[SOLVED] Ryzen 3700X Undervolting and temp

[Wolf96xz]

Hello,

My CPU is a Ryzen 3700x mounted on an MSI MPG X570 Gaming Plus motherboard and I am slightly concerned about the temperature issue of this CPU.

The temperature values in AMD Ryzen Master only with the Firefox browser are around 40-45 degrees and I do not know if that is normal for this cpu, considering that it has an offset type undervolting of -0.1500v.

The pc itself is less than a year old, and I did this undervolt because the temperatures were even higher than stock. My question in summary is if I should be concerned about these numbers or should I leave it as it is?

Maybe I should adjust the voltage better or make a slightly higher offset for security reasons, the truth is that I don't know for sure.

Here, I leave a screenshot of Ryzen Master with those values and my BIOS with the aforementioned offset.

Thank you.

Greetings to all.

PS: The built-in cooler is not the stock one, but a Cooler Master Hyper 212 RGB Edition.

 

[Joeyvdm]

40-45 is perfectly safe for an 3700x idle temps bud. Your undervolt is a bit to much though. It will hurt performance, I run my 3700x with an -0.0875v offset voltage. What you should do for better temps is make a custom CPU fan profile in your BIOS.

This is just an example to give you an idea.
Increase the minimum fan speed to 45 or 50%. Then scale it upwards all the way to a 100% fan speed at 65- 75 degrees.Then set your "fan smoothing" or "fan delay" option in your bios to 3 seconds or so for both fan ramping delay and fan decline delay. Just an example.

That way your CPU fan is always keeping idle temps in check and should be fairly quiet at idle. And your CPU fan won't speed up every time the CPU temps jump up for a few seconds, thanks to fan smoothing. This is with the stock Wraith Prism cooler. I keep my idle temps at 29-38 degrees with these settings. depending on summer or winter.

I am not sure what the settings are for your CPU fan, but play with them and see if you can get a better fan curve if you don't have the perfect fan curve yet.

But 40 to 45 degrees idle temps are fine anyway and fine for firefox as well (I also use firefox). I would not worry about those temps at all. But I also know that the VRMs are not that great on your MB. So some good case cooling for them would also be great, if you don't have any yet.

I also see your are running the old version of Ryzen Master. You should update it to the latest version. Check for the latest version of your BIOS if needed and the latest x570 chipset drives as well.

 

[KotaBushnell]

40-45 is perfectly safe for an 3700x idle temps bud. Your undervolt is a bit to much though. It will hurt performance, I run my 3700x with an -0.0875v offset voltage. What you should do for better temps is make a custom CPU fan profile in your BIOS.

This is just an example to give you an idea.
Increase the minimum fan speed to 45 or 50%. Then scale it upwards all the way to a 100% fan speed at 65- 75 degrees.Then set your "fan smoothing" or "fan delay" option in your bios to 3 seconds or so for both fan ramping delay and fan decline delay. Just an example.

That way your CPU fan is always keeping idle temps in check and should be fairly quiet at idle. And your CPU fan won't speed up every time the CPU temps jump up for a few seconds, thanks to fan smoothing. This is with the stock Wraith Prism cooler. I keep my idle temps at 29-38 degrees with these settings. depending on summer or winter.

I am not sure what the settings are for your CPU fan, but play with them and see if you can get a better fan curve if you don't have the perfect fan curve yet.

But 40 to 45 degrees idle temps are fine anyway and fine for firefox as well (I also use firefox). I would not worry about those temps at all. But I also know that the VRMs are not that great on your MB. So some good case cooling for them would also be great, if you don't have any yet.

I also see your are running the old version of Ryzen Master. You should update it to the latest version. Check for the latest version of your BIOS if needed and the latest x570 chipset drives as well.

The only possible way for me to get below 50 idle temp is changing my power plan to "Power Saver".

All of the Balanced plans keep me 50c+.

However I'm also rocking a Prime B350-Plus Mobo - not sure if that could be problematic or not.

I originally was using an 1800x with a Corsiar H100i v2 (240mm), but my CPU idle temp was on the rise; it was almost as if my AIO pump had stopped working. I replaced the pump, and then my PC wouldn't even give a signal to my monitor(s). Swapped CPU for the 3700x and immediately got signal... so now with the 3700x and an NZXT Kraken x63 (280mm), why can I not get my temps under control?

Is undervolting it necessary to do so? Should I keep using "Power Saver" settings? I used to have my 1800x at 32c on idle - the fact I can't even get close with a much newer CPU & AIO is crazy to me.

 

[drea.drechsler]

The only possible way for me to get below 50 idle temp is changing my power plan to "Power Saver".

All of the Balanced plans keep me 50c+.

However I'm also rocking a Prime B350-Plus Mobo - not sure if that could be problematic or not.

I originally was using an 1800x with a Corsiar H100i v2 (240mm), but my CPU idle temp was on the rise; it was almost as if my AIO pump had stopped working. I replaced the pump, and then my PC wouldn't even give a signal to my monitor(s). Swapped CPU for the 3700x and immediately got signal... so now with the 3700x and an NZXT Kraken x63 (280mm), why can I not get my temps under control?

Is undervolting it necessary to do so? Should I keep using "Power Saver" settings? I used to have my 1800x at 32c on idle - the fact I can't even get close with a much newer CPU & AIO is crazy to me.

Ryzen 3000 idling in the 40-50 C range is perfectly normal under stock cooling. It also boosts frequently at idle with light workloads and every time it boosts there's a spike in temperature from one of the many sensors in the CPU up to 60-65C and sometimes higher. Those spikes are very low energy and fall away pretty quickly though so looking at an average reading is best...that's what you get from Ryzenmaster and there's one in HWInfo64 too.

Undervolting is really unnecessary and can easily kill performance if done too much. But if you do, only use offsets and keep them really small, like -0.0125 or so. Again, it's very easy to kill performance way before it becomes unstable by undervolting too far. But the sweet spot varies a lot from processor to processor...and motherboard to motherboard too. So you have to experiment to find what works for yours.

Getting a better cooler definitely helps with sustained performance under heavy loads as it keeps the processor from pulling back on clocks as it gets hot. Temps up to 85-95C can be expected on stock cooling and is still 'safe'; 95C is Tjmax but I prefer cooler too. This is when a 240mm AIO can be really great for a 3700X as keeping it under 80C keeps it from pulling back on clock speed.

An AIO will not keep it from spiking temperatures at idle. It's just the nature of the 7nm geometry and the number of sensors on the dies. Think of lighting a match in a room; the match will be really hot but the room temp isn't affected. And trying to cool the tiny area where the spiking temp sensor is with an AIO is like trying to cool the match off by turning up the house AC.

 

[Wolf96xz]

40-45 is perfectly safe for an 3700x idle temps bud. Your undervolt is a bit to much though. It will hurt performance, I run my 3700x with an -0.0875v offset voltage. What you should do for better temps is make a custom CPU fan profile in your BIOS.

This is just an example to give you an idea.
Increase the minimum fan speed to 45 or 50%. Then scale it upwards all the way to a 100% fan speed at 65- 75 degrees.Then set your "fan smoothing" or "fan delay" option in your bios to 3 seconds or so for both fan ramping delay and fan decline delay. Just an example.

That way your CPU fan is always keeping idle temps in check and should be fairly quiet at idle. And your CPU fan won't speed up every time the CPU temps jump up for a few seconds, thanks to fan smoothing. This is with the stock Wraith Prism cooler. I keep my idle temps at 29-38 degrees with these settings. depending on summer or winter.

I am not sure what the settings are for your CPU fan, but play with them and see if you can get a better fan curve if you don't have the perfect fan curve yet.

But 40 to 45 degrees idle temps are fine anyway and fine for firefox as well (I also use firefox). I would not worry about those temps at all. But I also know that the VRMs are not that great on your MB. So some good case cooling for them would also be great, if you don't have any yet.

I also see your are running the old version of Ryzen Master. You should update it to the latest version. Check for the latest version of your BIOS if needed and the latest x570 chipset drives as well.

I understand what you are saying. But my question is this: How do I control the speed of the CPU fan from the BIOS? Actually, I don't have much idea of how to do such a thing and I don't want everything to screw up.

As for undervolting, I will lower it to values similar to yours, perhaps -0.0900v or -0.0875v and I will pass the AMD Ryzen Master again, I already noticed that performance change when passing the CineBench. Very good temperatures (60-65 Cº) but a score much lower than it should be.

Thanks for the answer and I hope again your help on the issue of fans, which has not been entirely clear to me.

Regards.

 

[drea.drechsler]

I understand what you are saying. But my question is this: How do I control the speed of the CPU fan from the BIOS? Actually, I don't have much idea of how to do such a thing and I don't want everything to screw up.
///

Basically, you ignore the temperature spikes. For my 3700X I set custom fan profiles to keep fans at a barely audible constant speed up until processor temp gets to 65-70C then start ramping up. I don't let it get really loud enough to be bothersome until 85 or 90C, then only at 95C (Tjmax) does it get anywhere close to 100%.

BTW...i'm using a CM LM-240 AIO. With liquid cooler, always remember that really fast radiator fan speeds do very little before the liquid has thermally saturated. That can take something like 2 hours or more at extremely heavy processing with a 240mm AIO. So you want to keep them at a comfortable level as much as you can since it does little to know good to let them get loud too soon.

And don't just use others' voltages as what you think are 'best' for yours. You have to experiment some...set an offset and do a benchmark like Cinebench20. Be sure to run both single thread and multithread and compare to what it's like with voltage at AUTO to see if you've started to kill performance.

 

[KotaBushnell]

Ryzen 3000 idling in the 40-50 C range is perfectly normal under stock cooling. It also boosts frequently at idle with light workloads and every time it boosts there's a spike in temperature from one of the many sensors in the CPU up to 60-65C and sometimes higher. Those spikes are very low energy and fall away pretty quickly though so looking at an average reading is best...that's what you get from Ryzenmaster and there's one in HWInfo64 too.

Undervolting is really unnecessary and can easily kill performance if done too much. But if you do, only use offsets and keep them really small, like -0.0125 or so. Again, it's very easy to kill performance way before it becomes unstable by undervolting too far. But the sweet spot varies a lot from processor to processor...and motherboard to motherboard too. So you have to experiment to find what works for yours.

Getting a better cooler definitely helps with sustained performance under heavy loads as it keeps the processor from pulling back on clocks as it gets hot. Temps up to 85-95C can be expected on stock cooling and is still 'safe'; 95C is Tjmax but I prefer cooler too. This is when a 240mm AIO can be really great for a 3700X as keeping it under 80C keeps it from pulling back on clock speed.

An AIO will not keep it from spiking temperatures at idle. It's just the nature of the 7nm geometry and the number of sensors on the dies. Think of lighting a match in a room; the match will be really hot but the room temp isn't affected. And trying to cool the tiny area where the spiking temp sensor is with an AIO is like trying to cool the match off by turning up the house AC.

But I can only get it to idle between 40-50 with my power settings set to "Power Saver" - which shouldn't be normal, right? It's 50-60 on balanced, which certainly doesn't seem normal...

 

[drea.drechsler]

But I can only get it to idle between 40-50 with my power settings set to "Power Saver" - which shouldn't be normal, right? It's 50-60 on balanced, which certainly doesn't seem normal...

Idling at 40-50 is perfectly normal. and I'd use Ryzen Balanced, not Windows' plans. if you don't have a Ryzen Balanced power plan then you need to install the AMD chipset drivers from the AMD support web site. Ryzen Balanced lets the processor use it's own powersaving features which operate much faster than Windows'.

Also, as was said before, be sure to set the following to enabled in BIOS: CoolnQuiet, Global C States (these tell the processor to use power savings features that keep it cooler at idle in particular) and as well ENABLED for Processor CPPC and CPPC Preferred cores (these tell the processor to inform the OS which are the better cores to prefer).

All those things, operating together, help the processor keep cooler by using the most efficient cores for boosting and go into and out of deep sleep states more frequently.

 

[KotaBushnell]

If I use Ryzen Balanced, I'm 50+ for idle. I can't say that I've seen any of those settings available in my BIOS. I'm using a Prime B350-Plus mobo. I'll try to check now.

 

[drea.drechsler]

If I use Ryzen Balanced, I'm 50+ for idle. I can't say that I've seen any of those settings available in my BIOS. I'm using a Prime B350-Plus mobo. I'll try to check now.

What ver. BIOS are you on? Probably 5407 is best...but it's hard to say if it includes AGESA 1004b or not. Zen2 support on B350 is really spotty as AMD doesn't officially support it.

 

[KotaBushnell]

What ver. BIOS are you on? Probably 5407 is best...but it's hard to say if it includes AGESA 1004b or not. Zen2 support on B350 is really spotty as AMD doesn't officially support it.

Bios Version 5407. I do plan on upgrading my mobo however - wanting to wait on the B550's next month, or get a decent x570.

 

[KotaBushnell]

What ver. BIOS are you on? Probably 5407 is best...but it's hard to say if it includes AGESA 1004b or not. Zen2 support on B350 is really spotty as AMD doesn't officially support it.

From my understanding, this BIOS version has Agesa, but I'm really not sure what that is.

 

[drea.drechsler]

Bios Version 5407. I do plan on upgrading my mobo however - wanting to wait on the B550's next month, or get a decent x570.

That's probably a good strategy...AMD's messed us up this time with Zen3. But do keep in mind that Zen4 is probably not going to be on AM4 so even a 500 series chipset isn't going to help.

But for now, search through to see if you can find a section with those settings, Global C States and CoolnQuiet should at least be there since it's needed for ALL AMD processors on AM4, even Gen 1.

It might be in the TweakUI section...maybe something called CPU Features or something like that. I'm not that familiar with Asus' BIOS to know where to point you!

And it will definitely have an AGESA as it's the microcode for initializing the CPU and chipset. I'm sure it's ver 1003abba at least since that's the last they explicitly mentioned. You can look in the BIOS section of HWInfo 64's INFO display to see what the major ver no. of AGESA you have if interested; it will just say 1003 or 1004 depending.

 

[Wolf96xz]

Basically, you ignore the temperature spikes. For my 3700X I set custom fan profiles to keep fans at a barely audible constant speed up until processor temp gets to 65-70C then start ramping up. I don't let it get really loud enough to be bothersome until 85 or 90C, then only at 95C (Tjmax) does it get anywhere close to 100%.

BTW...i'm using a CM LM-240 AIO. With liquid cooler, always remember that really fast radiator fan speeds do very little before the liquid has thermally saturated. That can take something like 2 hours or more at extremely heavy processing with a 240mm AIO. So you want to keep them at a comfortable level as much as you can since it does little to know good to let them get loud too soon.

And don't just use others' voltages as what you think are 'best' for yours. You have to experiment some...set an offset and do a benchmark like Cinebench20. Be sure to run both single thread and multithread and compare to what it's like with voltage at AUTO to see if you've started to kill performance.

I have changed the offset of my CPU to a value of -0.0750V and the temperatures with Firefox open are between 45-47ºC and at some point it reaches 50ºC. I have performed the Cinebench r20 test and the maximum temperature has been 72ºC and with a score of 4457.

Does this data indicate that there is a balance between the undervolt and the performance of this CPU? I have also checked the CPU fan settings with Hardware Monitor but left it all by default. Maybe in the future I will touch them if I see it necessary, but I would say that these values are correct.

Regards.

 

[drea.drechsler]

I have changed the offset of my CPU to a value of -0.0750V and the temperatures with Firefox open are between 45-47ºC and at some point it reaches 50ºC. I have performed the Cinebench r20 test and the maximum temperature has been 72ºC and with a score of 4457.

Does this data indicate that there is a balance between the undervolt and the performance of this CPU? I have also checked the CPU fan settings with Hardware Monitor but left it all by default. Maybe in the future I will touch them if I see it necessary, but I would say that these values are correct.

Regards.

A 3700X should be able to deliver a CineBench 20 MT score in the 4900-5050 range just set up stock but all the right settings in BIOS. Operating with a tweaked PBO it can return scores upwards of 5150 (mine does) and more (some have reported up to 5190). So I'd say it's underperforming but if just because of the undervolt it's hard to say for sure. Run some with it set to auto to get some baseline scores to work with.

BTW...a quicker test is the CPUz single thread and multi-thread benchmark. It's not quite as exhaustive, and probably not as good for comparisons, but it's something to let you know quickly if you're improving or hurting performance after making a change.

50C is way low temp so you've got a lot of safety margin. With your cooling you shouldn't be afraid of it going up to 80C in the middle of a benchmark test like CB20. That's only because 80C is the point the processor starts lowering it's clocks faster and faster and with your enough cooling it should be able to stay below that.

 

[Wolf96xz]

A 3700X should be able to deliver a CineBench 20 MT score in the 4900-5050 range just set up stock but all the right settings in BIOS. Operating with a tweaked PBO it can return scores upwards of 5150 (mine does) and more (some have reported up to 5190). So I'd say it's underperforming but if just because of the undervolt it's hard to say for sure. Run some with it set to auto to get some baseline scores to work with.

BTW...a quicker test is the CPUz single thread and multi-thread benchmark. It's not quite as exhaustive, and probably not as good for comparisons, but it's something to let you know quickly if you're improving or hurting performance after making a change.

50C is way low temp so you've got a lot of safety margin. With your cooling you shouldn't be afraid of it going up to 80C in the middle of a benchmark test like CB20. That's only because 80C is the point the processor starts lowering it's clocks faster and faster and with your enough cooling it should be able to stay below that.

I have made the CineBench r20 test with the voltages in car, without the offset and it has given me a score of 4507. I have also performed a bench with cpu-z with the 16 threads and it gives me the score of 5313.8 approx.

Temperatures around 68-72ºC in the Cinebench test. I don't quite understand these low numbers. And in the similarity between the values being in auto and offset. Should I really be concerned or do I let it be with the -0.0750V undervolting I had?

EDIT: With undervolting -0.0750V and closing some programs in the background cinebench has given me the score of 4632 ~ 4630 approx. I no longer understand anything, I begin to think that the performance may be affected by causes other than the CPU, such as the W10 itself or some programs that act in the background, consuming CPU without knowing it.

Regards.

 

[drea.drechsler]

I have made the CineBench r20 test with the voltages in car, without the offset and it has given me a score of 4507. I have also performed a bench with cpu-z with the 16 threads and it gives me the score of 5313.8 approx.

Temperatures around 68-72ºC in the Cinebench test. I don't quite understand these low numbers. And in the similarity between the values being in auto and offset. Should I really be concerned or do I let it be with the -0.0750V undervolting I had?

EDIT: With undervolting -0.0750V and closing some programs in the background cinebench has given me the score of 4632 ~ 4630 approx. I no longer understand anything, I begin to think that the performance may be affected by causes other than the CPU, such as the W10 itself or some programs that act in the background, consuming CPU without knowing it.

Regards.

Cinebench is very sensitive to other processes running. It's also very sensitive to processor and system temperature so running it in quick succession repeatedly will get slower results each time. The way I run it to get most repeatable and predictable results is to reboot and open it first thing and shut down everything you may have running the the system tray.

After opening it, open Task Manager and put the Cinebench process in RealTime mode...that's on the DETAILS tab, find Cinebench process, right click on it. That helps it to ignore anything else in window that's running so be aware it will seem like it's locked up until it's finished running the benchmark; the mouse pointer won't even move on the screen.

EDIT: and whether you should be concerned...probably not. There's so much variability with the way systems work and motherboards are setup by default by MFR's. Even memory can have a significant effect as tweaking up memory speed and timings with synchronized infinity fabric with low latencies are significant performance impacts for Ryzen. What it does say is that you might have some performance improvement potential if you want to explore overclocking memory and tweaking PBO to overcome the compromises made by your motherboard mfr.