Sacrificing Cathodion for a mana ability (Ashnod's Altar, ..

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

Hello,
as we all know, "A mana ability is either (a) an activated ability that
could put mana into a player's mana pool when it resolves or (b) a triggered
ability that triggers from a mana ability and could produce additional
mana." The examples of the latter are Wild Growth, Rampant Growth,
Heartbeat of Spring/Mana Flare, Vernal Bloom etc.

Now, Cathodion's triggered ability ("When ~ is put into a graveyard from
play, add {3} to your mana pool") looks like a regular triggered ability,
not a mana ability. My question, however, is the following: what if it
triggers *from playing a mana ability*, such as Krark-Clan Ironworks' and
others mentioned in the subject? Does it resolve immediately? For example,
if I want to play an artifact spell costing {5}, can I announce it and then
sac a Cathodion to KCI getting the full {5} at once, or should I first sac,
wait for the triggered ability to resolve and then use the {5} in my mana
pool? The latter gives the opponent a possibility to play instants before I
get to play my artifact - such as Time Stop, which will make me mana burn
for 2, adding injury to insult...

Thanks in advance,
Arkady.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

Arkady Zilberberg wrote:
> Hello,
> as we all know, "A mana ability is either (a) an activated ability
that
> could put mana into a player's mana pool when it resolves or (b) a
triggered
> ability that triggers from a mana ability and could produce
additional
> mana." The examples of the latter are Wild Growth, Rampant Growth,
Oops, my mistake - was thinking about Fertile Ground---^^^^^^^
> Heartbeat of Spring/Mana Flare, Vernal Bloom etc.
>

 

[Maz]

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

No it doesn't resolved immediately as it is never a mana ability.

It doesn't trigger on playing a mana ability but on being put into the
graveyard.
You'll have to wait until after the trigger resolves to get the mana
into your pool.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

Arkady Zilberberg <arkadyz1@yahoo.com> wrote:
>as we all know, "A mana ability is either (a) an activated ability that
>could put mana into a player's mana pool when it resolves or (b) a triggered
>ability that triggers from a mana ability and could produce additional
>mana." The examples of the latter are Wild Growth, Rampant Growth,
>Heartbeat of Spring/Mana Flare, Vernal Bloom etc.

Yep. It's slightly different from "Any ability that could produce mana".

>Now, Cathodion's triggered ability ("When ~ is put into a graveyard from
>play, add {3} to your mana pool") looks like a regular triggered ability,
>not a mana ability.

It is not a mana ability, correct.

>My question, however, is the following: what if it
>triggers *from playing a mana ability*, such as Krark-Clan Ironworks' and
>others mentioned in the subject?

The definition doesn't change depending on what is actually happening in the
game. Cathodion doesn't trigger off of a mana ability; its trigger event is
"When ~ is put into a graveyard from play". WHY this happens isn't asked by
the rules; the rules don't look to see if Cathodion went there "due to a mana
ability" or not. They just look to see what Cathodion says.

In other words, whether an ability is a mana ability or not doesn't depend at
all on the game state; it just depends on the wording of the ability. It can't
change, for a given ability.

> Does it resolve immediately?

Nope, because Cathodion's triggered ability is NOT a mana ability. Because
of this, it uses the stack. Regardless of WHY it went to the graveyard.

> For example,
>if I want to play an artifact spell costing {5}, can I announce it and then
>sac a Cathodion to KCI getting the full {5} at once, or should I first sac,
>wait for the triggered ability to resolve and then use the {5} in my mana
>pool? The latter gives the opponent a possibility to play instants before I
>get to play my artifact - such as Time Stop, which will make me mana burn
>for 2, adding injury to insult...

The latter is the actuality; your Cathodion's ability, as well as Carpet of
Flowers' and Carnival of Souls' in the "C" section of Oracle, is not a mana
ability. That doesn't change, regardless of what's going on in the game itself.

Dave
--
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