Predict AMD's Q4 Earnings ... go on !!

[JAYDEEJOHN]

Its simple, Intel did the pooch with netburst, they failed, and then and before then, they cheated their way. Context is required here. The offending illegalities come before netburst and continued til they had C2D and AMD filed.
Tho C2D wasnt released yet, they knew what they had, or Intels engineers are idiots.That so far are the facts according to Korea Japan and the EU.
Intel failed much like Phenom was a failure, but the differences in marketshare, mindshare and marketing made Phenom even worse, at a time AMD was already crippled by Intels actions, again, according to the EU etc, and also the FTC and NY state.

Its not AMD whining here, its the FTC etc finding fault. Its not Intel winning with netburst and prior, it was their actions, according to the FTC etc, and again, its not AMD whining.

I suspect a GF without AMD will be more formidable than with them, to Intel etc.
Saying a small loss which seems huge to us, and would destroy Intel twice over speaks to this, and Im glad fazers brought it up, if not just to put into perspective of what Intel faces in the future

 

[jimmysmitty]

Hilarious. You know what AMD-64 is right? You realise that intel licence a bunch of AMD's patents back? 😗

And its also why we are still stuck with x86 instead of evolving to the next platform such as a true 64bit arch. But hey, lets keep the same old stuff.

As for AMD, good they profited. Only took them 4 years. And funny how its the year after Hector leaves.......

 

[Reynod]

The ati aquisition and Intel antitrust issues combined to really do some damage, along with the 2900 / Phenom I issues.

 

[JAYDEEJOHN]

The ati aquisition and Intel antitrust issues combined to really do some damage, along with the 2900 / Phenom I issues.

 

[fazers_on_stun]

Many of the engineers at each company will have been there for a long time, a lot of stuff gets passed down just like in every other job.

As for intel paying better, I really doubt it. Pay one better and you have to pay the rest better else they get pissed off and start handing out secrets like some two-bit Taiwanese operation. 😀

And according to your prior post which will 'dwarf' the entire AMD staff, but you can't figure out that this same dwarfed staff has led in tech against them in the recent past AMD engineers appear to be a bunch of dwarves 😀. I'd guess 7 of them, named Dopey, Sneezy, Grumpy, etc.

Anyway, I seriously doubt TSMC or Intel engineers would be handing out trade secrets, since there are severe legal penalties for doing so. IIRC there was a former Intel engineer several years ago who offered to sell insider info to AMD. And it was Intel who found out about it and took him to court. I don't think AMD took advantage of it, but I also don't recall AMD turning the guy in - collusion much??

 

[fazers_on_stun]

AMD is just offloading the debt burden for the most part. First time in a very long time they have been fabless. sanders said real men own fabs, nw his pet is fabless and Intel has production capibiities that make AMD look like freescale,,,, oh wait same diff. both are IP companies now. lets see if AMD goes the freescale route some more and just licenses IP and doesnt produce a product per se. Then they can eventually scale back to one engineer and when he dies designing his last outdated chip it will be done.

IIRC AMD offloaded <$2B of the ATI acquisition debt onto GF so they had over $3B left (those senior notes). With the Intel settlement they paid off most of the notes dues in 2012 and managed to refinance the remainder, at least from what I recall about it. They still have the notes due in 2015 I think.

IMO the "AMD engineers are superior" argument is pretty silly. Why doesn't ATIC just throw those tens of billions that Jay says they have available, to AMD so that those superior engineers can actually make a superior product for a change? After all, doesn't ATIC own something like 10% of AMD stock nowadays?

 

[fazers_on_stun]

I suspect a GF without AMD will be more formidable than with them, to Intel etc.
Saying a small loss which seems huge to us, and would destroy Intel twice over speaks to this, and Im glad fazers brought it up, if not just to put into perspective of what Intel faces in the future

And if GF grows & grows as you say, why would they want to spend more R&D dollars on the AMD SOI process? Isn't that used solely by AMD? If AMD becomes a small or insignifcant customer, maybe GF will think differently about supporting them..

And consider this - if GF eventually did destroy Intel, dontcha think Congress & the American people would be up in arms over yet another instance of offloading a hugely and uniquely successful industry to overseas? There's a lot of political repercussions here that you are conveniently ignoring, esp. with the auto industry still fresh on everyone's minds... I'd imagine there would be severe consequences for the FTC for approving this, AMD for engineering it, and even NY State for partly financing it.

Finally, you also ignore the fact that ATIC is now headquartered in a fairly unstable part of the world. If we're disparaging nationalities like Jenny just did with the Taiwanese, then the UAE appears to be mostly fat bearded guys in robes rolling around in petro-dollars and relying on importing slave labor from Indonesia, Phillipines, etc to actually do the manual labor they require to make those islands, indoor ski slopes, and worlds tallest empty buildings. I guess they have some security forces but I'd imagine Al Quaeda could knock them off pretty quickly if so motivated. Maybe all this is a Bin Laden plot to consolidate the world's chipmaking expertise in one location, so that they could hold the West by the nutz, eh??

 

[JAYDEEJOHN]

Its all a conspiracy, poor lil ol Intel, that guy had Intels entire IP knowledge in his head, and those rotten AMD people didnt do a thing (though the tracking device implanted in his head worked nicely)

 

[JAYDEEJOHN]

At the valuations and the project sizes, theres no slaving going on at all, excellent pay, and youd know this if youd seen who heads up most of the projects there.

They arent out to destroy Intel theyre out to be the best, period. They have the monies to do so, and time on their side.
Oh, and sure, they want to rid themselves of customers and become single minded as fast as possible, since this will bring inngreat business, heheh.
Sure the worst comes out when the truths told. Intels in for it here, thats fact. TSMC has all sorts of media darlings from their area propping them up all the time, they have a shaky governement there tho, with lil means of support, and yet they arent far behind Intel, so again, whats this telling you?

 

[jennyh]

Finally, you also ignore the fact that ATIC is now headquartered in a fairly unstable part of the world.

I'd rather be in UAE than in israel tbh.

 

[verndewd]

IIRC AMD offloaded <$2B of the ATI acquisition debt onto GF so they had over $3B left (those senior notes). With the Intel settlement they paid off most of the notes dues in 2012 and managed to refinance the remainder, at least from what I recall about it. They still have the notes due in 2015 I think.

IMO the "AMD engineers are superior" argument is pretty silly. Why doesn't ATIC just throw those tens of billions that Jay says they have available, to AMD so that those superior engineers can actually make a superior product for a change? After all, doesn't ATIC own something like 10% of AMD stock nowadays?

AMD paid most of the ATI purchase upfront .

 

[JAYDEEJOHN]

2017, dont know the amount tho

 

[Hellboy]

The ati aquisition and Intel antitrust issues combined to really do some damage, along with the 2900 / Phenom I issues.

10 Print "The ati aquisition and Intel antitrust issues combined to really do some damage, along with the 2900 / Phenom I issues."
20 goto 10

 

[Cryslayer80]

2010 should be an interesting year for Amd especially since Intel will start pushing the Core i3/i5 into the mainstream market and they (Amd} have nothing to compete with Intel but to lower their prices. You believe that this will be how they will succeed or are they bringing something else into the budget market that we don"t know about?

Why does everyone think that when AMD doesn't have a competitive product, it won't have it for another 3 years? What if AMD puts out something that will blow I7, I9 and I*tenmillionfourtysix* out of the water? Come on... And plus, currently AMD has products that compete with Intel up to I7 920 (including it, of course).

 

[Cryslayer80]

:lol: :lol: :lol:

you just contradicted yourself

:lol:

Really? How could she do that? I think $1.000.000.000 in cash, a house, an AMD PC, an arm and a leg would be enough to satisfy his most holy judge, but even this punishment is too little for an AMD heretic that plagues the forum!

 

[verndewd]

:lol:

Really? How could she do that? I think $1.000.000.000 in cash, a house, an AMD PC, an arm and a leg would be enough to satisfy his most holy judge, but even this punishment is too little for an AMD heretic that plagues the forum!

lost me there, who would be an AMD heretic?

 

[Chad Boga]

Why does everyone think that when AMD doesn't have a competitive product, it won't have it for another 3 years?

Where do you get 3 years from?

The discussion is about 2010, so that is the year ahead.

What if AMD puts out something that will blow I7, I9 and I*tenmillionfourtysix* out of the water?

We know from the roadmaps that AMD won't have anything capable of that until at least Bulldozer, and even then it is likely that Intel will hang on to the performance crown with Sandy Bridge.

 

[verndewd]

Where do you get 3 years from?

The discussion is about 2010, so that is the year ahead.

What if AMD puts out something that will blow I7, I9 and I*tenmillionfourtysix* out of the water?

We know from the roadmaps that AMD won't have anything capable of that until at least Bulldozer, and even then it is likely that Intel will hang on to the performance crown with Sandy Bridge.

the bull (narcolepto)dozer due 2011.

All in all AMD did rally well enough with phenom 2 for now, at least its moderately competitive and scales well in resolutions I could give a rats azz about. I am just relieved am2 is behind us.

 

[retirepresident]

GO AMD/ATI!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[yannifb]

Where do you get 3 years from?

The discussion is about 2010, so that is the year ahead.

What if AMD puts out something that will blow I7, I9 and I*tenmillionfourtysix* out of the water?

We know from the roadmaps that AMD won't have anything capable of that until at least Bulldozer, and even then it is likely that Intel will hang on to the performance crown with Sandy Bridge.

Why would it be likely that Sandy Bridge will beat BD? BD is a completely new arch, while Sandy Bridge is supposedly a fine tuning of the i7s arch. If BD destroys the i7 it has a good chance of beating SB.

 

[verndewd]

Why would it be likely that Sandy Bridge will beat BD? BD is a completely new arch, while Sandy Bridge is supposedly a fine tuning of the i7s arch. If BD destroys the i7 it has a good chance of beating SB.

conjecture anf speculation.

id like to see that but i really have doubts

 

[Chad Boga]

Why would it be likely that Sandy Bridge will beat BD? BD is a completely new arch, while Sandy Bridge is supposedly a fine tuning of the i7s arch. If BD destroys the i7 it has a good chance of beating SB.

Why would it be likely? Because Intel has more resources to throw at Sandy Bridge, than AMD has to throw at Bulldozer.

Of course this doesn't mean it is impossible for Bulldozer to be better than Sandy Bridge, that could well happen too.

Keep in mind that the P4 was a completely new arch and K8 was a fine tuning of K7.

 

[verndewd]

Why would it be likely? Because Intel has more resources to throw at Sandy Bridge, than AMD has to throw at Bulldozer.

Of course this doesn't mean it is impossible for Bulldozer to be better than Sandy Bridge, that could well happen too.

Keep in mind that the P4 was a completely new arch and K8 was a fine tuning of K7.

the question here is wether or not the fab lite crock o pooh will speed up design or slow down design. Of course this is where Doug grose can shine having come from IBM fabs but thats something AMD has to prove it can do is excel at design and have a bit more oomph from being junkless. I dont know how they seperated designers from lith engineers in the going junkless.

 

[jimmysmitty]

Why would it be likely? Because Intel has more resources to throw at Sandy Bridge, than AMD has to throw at Bulldozer.

Of course this doesn't mean it is impossible for Bulldozer to be better than Sandy Bridge, that could well happen too.

Keep in mind that the P4 was a completely new arch and K8 was a fine tuning of K7.

And K10 was a work over of K8 but that failed. K10.5 was more like what AMD expected from K10.

P4s Netburst wasn't a bad idea. But they just couldn't get anything useful out of it. Even with Ceadermill (the last Netburst based CPU before Conroe) that lowered the TDP to 65w and did pretty well it just wasn't enough.

Personally I do think Sandy Bridge will continue Intels dominance for overalll CPU. Bulldozer looks nice but then again AMD dropped the original design for a while meaning its possible that this Bulldozer is not the Bulldozer we heard about back when.

 

[verndewd]

And K10 was a work over of K8 but that failed. K10.5 was more like what AMD expected from K10.

P4s Netburst wasn't a bad idea. But they just couldn't get anything useful out of it. Even with Ceadermill (the last Netburst based CPU before Conroe) that lowered the TDP to 65w and did pretty well it just wasn't enough.

Personally I do think Sandy Bridge will continue Intels dominance for overalll CPU. Bulldozer looks nice but then again AMD dropped the original design for a while meaning its possible that this Bulldozer is not the Bulldozer we heard about back when.

well call it K8 v.9.0