DLSS3 fixes it.

Many years ago, because video players like Splash Pro have frame interpolation, I asked to Nvidia on his official forum to implement something like DLSS 3. I asked again when Nvidia launched DLSS 2.
So I may had been who triggered it into existence, and I was happy about finally having it available on geforces.
Unfortunately, at this prices, I'm not able to afford this cards. I will have to skip this generation.

I also asked for frame extrapolation, youtube and desktop interpolation. Maybe the next generation will implement it, reducing the problem with latency.
 
Thanks for the data. This is the best bang for the Watt ever.

I had seen on Youtube, even when it cannot play more than 60 fps, that DLSS 3 looks smoother, probably because more frames can be rendered closer to the pace of 60 fps frames.
One reason for which games look smother, is because most mouses are implemented in games in such a way that screen rotation only allows discrete jumps in rotation, so no matter how high the fps, rotations never look smooth. DLSS3 fixes it.

Many years ago, because video players like Splash Pro have frame interpolation, I asked to Nvidia on his official forum to implement something like DLSS 3. I asked again when Nvidia launched DLSS 2.
So I may had been who triggered it into existence, and I was happy about finally having it available on geforces.
Unfortunately, at this prices, I'm not able to afford this cards. I will have to skip this generation.

I also asked for frame extrapolation, youtube and desktop interpolation. Maybe the next generation will implement it, reducing the problem with latency.
Do note that DLSS 3 making video output look smoother isn't the same as a game actually running better. In fact, viewing DLSS3 content off the web is probably the best-case scenario, because you don't have to feel whether the game is actually running at more than 60 fps or not (for input). I have noticed in a few cases where if you're on a high refresh rate display, going from ~60 fps to ~100 fps with DLSS3 does look smoother, and 60 fps input is probably fast enough that almost no one will really notice the latency. But if you're doing something like 35 fps base with 60 fps via DLSS 3, the lower input rate can be felt. It's still playable, but it's not as good as "real" 60 fps.
 

Co BIY

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This is why people have to do research. We show the maximum performance you can expect from the GPUs using the fastest CPU available, and we show the maximum performance you can expect from CPUs using the fastest GPU available. So, if you're looking at an RTX 3080 as an example, look at the results from the resolution you want to run, then reference the CPU tests and find a CPU that gets a higher value than the 3080 achieved. In practice, that generally means you won't end up very CPU limited with that particular GPU. I should possibly write an article on this, with limited benchmarking... except I really only have access to a few CPUs and they're all pretty high-end. I suppose I can break out the 9900K still as a stand in for modern i3/i5/Ryzen 5.

Looking forward to this article!
 

Phaaze88

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Lots of other outlets are mentioning how the $800 MSRP is practically false advertisement as Nvidia made margins so small partners are telling them its impossible to sell a 4070ti at that price and not lose money.

So, IMO, the 4070ti is overpriced crap. MSRP should be no more than $649.
PC gaming is going to the rich and while the short term profits are good for AMD and Nvidia they fail to realize how much they are killing their own customer base. 2 years from now they might regret their approach and how they helped kill the market when they cannot sell their products.

I've already turned to Xbox Series X and Steam Deck.
I'll continue to use my 1080ti until it cannot play games decent any more but after that I might just abandon PC gaming outside of my Steam Deck.
Mobile games and games designed around Macrotransactions already show that enough big spenders can more than make up for the masses not spending.

If what AMD and Nvidia are doing here works... well, lets say plebs need not apply to PC gaming.

4090s are out because Nvidia's putting those chips in their Hopper gpus, which have even higher profit margins, so they gave the bird to folks looking/waiting for them to come back in stock.
 

Reclusive Eagle

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The price is Not almost palatable, stop trying to sell this nonsense
You're literally getting a 3090 Ti for $799 wtf are you talking about?
Have people become so delusional that completing saturating 1080p and 1440p and making playable 4k a reality is not impressive enough for you? Every 2 years the 80/90 card of the previous generation becomes the new 60/70. In 6 years we've gone from under 1000 cuda cores to almost 17,000 on the 4090. Is a 1700% increase not enough for you to justify paying the literally once a decade price??? 5 billion transistors to 76 billion in 7 years and people are crying that's not enough.

Yet you're willing to buy a new phone every year for $1000 to mindlessly scroll through whatsapp, tiktok and instagram but won't pay 2/3rds that for a GPU??? "My fav youtuber says so!" the blind belief in sensationalist YouTube videos is mind blowing.
 
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PlaneInTheSky

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Yet you're willing to buy a new phone every year for $1000 to mindlessly scroll through whatsapp, tiktok and instagram but won't pay 2/3rds that for a GPU???

Where do you live that people are still buying new $1000 phones every year. Beverly Hills?

Maybe that's the target audience for the latest generations of GPU then. The super wealthy.

Those cheaper Chinese GPU are starting to look better by the minute. Where do us plebs who aren't millionaires import them? Maybe Tomshardware can review them for us poor people who aren't buying "$1000 phones every year".
 
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PlaneInTheSky

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Big 4070 Ti availability at LDLC, one of Europe's biggest hardware retailers.

About 80% of the 4070 Ti models are available and in stock. Average price is around €1000, which is a crazy high price to me.

LDLC:
ZOTAC GeForce RTX 4070 Ti Trinity OC
€999
IN STOCK

Gainward GeForce RTX 4070 Ti Phantom
€1469
IN STOCK

ASUS TUF Gaming GeForce RTX 4070 Ti OC Edition 12GB
€1099
IN STOCK

MSI GeForce RTX 4070 Ti VENTUS 3X 12G OC
€899
OUT OF STOCK

PNY GeForce RTX 4070 Ti 12GB XLR8 Gaming Verto
€1089
OUT OF STOCK

ZOTAC GeForce RTX 4070 Ti Trinity OC
€999
IN STOCK

Gigabyte GeForce RTX 4070 Ti EAGLE OC 12G
€1049
IN STOCK

Gainward GeForce RTX 4070 Ti Phantom REUNION
€999
IN STOCK
 
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SunRoseAlice

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Do you not know what "almost" means? And while some would take "palatable" to mean really tasty, that's not the way I normally use it. I use it more as "acceptable but not awesome." I wouldn't call an excellent dinner "palatable," I'd say it was delicious or some other word that means I really like it. Taco Bell is palatable, for example. So is Wendy's. But neither is great, just like an $800 replacement that's only moderately faster than the outgoing $800 cards.

$800 is MSRP for Founders cards. However, the ASUS TUFF you show and test is $850 while other AIB cards like the Gigabyte Gaming OC is priced at $899. Other Board Partner 4070Ti Cards are up to $1000 or more. And while I hope its some error I have seen some 4070 Ti pre-sale priced at $1600. We're a little beyond dipping salty fries in refreshing soft serve shakes as a treat.

In fairness, chip supply/cost still hasn't fully recovered and the number one supply of neon, which is necessary is PC component production, happens to be invaded by Russia at the moment. Therefore, I think people need to chill a little on their luxury item cost expectations. However, NVIDIA nor AMD are exactly acting in relative best lights. Therefore, let's not mislead pricing, even if on accident, on how much these cards are actually going to cost people, and then throw dictionaries at people.

Only Makishima Shogo gets to do that.
 
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$800 is MSRP for Founders cards. However, the ASUS TUFF you show and test is $850 while other AIB cards like the Gigabyte Gaming OC is priced at $899. Other Board Partner 4070Ti Cards are up to $1000 or more. And while I hope its some error I have seen some 4070 Ti pre-sale priced at $1600. We're a little beyond dipping salty fries in refreshing soft serve shakes as a treat.

In fairness, chip supply/cost still hasn't fully recovered and the number one supply of neon, which is necessary is PC component production, happens to be invaded by Russia at the moment. Therefore, I think people need to chill a little on their luxury item cost expectations. However, NVIDIA nor AMD are exactly acting in relative best lights. Therefore, let's not mislead pricing, even if on accident, on how much these cards are actually going to cost people, and then throw dictionaries at people.

Only Makishima Shogo gets to do that.
The point is that "almost palatable" is a backhanded compliment at best. It was not meant to be taken as a good thing, so I roll my eyes when someone misinterprets that. Especially with a headline that emphasizes the high price, and a subheader that also emphasizes the cost. Reading comprehension is dead if anyone thinks I'm trying to say the price is great. There are reasons for the pricing, yes, but also AMD has a card with 67% more memory and an extra 185 mm^2 of TSMC N6 die size to deal with, and it costs $100 more than the 4070 Ti. Meaning, Nvidia could have sold this for $699 no problem.

Except as I also said, scalpers probably would have pushed the price up if it were "only" $700. Damned if we do, damned if we don't.
 
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dpeter45

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Personal attacks will not be tolerated
<MOD EDIT Personal Attack Removed> This card costs twice what a 70 card normally goes for. That's straight up price gouging. PC gaming will quickly die as a hobby if these prices continue. Video cards should not cost as much as used cars.
 
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chalabam

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But if you're doing something like 35 fps base with 60 fps via DLSS 3, the lower input rate can be felt. It's still playable, but it's not as good as "real" 60 fps.
Yes, but that is not a problem created by DLSS 3. The problem is almost the same when DLSS 3 is disabled: that the game is actually running at 35 fps.
Maybe in the future more computing load will be moved to the gpu, to better match user input with what is actually displayed.
 

M0rtis

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People with bad financial practicality are ruining things for the average mainstream consumers.
$800+ for an upper mid range GPU
$1000+ for a flagship phone became the norm a few years ago
Dont know about the price of cars in the USA and Europe but the same models cost 50-80% more than they did when introduced 3-5 years ago and yet have wait times stretching from 6-12 months
AFAIK people arent making more money than they did before especially post covid but still we are seeing some crazy prices
 

rDigital

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Anything short of a 0/5 for this card and telling people not to buy it shows you have no integrity as a journalist. This card costs twice what a 70 card normally goes for. That's straight up price gouging. PC gaming will quickly die as a hobby if these prices continue. Video cards should not cost as much as used cars.
That’s pretty harsh. You know the author is here in the forums right? Questioning someone’s integrity because you simply disagree with them is immature and divisive.

Price gouging is simply not possible on something not needed for life. This is a luxury consumer commodity. Just because one feels entitled to the latest at a certain price does not make it so.

Cards and CPUs from 5 years ago are more than viable for today and the future. PC gaming has been declared dead 100 times in the past decade alone. It‘s not going anywhere. Even mainstream lower end laptops can run AAA games at “palatable” frame rates. I still run a laptop from 6 years ago with a 6700hq and a 1070 GTX, over 100 fps on high in most games still. Even my old Intel Mac runs most pc games well and it’s a dog.

Take it easy, we’re all here to have fun because we’re interested in the same things.
 
One of the difficulties with reviews is trying to determine the overall context, as well as looking toward the future. The easiest thing to change on a graphics card is the price, but the market will ultimately determine where any product falls. If it's overpriced, you can expect that to trend downward over time. If there's a ton of demand, you can expect prices to trend upward. So, I have to look at the everything the card offers, and then factor in pricing as the final point, understanding that MSRP has become very disconnected from retail prices.

In terms of performance, the 4070 Ti is a card that matches the 3090 almost exactly, at a lower price, lower power, with some extra new features. There are cases where it's definitely slower, and cases where it's clearly faster. 3090 performance for $800 isn't the end of the world, which ultimately leads me to the 7/10 score. Maybe it could have been 6/10, but basically performance and features is in the 8 or 9 range, and then price adjusts that.

Rarely do graphics cards outright fail to provide anything useful. In recent history, the GTX 1630 is as close as we've come to a pointless product. It actually made the RX 6400 seem slightly better! But just because everyone is shouting that the 4070 Ti (and 4080) are overpriced doesn't mean a thing if the cards are selling. We don't have data on how fast they're selling, or how many cards there are. We also don't have clear data on the BOM — bill of materials — not to mention the R&D costs. However, I do know that Nvidia (and AMD and Intel) have been at this for a long time, and they're not stupid.

The reason they've chosen the $799 price point is because that's what the number crunchers think the market will bear while delivering optimal returns. If reality diverges from that, the price will start to fall, but I'd be surprised to see more than a $100 adjustment over the life of the product. If the price is really off, Nvidia will ultimately discontinue the part and create a new model at a different price to compensate, rather than "admit" that MSRP was totally wrong.

And people do need to look beyond the model number. What we have is basically Nvidia deciding that it will stretch out the range of performance offered. Where we used to have 50, 60, 70, and 80 models, now we have 50 through 90 models, plus most likely Ti variants on each (eventually). And rather than a 5–10% performance bump between the top models, we're now seeing a gap of 20–30%. That's not all bad.

The 3090 being 10% faster than the 3080 at launch while theoretically costing twice as much always felt stupid to me. Extreme Edition Intel CPUs that were 5–10% faster than the parts that cost half as much also felt silly. But both of those things happened, and apparently enough demand exists that rather than getting rid of the extreme parts, they're becoming more normalized, and pulling prices up on the high-end and midrange models.

For now, this is the reality the big corporations are trying to create, and the only way that reality fails is if consumers and businesses reject it and refuse to buy the parts. Given the RTX 4090 is still selling for over $2,000, it would appear there are enough people ready to fork over large amounts of cash that the strategy is working.
 
Yeah..... they just trying to keep the prices up at the same levels as during crypto mania. During that time, massive supply issues enabled scalpers to jack prices to double MSRP, now there is plenty of supply available.
 

halfcharlie

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Let's face it, upgrading every generation is stupid and anybody who does it has deep enough pockets to not care about the price, the 4-series should realistically be compared to the 2-series or 1-series for the average buyer. If you're not happy with the price then buy a previous gen card simple as that, 1080Ti's which are still very capable cards are being snapped up for cheap all over the place and making a lot of budget gamers very happy, I'll be selling mine and making someone happy when my 4-series comes in. My upgrade will cost twice what it did 3 generations ago and I don't think that's okay, but it won't be any different next gen as at best it will stay the same rather than increase so it's not like I'm going to wait any longer.

I would say Tom's comments sections seem to have some of the dumbest people on the face of the planet, but I'm pretty sure it's true of ALL comments sections on the internet. The entire review criticises the price non-stop and then some illiterate in the comments says 'stop trying sell us on these prices and tell us they're okay you sell-outs'. It's behaviour like this which makes one lose faith in our species and the schooling system.
 

BeedooX

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Don't underestimate the investor pressure AMD and Nvidia's CEO are under to deliver profits.
Well there aren't going to be any profits if products are stuck on shelves, or products are rushed out with defects.

AMD should have figured out which batches are faulty so they can be taken off the shelves and returned. I'm buying nothing while AMD just sit on their hands.
 
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