News Nvidia's Enhanced Anti-Mining GPU Limiter Debuts in Mid-May

JamesJones44

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In other news, miner find a way to defat Nvidia's enhanced anti-mining after looking at the beta driver before it is release... again.
 

AtrociKitty

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Apr 23, 2020
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I have mixed feelings about Nvidia's anti-mining measures. I'd like more cards to make it to gamers, but I also don't think it's right for Nvidia to restrict how you use your own hardware. It particularly bothers me in the case of someone mining using a single card during gaming downtime. That' not at all the same scenario as stopping a commercial miner, and mining income is a necessary part of a GPU's value proposition at these inflated prices.

The previously leaked beta driver still required a monitor be attached, and also needed a proper PCI slot (1x didn't work), which actually strikes me as the right direction to take a limiter. Let people mine on their normal, single-card systems, that are actively in use (driving a monitor, 16x PCI), and enable the limiter when there are multiple cards in an obvious mining rig. I still think there should be no limiter at all, but the above would be the most reasonable way to implement one if necessary.
 

atomicWAR

Splendid
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I agree Punkncat that the limiter won't last but I also agree with AtrociKitty in that Nvidia shouldn't be doing this to their cards. Consumers should have the right to use their hardware as they wish. Making some money off your GPU when your not using it to game is a reasonable request. These limiters have less to do with keeping cards out of the hands of miners than pushing thier mining cards on miners. Plus when you take Nvidia's arguemtn fact that the RTX 3090 isn't worth limiting due to the return rate...so what happend with the return rate on 723 USD mining card with a 26mh/s...lets see to hit the 106 MH/s like a RTX 3090 you'd need roughly 4 30HX cards at a cost of 2892. What is the price of an RTX 3090 if you can get it, oh yeah anywhere from 1500 to 2500 dollars. Yeah Nvidia's argument falls apart with some basic math. This is all about their bottom line. But to be fair some of that will depend on the pricing of their higher hash rate cards. If the 220hx is indeed only 3000 USD than Nvidia will be telling the truth. Time will tell how Ngreedia they are or not!
 
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daworstplaya

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Glad this is happening, the HRL can't come soon enough. Many of my friends who are trying to upgrade their GPU have been stuck in hell.
If Crypto (or specifically Etherium and other GPU based mining crypto) weren't around this wouldn't be a problem for all the gamers dying to get their hands on a GPU, but these are strange trying times that call for extreme measures.
Nvidia is doing right by gamers that have stuck with the company through thick and thin. Where as the only loyalty Crypto miners have is to money.
 

spongiemaster

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It would be foolish of NVIDIA not to make these "mining limiters" easy to bypass. Their bottom line is rocking because they are selling (out) of almost everything, and have even brought back "obsolete" models to fill demand. Why would they actually want this to stop?
Nvidia is stuck selling their GPU's at contract prices to AIB's. While selling everything is great. They're not seeing a dime of the 200%+ markup over MSRP that the market is currently at. Scalpers and middle men are making far more off each GPU than Nvidia themselves are making. By limiting hashing rates for gaming CPU's, Nvidia can sell mining cards, not stuck at pre mining boom contract pricing, at whatever price the market will bear directly to mining companies which will result in significantly more money made per GPU sold for them.
 

Phaaze88

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Nvidia wants to control both markets - gaming and mining. They can't control the mining market with the way things are now, that's why they're trying to separate them.
They also want to avoid the flood of old gpus into the 2nd hand market, because that eats into sales of the new models. Turing, anyone?
Software clearly didn't work here, so now they need to resort to hardware locks. The latter can be cracked, I'm sure, but it shouldn't be worth the hassle to do it.
 

Geezer760

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Aug 29, 2009
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Glad this is happening, the HRL can't come soon enough. Many of my friends who are trying to upgrade their GPU have been stuck in hell.
If Crypto (or specifically Etherium and other GPU based mining crypto) weren't around this wouldn't be a problem for all the gamers dying to get their hands on a GPU, but these are strange trying times that call for extreme measures.
Nvidia is doing right by gamers that have stuck with the company through thick and thin. Where as the only loyalty Crypto miners have is to money.
All big companies/corporations loyalty is to MONEY, they couldn't give two $hits about anything else, as long as the product moves, money is the root of all evil.
 

spongiemaster

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All big companies/corporations loyalty is to MONEY, they couldn't give two $hits about anything else, as long as the product moves, money is the root of all evil.
It's really baffling how this point is missed by the anti-Nvidia/Intel crowd. If your goal is to only buy from companies that don't prioritize money over you, then you aren't going to be buying from anyone.
 
That makes sense. I mean, I'm trying to find the motivation for stopping mining--it's driving record prices and volumes.
Several reasons.

1,. When the market crashed before everyone suffered. There were a glut of cards and no product could be moved. I bought a rx580 8gb for $130 new

2. Nvidia is under contract to supply x number of chip sets at a fixed price. The aibs are the ones making the killing. Not nvidia.

3. Mindshare is still important and if amd can gain gpu gaming market share it will make investors worried.

4. Once people switch to a competitor they have a tendency to stick to it.

5. Nvidia can dynamically adjust allocation of 30 series gpu's to mining if gaming sales flounder.
 
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exploding_psu

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Jul 17, 2018
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Nvidia wants to control both markets - gaming and mining. They can't control the mining market with the way things are now, that's why they're trying to separate them.
They also want to avoid the flood of old gpus into the 2nd hand market, because that eats into sales of the new models. Turing, anyone?
Software clearly didn't work here, so now they need to resort to hardware locks. The latter can be cracked, I'm sure, but it shouldn't be worth the hassle to do it.
Man, I remember Turing. Back then when it was launched, the popular recommendation was to buy used Pascal instead. Good times.
 

g-unit1111

Titan
Moderator
In other news, miner find a way to defat Nvidia's enhanced anti-mining after looking at the beta driver before it is release... again.
Yeah you can't make something completely hack proof, someone is just going to make a better hacker.

They should just market mining-specific cards and then that way the miners get theirs and us gamers can get ours. I know they've tried that in the past but this time around it should be different.
 

escksu

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Aug 8, 2019
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I suspect their true motivation is to allow them to market a non-limited card to miners and charge a premium. Or maybe I'm just too much of a cynic
Yes, Nvidia has released a new line of mining GPUs catered for mining. These GPUs mostly have defects which render them unusable for gamers but does not affect mining. So, you can say this is like "godsend" for Nvidia since they can re-purpose these defective GPUS which will otherwise thrown away......
 
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dalauder

Splendid
Glad this is happening, the HRL can't come soon enough. Many of my friends who are trying to upgrade their GPU have been stuck in hell.
If Crypto (or specifically Etherium and other GPU based mining crypto) weren't around this wouldn't be a problem for all the gamers dying to get their hands on a GPU, but these are strange trying times that call for extreme measures.
Nvidia is doing right by gamers that have stuck with the company through thick and thin. Where as the only loyalty Crypto miners have is to money.
They've gotta follow the money. There's not much else to do. If NVidia can make 4x the money on cards and sell 100% of their inventory, there's nothing to be done. The good news is that when there's a crypto crash, the used market will have amazing prices. I'll replace my RX 480 then with an RTX 3080 for $140.

But really, even an RX 470 or GTX 960 are plenty for most 1080p gaming. People don't really need to upgrade. Now if you're running a Radeon 6850 or GTX 650Ti, then you're in a pickle and I do feel sorry for you. Buy that Ryzen 5 4600H laptop with the GTX 1650 in it that's on sale for $700 right now as a stopgap that's cheaper than graphics?
 
Sep 23, 2020
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Glad this is happening, the HRL can't come soon enough. Many of my friends who are trying to upgrade their GPU have been stuck in hell.
If Crypto (or specifically Etherium and other GPU based mining crypto) weren't around this wouldn't be a problem for all the gamers dying to get their hands on a GPU, but these are strange trying times that call for extreme measures.
Nvidia is doing right by gamers that have stuck with the company through thick and thin. Where as the only loyalty Crypto miners have is to money.
Scalpers are the issue, not miners. Not all miners are scalpers, and not all miners have bots buying the cards. The issue should be focused on websites that sell them, not the product. What's the point of nerfing a product, only to sell it thru the same websites where the same bots are gonna buy them all up to scalp regardless?
 

spongiemaster

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What's the point of nerfing a product, only to sell it thru the same websites where the same bots are gonna buy them all up to scalp regardless?
Without mining, scalpers wouldn't have an inflated market and they would disappear. The two are working together. Ebay prices indicate that 3000 series cards except for the 3090 are selling at a price point that would take 5-6 months to recoup the costs over MSRP if you mined with them. If hash rates are cut in half then we should eventually see card prices above MSRP drop in half. So if a $550 3070 is selling for $1350 now, it should drop into the $950 range. If GPU's couldn't mine at all, prices would plummet.

Nvidia, in typical fashion, is screwing this up if the reports are true that there will be no way to tell if you are getting a mining limited card unless you remove the cooler and examine the GPU itself. If the packaging clearly states that the card has reduced hashing rates, then its price will instantly be lower on the 2nd hand market. If there's no way to tell, the prices will drop much more slowly until it is practically guaranteed that you are getting a mining limited card.
 
Sep 23, 2020
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Without mining, scalpers wouldn't have an inflated market and they would disappear. The two are working together. Ebay prices indicate that 3000 series cards except for the 3090 are selling at a price point that would take 5-6 months to recoup the costs over MSRP if you mined with them. If hash rates are cut in half then we should eventually see card prices above MSRP drop in half. So if a $550 3070 is selling for $1350 now, it should drop into the $950 range. If GPU's couldn't mine at all, prices would plummet.

Nvidia, in typical fashion, is screwing this up if the reports are true that there will be no way to tell if you are getting a mining limited card unless you remove the cooler and examine the GPU itself. If the packaging clearly states that the card has reduced hashing rates, then its price will instantly be lower on the 2nd hand market. If there's no way to tell, the prices will drop much more slowly until it is practically guaranteed that you are getting a mining limited card.
But why is mining tied to scalping? Like, shoes don't mine crypto but are still scalped. Gamers just want new cards to play games, scalpers scalp stuff people want. I don't think it's completely the cause of mining, I think scalping is just an issue in a lot of spaces.
In other words, what's the incentive for a scalper holding the reduced hashrate card and not scalping it anyways? Why would they sell it cheaper if gamers, the primary consumer of the card ((unless mining is bigger than the PC gaming community?)) are still paying scalper prices just to play games, since the websites selling the cards still don't have systems against bots buying?
 

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