The dems say voter ID laws are unconstitutional ...

[riser]

Will someone please explain to me how one can prove they are a citzen?

If people had a voter registration card and could prove they were the person on the card, that's fine.

If you go to court you have to show a way to prove who you are.

You have a volunteer force conducting the vote process. They are not heavily trained in the process and a system to identify people for voter verification needs to take place. While it may not necessarily require a photo ID, some form should be required. At my previous voting district I had to take in a photo ID, or a bill with my name on it at the address listed on file.

While we may disagree on how to verify people, we all should be able to agree that something more needs to be done to remove voter fraud.

 

[johnsonma]

Will someone please explain to me how one can prove they are a citzen?

If people had a voter registration card and could prove they were the person on the card, that's fine.

If you go to court you have to show a way to prove who you are.

You have a volunteer force conducting the vote process. They are not heavily trained in the process and a system to identify people for voter verification needs to take place. While it may not necessarily require a photo ID, some form should be required. At my previous voting district I had to take in a photo ID, or a bill with my name on it at the address listed on file.

While we may disagree on how to verify people, we all should be able to agree that something more needs to be done to remove voter fraud.

I do think voter fraud on a larger scale needs to be addressed. I think more oversight over voting officials would help.(I know you probably won't agree with that but not sure what else will help). Involving more technology in the process would help as well. Of course then you would open yourself up to electronic fraud.

 

[chunkymonster]

Voting is the right of every American, by requiring them to get an ID you are admitting that it is no longer a right but a privilege.

As oldmangamer clearly demonstrates, it is up to the State's to determine the requirements for voting. If the people and the State legislature votes for and passes voter ID requirements, then the people have Constitutionally self determined their States voting requirements. And, as long as the State does not usurp Constitutional power, then there is nothing about a State following the democratic process of our republic that somehow magically turns a Constitutional right of the people to vote into a State regulated privilege. Coincidentally, all States have existing voter ID requirements. All States require you to prove American citizenship and proof of address. So, based on existing law's alone, your argument makes no sense.

Do not confuse existing States requirements of a citizen to providing ID in order to register to vote with existing/proposed photo voter ID laws.

Requiring voter ID's makes no sense and it will accomplish nothing while possibly causing some people to be excluded from voting. There is no ground from which to argue why enacting this kind of law makes sense.

The Supreme Court ruled in 2008 that photo voter ID laws are absolutely constitutional and are a good way to ensure the integrity of elections and prevent voter fraud. So, apparently you believe that the US Supreme Court's ruling makes no sense regardless of the fact that they found photo/voter ID laws absolutely Constitutional.

Also, the implication that voter ID laws and/or photo voter ID requirements disenfranchise or exclude any segment of the population has been proven false and to be a democratic/progressive narrative scare tactic perpetrated upon the elderly, youth, and minorities. The Democrat/Progressive claim that voter ID laws disenfranchise 10-11% of the population completely ignores the fact that the 10-11% they claim are disenfranchised fail to obtain or maintain the proper state issued identification needed to vote. Failure of the 10-11% to follow the laws and requirements that the other 90-91% of the voting public is able to follow does not equal a disenfranchised voter. That notion is wrong, false, bogus, and complete bull$hit.

Your forgetting to mention the amendments that have been passed regarding this. Not to mention you are forgetting that it serves no purpose.

What Amendments? Please link. And, please DO NOT claim the 15th Amendment.

 

[chunkymonster]

Will someone please explain to me how one can prove they are a citzen?

By possessing or obtaining one of the following documents; Birth Certificate, Naturalization Certificate, Passport, Consular Registration of Birth Abroad, Tribal Membership Card, Certificate of Citizenship, hospital birth records, United States Adoption Decree, drivers license, State issued non-driver photo ID, work or school identification card, or a military photo ID .

 

[riser]

By possessing or obtaining one of the following documents; Birth Certificate, Naturalization Certificate, Passport, Consular Registration of Birth Abroad, Tribal Membership Card, Certificate of Citizenship, hospital birth records, United States Adoption Decree, drivers license, State issued non-driver photo ID, work or school identification card, or a military photo ID .

Seems reasonable that one of those should be presented at time of voting.. as all citizens should have one eh?

 

[chunkymonster]

I do think voter fraud on a larger scale needs to be addressed.

Do some research. Large scale voter fraud is practically non-existent. There have been a number of attempts to commit large scale voter fraud, but studies and cases where people or organizations have been prosecuted for actual voter fraud are extremely rare. Claims of individual voter fraud are irrational as each person offers their legal signature on the vote registry and makes a personal choice to vote and participate in the election. Why would an individual cast a fraudulent vote lest they negate their own vote?

I think more oversight over voting officials would help.(I know you probably won't agree with that but not sure what else will help).

No, more oversight is not the solution; enforcement of existing laws and regulations along with the appropriate check-and-balances is what is necessary before the need for any new oversight or regulation can be determined.

 

[johnsonma]

http://archive.fairvote.org/index.php?page=1161

All of these are examples of expanding the voting rights, not limiting them. I could argue that requiring someone to pay money to get an ID is a tax and therefore discriminatory. If they gave everyone a free ID I would be much more comfortable with this law.

You say that passing these ID laws will somehow prevent fraud but you have no evidence to support this position. Fraud at the individual level is almost non existent and yet almost everyone here refuses to accept or even broach that subject. I don't understand how its beyond the comprehension of some that voting fraud is perpetrated mostly through behind the scene measures.

Yes the Supreme Court ruled that states could require ID's, however I don't think they accurately looked at who is affected by this law. That is what they ruled and I will have to live with it.

 

[johnsonma]

Do some research. Large scale voter fraud is practically non-existent. There have been a number of attempts to commit large scale voter fraud, but studies and cases where people or organizations have been prosecuted for actual voter fraud are extremely rare. Claims of individual voter fraud are irrational as each person offers their legal signature on the vote registry and makes a personal choice to vote and participate in the election. Why would an individual cast a fraudulent vote lest they negate their own vote?

No, more oversight is not the solution; enforcement of existing laws and regulations along with the appropriate check-and-balances is what is necessary before the need for any new oversight or regulation can be determined.

Large scale might have been to loose of a term. We don't not have to worry about the common citizen committing voter fraud. We have to worry about the people carrying out the elections committing fraud.

 

[wanamingo]

I would also like to add that in many instances of "Voter Fraud" a photo ID would not have stopped the offender anyway.

 

[chunkymonster]

Seems reasonable that one of those should be presented at time of voting.. as all citizens should have one eh?

Yes, all America citizens should have one of those documents. You should note that those are just the documents necessary to prove citizenship.

The documents needed to register to vote are an altogether different requirement. One of those documents and another form of ID is required to register to vote in any given State. For example; here are (my State) the New Jersey Voter Registration requirements...

To register in New Jersey you must be:
- A United States citizen
- At least 18 years old by the next election
- A resident of the county for 30 days before the election
- Cannot have been judged as mentally incompetent
- Cannot be serving a sentence or on parole or probation, as a result of a conviction of an indictable offense under state or federal law.
- If you’re a first-time voter who registers by mail, you’re required to submit proof of identification either at the time of registration or when you vote. You can include a copy of your identification with your registration form today! Acceptable forms of ID include: a current utility bill, bank statement, valid photo ID, government check, paycheck, or other government document that shows your name and address.

You must be registered to vote in the State in which you reside in order to actually vote. Not just show up at the polling place with a Birth Certificate at the last minute and expect to be able to vote.

 

[riser]

- Cannot have been judged as mentally incompetent


How does anyone in New Jersey vote?!?! 😱

 

[johnsonma]

The people judging them are also mentally incompetent. Its a vicious cycle.

 

[riser]

Need more regulation then, eh John?

 

[johnsonma]

If they are proud of the show "Jersey Shore" then maybe....haha. In the end they get to vote like the rest of us.

On a side note they got some serious gun laws in place over there.