Time Warner, Embarq Hopes to Kill Little ISP

[deathblooms2k1]

[citation][nom]jgoette[/nom]"Will my taxes go up because this project is so expensive?No. The funds for constructing the fiber network come from bonds issued by the City of Wilson. Tax revenues are not being used to fund this project in any way."taken straight from greenlight FAQ[/citation]

Even if your taxes were going to go up, it wouldn't happen without the input of the community first. I don't pretend to know how the City of Wilson works, but the City I live in has City Council that represents the various wards, something like this would go through a long approval process that would need to be approved by the Council before any tax $ would get earmarked for the project.

I imagine that the majority of tax payers in Wilson were in favor of the project.

 

[The Schnoz]

[citation][nom]cielmerlion[/nom]I see what youre getting at but I believe that what TWC and embarq are doing is wrong. I dont see a moral dilemma with the government stepping in and giving fair prices. If TWC want their customers back they should offer more competitive prices and use all their huge profits to improve their infrastructure so they can provide even better services. But all they are trying to do is maximize their profits without improving a damn thing.[/citation]
That capitalism. The government should not be stepping in. This needs to be fixed in the private sector.

 

[truehighroller]

The services I have options of switching to in my area suck compared to TW . I am stuck until FIOS gets here and they do not know when they will be coming this way (their service is thirty minutes from me).

 

[The Schnoz]

[citation][nom]jgoette[/nom]"Will my taxes go up because this project is so expensive?No. The funds for constructing the fiber network come from bonds issued by the City of Wilson. Tax revenues are not being used to fund this project in any way."taken straight from greenlight FAQ[/citation]
The FAQ sheet was about whether or not taxes would go up, the answer was "no" because the project is paid for by bonds the city purchased, but the pbonds did cost tax payer dollars. Now forget the taxes, what about arrangments with the city these companies have to make? In order to rebuild a network it requires city permits to tear up the street and put in new cable. Theres also franchise agreements and such that cable companies have to have with the different cities. This gives the city council a conflict of interest. The fact of the matter is it wasnt fair to the citizens what Time Warner and Embarq were doing, and now it's not fair to Embarq and Time Warner what the citizens are doing.

 

[DarkMatterBT]

Wow, it's just one thing after another with these assholes. I hope anyone who has a choice changes service from these stupid SOB's.

 

[EntropyMu]

It's likely that Time Warner (or whatever cable company Time Warner ate) got breaks/deals/funding from the city to put in the original cable lines. Now that the city has done it with a new company the old ones are upset at the idea of it.

 

[deltatux]

if the City of Toronto partnered with municipal governments in the Greater Toronto Area to build a fibre optic network and offer them at a low price, I'd happily drop Rogers and switch.

This is where competition wins. Full support for Greenlight. Small ISPs are the only danger for these conglomerates and they know it. They're the only ones who can innovate and these conglomerates are f**kin' scared of innovation and dishing low prices to us consumers.

Go competition!

 

[Guest]

"TWC and Embarq’s argument is that it’s impossible for big companies to turn a profit and compete against a community-owned company that offers customers the service at a price that's much closer to the cost."

I say there is something wrong with your company then. It's very obvious that it can be done....simple fact is that TWC is not willing to do it.

I wish more communities and local governments would do this. This is competition at its finest and now the mega-corporations are whining because they can't monopolize.

I issue a hardy F U! Time Warner.

 

[mav0100]

Time Warner wouldn't have to deal with local citizens banding together to do these types of things if they would just offer a decent service at a reasonable price. Ever city should do this and get rid of these greedy cable monopolies once and for all.

The same goes with other utilities as well. Where I live, electricity costs an arm and a leg. But a few miles away, a local community has it's own electric service, and it costs 1/4 as much. So much less, in fact, that the majority of the people their heat their homes with electric baseboards instead of oil as in my town.

I'm all for a business to try to profit - when it's not a monopoly and has to deal with competition. When it's a utility - there shouldn't be a profit. And, like it or not, cable and internet service IS a utility in this day and age.

 

[gorehound]

I really wish that I had an option to dump TW.I am really fed up with all the BS they are doing and do not want them to receive any of my money but thanks to this country they have a damned monopoly in portland maine.
TW YOU SUCK !!!!

 

[v-man]

Cry me a river TWC and Embarq.

You better learn how to compete with these guys or just take your terrible service and go home.

This is exactly what is needed to spur advancement of broadband services in the US. Cities/companies challenging the status quo of mega telecom providing only the service they deem necessary.

People will soon find out that basic access, and in this case world-class access, to the Internet does not cost that much. Also it does not have to be a bundled service with voice, TV, and data (but that's another story.)

We need more of this!

 

[crisisavatar]

it’s impossible for big companies to turn a profit and compete against a community-owned company that offers customers the service at a price that's much closer to the cost.

are they Fing serious ?

 

[The Schnoz]

[citation][nom]v-man[/nom]Cry me a river TWC and Embarq. You better learn how to compete with these guys or just take your terrible service and go home. This is exactly what is needed to spur advancement of broadband services in the US. Cities/companies challenging the status quo of mega telecom providing only the service they deem necessary. People will soon find out that basic access, and in this case world-class access, to the Internet does not cost that much. Also it does not have to be a bundled service with voice, TV, and data (but that's another story.)We need more of this![/citation]
I hear you, but you're wrong. More of this would destroy ISP, just as it would destroy an other business. The city is not a business that has to answer to stockholders. They are able to run the company at cost. Time Warner and Embarq must make a profit, not only for their stockholders, but they also need cash on the side for when they do upgrade their network. How successful would Wal-Mart be if every city they were in had a city run store that simply sold the goods at cost. You can't just turn your hatred against Time Warner into a double standard for unfair business practices.

 

[arvedui]

I can't wait until TWC finally goes bankrupt or shuts down... It's going to happen - the question is, how long?

 

[jsloan]

greedy bastards

 

[San Pedro]

There is nothing wrong with what Wilson did. Bottom line is TWC doesn't want competition to be able to start up. Community based projects are inherently good. People working together for the good of the community is a good thing.

And the ISP in question is basically the same as a corporation. All the citizens of Wilson are its shareholders, and what the shareholders want is good internet at a decent price.

Corporations, like someone else said, aren't entitled to making profits everywhere they go, they are just entitled to compete. Unfortunately for the consumer, these tel-com companies have used government for a long time to allow for monopolies in areas, and they aren't used to having to compete, and they certainly don't want to start now.

 

[hemelskonijn]

This is confusing.

Do all residents of the united states of america have enough money to go greenlight ?, sure they have a good deal for those who can afford it but if i lived in the USA with my current income i would have to go TWC.

"Greenlight's highest tier offers 100 Mbps for $300, TWC's Turbo plan offers 10 Mbps for $57."

That is if there is no data cap otherwise i would just move back to europe.
Seems to me like TWC still has the biggest market open for them (those who cant afford to chose are stuck with them any way) so they really should not complain.

 

[michaelahess]

I've always thought non-profit ISP's would be a good idea for smaller areas. They charge just enough to pay salaries, expenses, and expansion costs to keep current. Though it would probably be easier to do this in larger markets simply due to the cost to provide service to a subscriber goes down as there are more customers. It could hurt all ISP's if they don't stay competative, but that's the point of compatition, give the customer the best bang for the buck.

There is no reason new services couldn't be introduced, just cause it's non-profit doesn't mean it's a fixed operating budget with no room to expand.

This would also benefit us from a national security perspective, a bunch of smaller independent systems could weather a "storm" better than the big guys who aggregate data to large data centers.

The ISP I work for is small compared to TWC, Qwest, Comcast, etc, but we are geographically spread out and we have many redundancies built into our network that the larger guys would probably ignore due to excessive expense for very little return. The greed outweighs the common sense with the big guys.

 

[The Schnoz]

[citation][nom]San Pedro[/nom]There is nothing wrong with what Wilson did. Bottom line is TWC doesn't want competition to be able to start up. Community based projects are inherently good. People working together for the good of the community is a good thing. And the ISP in question is basically the same as a corporation. All the citizens of Wilson are its shareholders, and what the shareholders want is good internet at a decent price. Corporations, like someone else said, aren't entitled to making profits everywhere they go, they are just entitled to compete. Unfortunately for the consumer, these tel-com companies have used government for a long time to allow for monopolies in areas, and they aren't used to having to compete, and they certainly don't want to start now.[/citation]
You couldn't be more wrong. This "corporation" is able to operate at cost. This is not a fair business practice. Is it the right thing to do for the good of that community, you could say yes. Of course that would be forgetting the amount of employees Time Warner and Embarq hire from the community that may need to be laid off, and the taxes they pay that may be less next year from the lower revenue they generate, and the community support they give to the local Boys & Girls Clubs that they may need to reduce to make up for losses, etc. Anyway, the point isn't about all that. Its not about what you want, or I want, or any other consumer wants. The point is, is it fair for the government to be in competition with the private sector market. The answer is "No".

 

[michaelahess]

[citation][nom]hemelskonijn[/nom]This is confusing.Do all residents of the united states of america have enough money to go greenlight ?, sure they have a good deal for those who can afford it but if i lived in the USA with my current income i would have to go TWC."Greenlight's highest tier offers 100 Mbps for $300, TWC's Turbo plan offers 10 Mbps for $57."That is if there is no data cap otherwise i would just move back to europe.Seems to me like TWC still has the biggest market open for them (those who cant afford to chose are stuck with them any way) so they really should not complain.[/citation]

Yup, that's what causes consumers to get screwed, bowing to the will of others. We'll leave that in China and North Korea thank you very much.

And since they offer tv, phone, and data at $100 a month, I bet you can get internet for less than TWC. The don't just have a $300 package ya know.

 

[michaelahess]

[citation][nom]The Schnoz[/nom]You couldn't be more wrong. This "corporation" is able to operate at cost. This is not a fair business practice. Is it the right thing to do for the good of that community, you could say yes. Of course that would be forgetting the amount of employees Time Warner and Embarq hire from the community that may need to be laid off, and the taxes they pay that may be less next year from the lower revenue they generate, and the community support they give to the local Boys & Girls Clubs that they may need to reduce to make up for losses, etc. Anyway, the point isn't about all that. Its not about what you want, or I want, or any other consumer wants. The point is, is it fair for the government to be in competition with the private sector market. The answer is "No".[/citation]

I think you are wrong on this. If TWC goes out of that market, it will allow Greenlight to expand thus necessitating the hiring of new employess, those from TWC.

They do have a 20x20 internet only package for $60, that's awesome!

The money saved by consumers on this kind of business will be reinvested into the community instead of the pockets of some a-hole CEO that only sees dollar signs. That will generate more local tax revenue for other services, like Boys and Girls clubs.

It doesn't matter where the competition comes from as long as it's there. If TWC can't cut costs, lower prices, provide superior service (which is cheaper to them anyway) they don't deserve to be in business.

 

[The Schnoz]

[citation][nom]michaelahess[/nom]I think you are wrong on this. If TWC goes out of that market, it will allow Greenlight to expand thus necessitating the hiring of new employess, those from TWC.They do have a 20x20 internet only package for $60, that's awesome!The money saved by consumers on this kind of business will be reinvested into the community instead of the pockets of some a-hole CEO that only sees dollar signs. That will generate more local tax revenue for other services, like Boys and Girls clubs.It doesn't matter where the competition comes from as long as it's there. If TWC can't cut costs, lower prices, provide superior service (which is cheaper to them anyway) they don't deserve to be in business.[/citation]
I've said my peice and your arguments aren't valid to me. You guys make the call. the question is, can you set aside your own greed for fast internet at cheap prices in favor of fair business practicess. If the answer is No then you are just as bad as you accuse Time Warner and Embarq of being.

 

[wikiwikiwhat]

Okay, so we are saying that since the local government is doing this, this will shutdown TWC in that area? Okay then, thats pretty fine. Nothing in that town can happen without it going through city council and meetings where residents are asked to come. If this happened then that means this is what the majority of the town wants to do. When a government does something like this its to support the town.

TWC, if you are reading this (which you aren't) you need to realize that big cities cannot do the same thing, this place is small fry. If there are local people working for TWC they should try to get a job with the city to help with this problem.

 

[The Schnoz]

[citation][nom]michaelahess[/nom]Yup, that's what causes consumers to get screwed, bowing to the will of others. We'll leave that in China and North Korea thank you very much.And since they offer tv, phone, and data at $100 a month, I bet you can get internet for less than TWC. The don't just have a $300 package ya know.[/citation]
Speaking of China, they also use government operated communications companies. Of course they also have censorship over everything. I think allowing this here is opening pandoras box. Maybe it won't happen now, or in this town, but someday, if this is allowed to continue, you will have censorship of the internet and television here in America. The government should not be in control of ou communications are in the private sector. I realize why everyone is attcking Time Warner, but that doesn't mean you should send them packing in favor of a government owned and operated system. Be careful what you wish for.

 

[The Schnoz]

[citation][nom]wikiwikiwhat[/nom]Okay, so we are saying that since the local government is doing this, this will shutdown TWC in that area? Okay then, thats pretty fine. Nothing in that town can happen without it going through city council and meetings where residents are asked to come. If this happened then that means this is what the majority of the town wants to do. When a government does something like this its to support the town.TWC, if you are reading this (which you aren't) you need to realize that big cities cannot do the same thing, this place is small fry. If there are local people working for TWC they should try to get a job with the city to help with this problem.[/citation]
You're missing the bigger picture.