Question RAM randomness - fail to boot

[Daniel_pt]

I've been having an issue with my computer and I tried almost all I can remember, without coming close to understanding what is going on.
My specs are:
MSI B450 gaming plus max (bios up2date)
Ryzen 5 5600
Corsair 800W psu (new and gold+)
M.2 SSD working fine
RX 6700 XT
4x 8gb Kingston hyperX cl12 2400mghz RAM

Since I got this issue I even got a new CPU, thinking that would be the problem, so I tested with a R5 5600 and with my old 3600, both presenting the same issue.

The issue is, PC won't boot with all 4 sticks of RAM. Yet, it is working fine with 3 sticks. There is no setting of max ram on windows. Issue persists on W10 or W11.

The slots are interchangeable, but with some random results. The slot that doesn't work isn't always the same.
All 4 sticks of ram work on their own, so they are also interchangeable.

If I try to add the 4th stick, sometimes I have to take all but one off and boot with just one. Only after booting successfully can I add another stick, but never on the same rail. Trying dual channel almost always fails.
And by fail I mean PC won't boot at all.
When it does boot, either with 1 ram stick or the 3, everything works perfectly, passings memTest with no issues, being able to game without issues.

Just to thicken the plot, this PC worked fine with the 4 sticks of RAM for about 2 years, never a single issue, until this randomly started.

This happens with default bios settings, with XMP profiles, overclocking and overvolting RAM, undervolting and or underclocking RAM.

This happens with ram fastboot on or of.

I think I tried everything but new RAM or new Mobo, but I have no one to borrow them from, and I would hate to buy a replacement part to turn out to be the wrong one.

Can you help me with any ideas?

 

[Fix_that_Glitch]

So have you tried using one stick of ram at a time to boot up to make sure one of the sticks isn't bad? If all single sticks boot up the machine, then try to reinstall the bios, or upgrade it to the newest one. If that doesn't solve your problem, I would assume your motherboard needs replacing.

 

[Daniel_pt]

So have you tried using one stick of ram at a time to boot up to make sure one of the sticks isn't bad? If all single sticks boot up the machine, then try to reinstall the bios, or upgrade it to the newest one. If that doesn't solve your problem, I would assume your motherboard needs replacing.

Yes, any of them work individually in any given slot. Not just all four at the same time.
BIOS is the latest and rolling back to previous BIOS did not solve the issue.

I guess the problem is on the mobo as well, but buying a new one just to find out I was wrong is what I'm afraid of.

 

[Fix_that_Glitch]

Perhaps buy ram that needs only two sticks to give you same amount of ram as the four sticks did?

 

[Daniel_pt]

Perhaps buy ram that needs only two sticks to give you same amount of ram as the four sticks did?

Sure, but who wants two empty RAM slots? 😕

 

[Unolocogringo]

Ryzen has a much harder time running 4 sticks of ram compared to 2 sticks.
Speaking of. Is this a matched set of 4 sticks from one kit or 2 kits ? Or 4 individual sticks?

Sure, but who wants two empty RAM slots? 😕

Do you want aesthetics or performance. Some times you must choose one or the other. Both are not always possible.

 

[Daniel_pt]

Ryzen has a much harder time running 4 sticks of ram compared to 2 sticks.
Speaking of. Is this a matched set of 4 sticks from one kit or 2 kits ? Or 4 individual sticks?

Do you want aesthetics or performance. Some times you must choose one or the other. Both are not always possible.

Two kits of 2x8gb, even though the manufacturer is different, they are the exact same ram and work with each other if I mix them in the sockets.

Currently the matter is only aesthetics. Performance wise I could live with the 16gb for most of the things I do

 

[Unolocogringo]

How To - Troubleshooting problems with PC memory (RAM) and XMP profile configurations

In the beginning, there was......BIOS Before you go ANY further, go to the manufacturer product page for your specific motherboard model AND revision. Revision is an important aspect because for any given motherboard there may be more than one version of that model which will be identified...

forums.tomshardware.com

Check the mixed memory odd man out section.

 

[Daniel_pt]

How To - Troubleshooting problems with PC memory (RAM) and XMP profile configurations

In the beginning, there was......BIOS Before you go ANY further, go to the manufacturer product page for your specific motherboard model AND revision. Revision is an important aspect because for any given motherboard there may be more than one version of that model which will be identified...

forums.tomshardware.com

Check the mixed memory odd man out section.

My bad, perhaps I wasn't clear enough.
Currently I have 3 sticks of ram on all but the first slot (the one furthest from the CPU, slot 4). Two are manufactured by Samsung, one by SK Hynix, but all four are Kingston HyperX DDR4 CL12 2400MHz.

I can even change them within the same channel, mixing the Samsung one with the SK one without any issue.

 

[Fix_that_Glitch]

I forgot to ask. Is this a new problem that started after all the memory worked fine together or is this a problem with trying to use the ram together for the first time?

 

[Unolocogringo]

My bad, perhaps I wasn't clear enough.
Currently I have 3 sticks of ram on all but the first slot (the one furthest from the CPU, slot 4). Two are manufactured by Samsung, one by SK Hynix, but all four are Kingston HyperX DDR4 CL12 2400MHz.

I can even change them within the same channel, mixing the Samsung one with the SK one without any issue.

Please read the mixed memory part again.
Then you might understand that they can not be exactly the same. Especially with chips from different manufacturers.
They may never work in dual channel mode.

 

[DSzymborski]

Two kits of 2x8gb, even though the manufacturer is different, they are the exact same ram and work with each other if I mix them in the sockets.

Currently the matter is only aesthetics. Performance wise I could live with the 16gb for most of the things I do

Then they are absolutely not the exact same RAM. There's no such thing as identical RAM, even two sticks manufactured one right after each other from the same manufacturer. RAM is a binned product, basically "specced" by its degree of imperfection, found through testing. All RAM sticks are different; RAM sold together are basically two different specs that were similarly flawed that have been tested to work together at the given clockrate/timings.

Semiconductor fabrication is not like something more traditional like car production. Toyota sets out to make a RAV-4 or a Camry or a Corolla. A Corolla isn't simply a car that was too defective to sell as a Camry. But, very generally speaking, a Ryzen 5600X is a CPU that wasn't competent enough to be a Ryzen 5950X and a package of 2666 MHz RAM is simply RAM that was too defective to sell as 3200 MHz RAM or 3600 MHz RAM.

 

[Daniel_pt]

I'm not discussing the fabrication procedure. I'm just saying all four modules have the same part number KHX2666C13/8GX, all four of them have equal timmings and frequencies and all four of them worked together with no issue whatsoever for the better part of two years, despite some problems on the get go.
So compatibility wouldn't ever be the issue.
CPU has also been ruled out, so what would be your best next guess? Power delivery? Should I try fixing RAM voltages? Never been a fan of that, even when OC RAM. For me it just causes more instability.

 

[Roland Of Gilead]

I'm not discussing the fabrication procedure. I'm just saying all four modules have the same part number KHX2666C13/8GX, all four of them have equal timmings and frequencies and all four of them worked together with no issue whatsoever for the better part of two years, despite some problems on the get go.
So compatibility wouldn't ever be the issue.
CPU has also been ruled out, so what would be your best next guess? Power delivery? Should I try fixing RAM voltages? Never been a fan of that, even when OC RAM. For me it just causes more instability.

You will prob need to bump your SOC voltage a notch or two. Running 4 DIMMs over 2 often lead to instability over time.

What bios are you runinng? Did you update it when changing CPU's? Did you clear CMOS after updating your bios?

 

[Daniel_pt]

The problem preceded the CPU change and yes, bios is up to date.
Until I was able to achieve the 3 RAMs at the same time (which is what currently is working fine) I must have cleared CMOS over a dozen time. So yes.
I will try, but RAM voltage is changing like crazy on auto. Anywhere from 1.1 to 1.5 on the bios menu.

 

[DSzymborski]

I'm not discussing the fabrication procedure. I'm just saying all four modules have the same part number KHX2666C13/8GX, all four of them have equal timmings and frequencies and all four of them worked together with no issue whatsoever for the better part of two years, despite some problems on the get go.
So compatibility wouldn't ever be the issue.
CPU has also been ruled out, so what would be your best next guess? Power delivery? Should I try fixing RAM voltages? Never been a fan of that, even when OC RAM. For me it just causes more instability.

If you're not discussing the fabrication procedure, then you're not addressing a key part of why individual sticks of RAM are not identical, even with the same branding. That these non-kit sticks worked together for a couple years isn't particularly meaningful because there are many variables involved, few of which remain truly static.

As for me, someone refusing to face and discuss frankly all the aspects of an issue is my cue to leave the discussion. I wish you the best of luck in resolving your issue to your satisfaction.

 

[Daniel_pt]

If you're not discussing the fabrication procedure, then you're not addressing a key part of why individual sticks of RAM are not identical, even with the same branding. That these non-kit sticks worked together for a couple years isn't particularly meaningful because there are many variables involved, few of which remain truly static.

As for me, someone refusing to face and discuss frankly all the aspects of an issue is my cue to leave the discussion. I wish you the best of luck in resolving your issue to your satisfaction.

We are talking about having the RAM from each kit in each channel. Not mixing within the channels, even though that has worked before.
So how can the make be an issue?