System Builder Marathon: Sub-$1000 PC

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[citation][nom]The_Blood_Raven[/nom] The PSU is troubling, 400w can be plenty, but the quality is what does not convince me.[/citation]
If you aren't convinced by a high quality unit than what does convince you?
 
Me, I think somebody is getting paid to flog older sub-perf parts to newbeez.

Thx for the mention of defects re ram. That was rich. :)

To those worried about 4850 heat issues, apparently there is an easy fix to bring temps into comfort zone. see this link here -
http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?p=2751569#post2751569

Also I am getting a lot of giggles reading these posts. :)

I seem to be spending more and more time reading quality reviews at other sites - Toms is an announcement arena at best while anand, g3d, tekpowrup, and legitreviews run serious testing and reports without tYpos and ambiguityzzz.

oops - I have only read page 1 - hope this isn't too repetitive.

My approach to the 1000 pc is to leave room for upgrade - like 1 4850-card for pow now and (sigh) do I need another later? I think a carefully researched mobo is essential. The 780G approach I intended - search anandtech - is out!! due to cheap mosfet meltdown. (anand is a brutal tester - he even shows pix of the wreckage). I have been burned by mobo manus b4 and they are all being smug and quiet re this issue. I respect honesty rather than cheap product dumps. Anand told them b4 and now he is showing pix :) (see "three amigos" amd the killer reviews on the new 9950 cpu's which were "announced" here) LMAO

back to reading the rest of this comedy :) This is where research pays off. /p
 
For those dismissing calls for the Radeon HD 4850, just look at $4000 PC:

By now many of you are probably wondering why we didn’t choose a pair of the new GTX 280 graphics cards for our highest-priced system. This marathon was in fact supposed to run two weeks ago, prior to the release of the GTX 280, and an announcement date had not even been set during this article’s planning stages when we procured components. We’re sure many of you have experienced the let down of ordering parts and watching as new ones are released before you’ve even gotten your newly-outdated system running, and our experience should provide some consolation.
Click to expand...

That was published on June 23, 2008! Why shouldn't the 4850 deserve to be mentioned here when if they bothered mentioning the GTX 280? And considering 2x 4850 is still under $1000 (2x $188 vs. 2x $199 -> new total of $990) and beats a Geforce 9800 GX2 or not too behind depending on benchmark (by extensionm it should beat a Geforce 8800 GT SLI pretty easily).
 
I want to buy this system why can i not do this through toms hardware?
 
hmm - i can spec out an Intel build for $855 with more 'oomph' using the newer HD4850 setup

Intel E7200 $130 (-$0)
XIGMATEK HDT-S963 92mm Rifle CPU Cooler $25 (-$1)
ASUS P5K PRO LGA 775 Intel P35 ATX Intel Motherboard $104 (-$46)
SAPPHIRE 100242L Radeon HD 4850 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFire Supported Video Card $350 (-$26)
OCZ Reaper HPC 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500) $39 (-$16)
Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 ST3500630AS 500GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive $80 (-$0)
Audio Chipset Realtek ALC883 8-channels $00 (onboard) (-$0)
COOLER MASTER Centurion 534 RC-534-KKN2-GP $53 (-$17)
RAIDMAX HYBRID 2 RX-530SS 530W ATX12V V2.2/ EPS12V Modular LED Power Supply $40 (-$7 and 130W more w/crossfire support & modular)
Sony NEC Optiarc 20X DVD±R Burner Black SATA Model AD-7200S-0B $24 (-$1)
(1) OKGEAR D12SL-12 120mm Case Fan $4.50 (-$0)
(1) ZALMAN ZM-F1 80mm Case Fan $5 (+.50)
 
[citation][nom]anonymouse[/nom]hmm - i can spec out an Intel build for $855 with more 'oomph' using the newer HD4850 setupIntel E7200 $130 (-$0)XIGMATEK HDT-S963 92mm Rifle CPU Cooler $25 (-$1)ASUS P5K PRO LGA 775 Intel P35 ATX Intel Motherboard $104 (-$46)SAPPHIRE 100242L Radeon HD 4850 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFire Supported Video Card $350 (-$26)OCZ Reaper HPC 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500) $39 (-$16)Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 ST3500630AS 500GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive $80 (-$0)Audio Chipset Realtek ALC883 8-channels $00 (onboard) (-$0)COOLER MASTER Centurion 534 RC-534-KKN2-GP $53 (-$17)RAIDMAX HYBRID 2 RX-530SS 530W ATX12V V2.2/ EPS12V Modular LED Power Supply $40 (-$7 and 130W more w/crossfire support & modular)Sony NEC Optiarc 20X DVD±R Burner Black SATA Model AD-7200S-0B $24 (-$1)(1) OKGEAR D12SL-12 120mm Case Fan $4.50 (-$0)(1) ZALMAN ZM-F1 80mm Case Fan $5 (+.50)[/citation]

That's a great system for the most part, though I'd trust a 400W Silverstone power supply more than I would a 530W Raidmax. I wouldn't be surprised if, over the long term, the 400W Silverstone survived a higher sustained load.

It's unfortunate that this series was delayed until after the release of the HD 4850, because the system they built would have looked much better several weeks ago when it was built.
 
[citation][nom]Crashman[/nom]It's unfortunate that this series was delayed until after the release of the HD 4850, because the system they built would have looked much better several weeks ago when it was built.[/citation]
Amen to that. However I'd still like to have a system with two 8800GTs in SLI. Honestly I wouldn't care whether 2 HD4850s are faster, because 2 8800GTs are also pretty damn fast. Beats my single 9600GT by a mile.
 


So, you wouldn't care to spend MORE money for SLOWER cards !? :lol:
Sory mate, you sound like complete idiot (nvidia fan boy)!
 


LOL, he said he wouldn't mind HAVING such a system, ie, if he had one he'd still like it even if it was outdated by the 4850 release. He never said he'd spend the money to build one now. So, you misinterpreted what he said pretty badly, then called HIM and idiot?
 

That's exactly right. I'd definitely get a 4850 over an 8800GT now, but there is nothing wrong with an 8800GT SLI rig. That would still be a beast at most resolutions.


This is at least the second time I've been called an Nvidia fanboy, and both times by narrow-minded people. For starters, the HD4850 is NOT cheaper than the 8800GT, so I would be spending LESS money for SLOWER cards or MORE money for FASTER cards. Logical? I damn well think so. But I would still get the HD4850s if I had the money.
 
Yes, the Centurion case is a poor example of how to build a case with a bottom mounted power supply. When looking at the Antec P180, P182, P190 cases, those cases really show the advantage of properly designed cases with bottom mounted power supplies. A lot of the author's arguments don't hold water with the Antec P series cases.
a) no dust from carpet, since air is drawn from the front
b) no heating of video cards since power supply is in a separate compartment
c) the included "extra" case fans run quietly, so at medium PSU loads, it should run quieter than with just the PSU fan, since at medium loads, two fans rotating SLOWER are usually QUIETER than one fan exhausting the same amount of air. Definitely at low loads when the PSU fan is barely running, the single fan system's going to be quieter.

Plus if you're going to buy that type of case, it would be a wise thing to BUY A POWER SUPPLY SUITED FOR SUCH A CASE! So for the Antec cases that means "old" style power supplies with a fan that sucks out the back and with long power leads... which also means, unfortunately, not inexpensive enough for the budget build, and not super quiet. (My personal choice was an Antec P180 with a PC Power & Cooling Silencer 750 SLI, which still runs at abour $250 retail for the combo.)
 
a) The air has to come from somewhere, so it comes from the floor in front of the power supply. That helps a little, but it's not a cure.
b) Second graphics cards run EXTREMELY HOT because the compartment is too close to the sink. I tried a Striker Extreme with two 8800GTX's and just about burned the bottom one. It was ALMOST as bad as the middle one when running 3 8800GTX's
c) Bull.

D:)!!! The cabling still sux.

E) Any drawbacks of using a bottom-mounted power supply are needless, since top-mounted power supplies don't have those drawbacks.

F) The grade the idiots who came up with this idea would probably have gotten in an engineering design school.
 

Ooops, my mistake! :sol:
Please accept my apologies :)

 
[citation][nom]randomizer[/nom]It's funny how a suddenly card becomes worse when another card is released better than it, even funnier when a few weeks ago this was THE card to buy. Did you stop to consider when this article was written? Perhaps the card wasn't available when they wrote this, and in order to get the article out on time they had to go with "crappy" cards.[/citation]

Well said.
 
I noticed that Tom's choice of June 2008 system is mainly affected by overclocking possibilities, but I am intended to build a PC that costs around, not sub, $1,000, without overclocking and without dual graphics cards, but using Core 2 Duo 8400 CPU, what appropriate components do anyone advice me to incorporate???
 
I noticed that Tom's choice of June 2008 system is mainly affected by overclocking possibilities, but I am intended to build a PC that costs around, not sub, $1,000, without overclocking and without dual graphics cards, but using Core 2 Duo 8400 CPU, what appropriate components do anyone advice me to incorporate???
Click to expand...

Gigabyte GA-EP35-DS3R motherboard and your favorite brand of HD 4850 graphics.
 
I have a bottom mounted Cooler Master case/PSU and both motherboard power connectors are right at the top, the 4 pin one being at the top rear. The thick power cables have to stretch right across the middle of the system. Not too many complaints about a bottom mounted PSU until I got a graphics card which made things interesting. The 4-pin cable now goes around the front of the card and is quite tight. I have had the 4-pin cable to also get caught in the CPU or case fan too with this setup. I was always suspicious of a bottom mounted supply before I bought one but almost all of Cooler Master's cases are bottom mounted.
 
"When Intel designed the ATX form factor, the power supply fan was designated as the primary case fan. Being placed at the top of the case, a power supply could easily draw heat away from the hot CPU and VRM components, expelling it out the power supply’s rear panel."
Actually, it's just the opposite. When the ATX standard was introduced the fan pulled air inside from behind the case, as crazy as that sounds. This was done because a common problem with AT systems was that the floppy disk, optical disc, and tape drives would eventually fill with dust and fail as the negative pressure pulls air in through the devices in the front in any systems that used the PSU fan as the primary fan (less or no CFMs from other intake fans). Of course, it had the effect of drawing in pre-heated air and cooling performance suffered. Manufacturers very quickly deviated from the specification and the spec was eventually changed. Intel's designs for ATX+12v "Pentium 4" PSUs required vents on the bottom along with the new AUX and 12V connectors but still didn't require it to have a fan.
 
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