Question using fan hub in cpu_fan header

[tautvexe5]

so my one case fan died, and i replaced it with another one, but this fan makes supper annoying sound when running at 100%, i had no issues with old fans running at 100% since they made a wooshing sound, this one makes some sort of higher whiner sound.

i'm running on ancient hardware (by enthusiast standards, waiting for prices to normalise a bit before upgrading to something new).

MB: GA-B85M-D2V (rev. 1.1)
Fan hub: FH-10

i thought my motherboard supports PWM controll, but based on what chat gpt is telling me while the header is 4 pin, it only works in DC mode (3pin?)


In the manual the pins appear to be pinned differently, so while i dont trust it completely, i can somewhat doubt that it is an actual PWM connector (there is only 1 SYS_FAN on the MB and one CPU_FAN).
I tried to control the sys fan in bios to silent or manual mode, and used the fan control app, no matter what i do it stays at 100% all the time.

The solution i was offered, is to connect hub to the CPU_FAN header and have PWM control this way, but this sounds a bit weird to me.

Is this an option i could use ? (connecting CPU fan header to the first port in the hub so it sees CPU fan RPM and let it adjust case fans accordingly?)
or is this a bad idea and i should make peace with the sound?

no matter what i search for, i cant seem to find why the pins are reversed, but its a bit more clear that it appears it is not PWM header.

So i want to try to use fan hub connected to the CPU_FAN and connect my cpu fan to the first port so it would be reported to the system, in port 2 another PWM fan i want to adjust speed based on the cpu fan "load" and then the other two fans what is a mistery if they are PWM or not be in other slots, is that safe to try, or hub should not be plugged in into the cpu header under any circumstances ?

 

[Lutfij]

Fan hub: FH-10
A Deepcool fan hub.

MB: GA-B85M-D2V (rev. 1.1)
+
i thought my motherboard supports PWM controll, but based on what chat gpt is telling me while the header is 4 pin, it only works in DC mode (3pin?)
Motherboard's of that era, especially MSI, Gigabyte and ASRock only had limited PWM functionality on their FAN headers even if they were 4pin. Asus was the only brand out there(at the time) that had PWM on all their fan headers. It was only a couple of generations after the LGA115x platform that PWM was adopted by all motherboard makers for all boards, regardless of their tier stacking.

Having the fan hub hooked up to CPU_FAN header means that all fans will ramp up and dial down with respect to the CPU temps(or as the board manages CPU's temps).

Lastly, to make sure you're not getting the wrong readings/numbers, per the manual for your fan hub;
https://www.deepcool.com/download/pdf/FH-10_PDF.pdf
make sure the fan for your CPU cooler is hooked to the FAN1 header on the fan hub.

 

[tautvexe5]

Fan hub: FH-10
A Deepcool fan hub.

MB: GA-B85M-D2V (rev. 1.1)
+
i thought my motherboard supports PWM controll, but based on what chat gpt is telling me while the header is 4 pin, it only works in DC mode (3pin?)
Motherboard's of that era, especially MSI, Gigabyte and ASRock only had limited PWM functionality on their FAN headers even if they were 4pin. Asus was the only brand out there(at the time) that had PWM on all their fan headers. It was only a couple of generations after the LGA115x platform that PWM was adopted by all motherboard makers for all boards, regardless of their tier stacking.

Having the fan hub hooked up to CPU_FAN header means that all fans will ramp up and dial down with respect to the CPU temps(or as the board manages CPU's temps).

Lastly, to make sure you're not getting the wrong readings/numbers, per the manual for your fan hub;
https://www.deepcool.com/download/pdf/FH-10_PDF.pdf
make sure the fan for your CPU cooler is hooked to the FAN1 header on the fan hub.

that first clarification helps a lot, its hard to find older threads for this generation mobos, thanks a lot for that.

and thats the plan, to have my actual CPU fan to the first slot to report the RPM not the case fan.

from what i see here, it should be okay to connect the hub to the cpu_fan header, it wont fry it or whatever, that is the only issue i see here since hub is powered by the psu.

if i may, anoher question/clarification i guess

slot 1: CPU fan (ofc PWM)
slot 2: PWM fan (be quiet pure wings 2)
slot 3-4: phantex case fans that are unclear if they are 3pin or 4pin

in this situation slot 1 and 2 will be controlled by PWM (cpu temp basiclly) and if 3-4 are PWM they will also adjust accordingly? (if 3-4 ar actually 3 pin, they will go full bore since they wont get PWM info in this case, or wont turn at all?)

 

[tautvexe5]

Fan hub: FH-10
A Deepcool fan hub.

MB: GA-B85M-D2V (rev. 1.1)
+
i thought my motherboard supports PWM controll, but based on what chat gpt is telling me while the header is 4 pin, it only works in DC mode (3pin?)
Motherboard's of that era, especially MSI, Gigabyte and ASRock only had limited PWM functionality on their FAN headers even if they were 4pin. Asus was the only brand out there(at the time) that had PWM on all their fan headers. It was only a couple of generations after the LGA115x platform that PWM was adopted by all motherboard makers for all boards, regardless of their tier stacking.

Having the fan hub hooked up to CPU_FAN header means that all fans will ramp up and dial down with respect to the CPU temps(or as the board manages CPU's temps).

Lastly, to make sure you're not getting the wrong readings/numbers, per the manual for your fan hub;
https://www.deepcool.com/download/pdf/FH-10_PDF.pdf
make sure the fan for your CPU cooler is hooked to the FAN1 header on the fan hub.

i plugged in my hub into CPU_FAN header and it seems everything is working fine
1st slot CPU fan
2-4th slots Case fans (all were PWM in the end so they all ramp up and down as needed, i'll keep monitoring my GPU and if needed just run middle fan for GPU from the header on the MB if i feel like it will need more cooling)

thanks for your help and explanation, helped me a lot.

 

[Paperdoc]

Your last post got it mostly correct. There are a couple things not quite understood.

Starting point: the main difference between 3- and 4-pin fans is the type of signals each requires from its host header (or hub). For 3-pin fans the ONLY way to control the fan speed is for the header to send out to it on Pin #2 a VARYING Voltage, from 12 VDC for full speed down to 5 VDC for minimum speed without stalling. For 4-pin fans the Voltage on Pin #2 of the header is always the full 12 VDC, but it also sends out from Pin #4 the new PWM signal. Inside such a fan there is a chip that uses this to modify the flow of current from the 12 VDC supply line though the windings to accomplish speed control. Most mobo fan headers now have 4 pins, but the BIOS Setup options for each header offer you a choice of whether it sends out signals in 3-pin (Voltage Control, or DC) or 4-pin (PWM) MODE. In your mobo, OP, it apears the CPU_FAN header works only in PWM Mode, but the SYS_FAN header (even though it has 4 pins) actually can only use the older Voltage Control Mode, so it cannot send any PWM signal from its Pin #4.

A HUB (which is what that Deepcool FH10 unit is) can be used ONLY with 4-pin fans, and with a signal feed from a proper 4-pin fan header. The Hub always supplies (from the PSU) a fixed full 12 VDC Voltage to Pin #2 of all its fans, drawing no power for fans from the host header. Then it shares the PWM signal from the host header to all its fans. So the Hub MUST have a PWM signal to work, AND it can send to all its fans only the PWM speed signal from the host header. So any 3-pin fan connected to that header will always run full speed because it has no special chip to use the PWM signal. Further, if you try to use the Hub from a host header that does NOT provide that PWM signal (such as your SYS_FAN header) the Hub can NOT control the speed of ANY fan. This latter is what you have experienced.

Most cetainly you can do as you suggest - use the Hub from the CPU_FAN header that DOES provide the PWM control signal, and connect all your fans to that header, ensuring that the only fan port that CAN send its fan's speed back to the header is the one used for the actual CPU chip cooler. There are two factors that come into play here. One is that ALL of your fans will be controlled according to the temperture sensor inside the CPU chip and that is not quite ideal for CASE vent fans. But there is a reasonable correlation between CPU workload and mobo component workload, so it is OK. The other is that IF your two_Phanteks case fans are really 3-pin units their speed cannot be controlled this way and those two always will run full speed.

You are not sure about the case fan type, but you can tell by looking. For each of those fans look at the WIRES in the cable from the fan motor to its end connector. Whether the connector itself has 3 or 4 holes in it, the WIRES will tell you. If there are only 3 wires, then it is an older "3-pin fan". If there are 4 wires you have a newer-type "4-pin fan" that CAN be used with that Hub.

The SYS_FAN header uses a different temperature snensor on the mobo to guide ite fans, so that is better for CASE vent fans than the CPU temp sensor. So it would be "ideal" to power and control the two Phanteks case vent fans from that header. Since that header can NOT supply the PWM signal, you must use a different device called a SPLITTER. Beware: sellers use the terms Splitter and Hub as if they were the same, and they are NOT. You have a HUB and will note that it must use a cable that connects to a SATA power output from the PSU for fan power. A SPLITTER does NOT have that PSU connection. It has only one input from a mobo SYS_FAN header, and several outputs to fans. Here's an example

https://www.amazon.com/Pack-PWM-Fan-Splitter-Cable/dp/B09WZSDBGR/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?crid=13W5BMR2UY50U&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.zWvfApLYoU9b0Au_EbrLN2cxuN50u4jKe_6dctrpUlGIERf-EG73pHXFuUFFFYtoCS6B1pOvkoNC5qQNf9nb65diZVpaNBZqZjXn2jpcGCs8tMBs5Kp--x96gYdp_8WVPpAIR3Qi3_SCb3RLXB7Zrz5tdE0zbHIgckp0MXhobd07YAtyLsZkqGlMfChvNyNoS5GMDEtCTM624l0wqhy5yzpDJoiEhmLIypCMvfvCkeo.C8Jqqg1NZDhPmIuSAZbPCVW5Xcw3bxkSG9UVUl9S1x0&dib_tag=se&keywords=fan+splitter&qid=1746544265&sprefix=fan+splitter,aps,131&sr=8-1-spons&sp_csd=d2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9hdGY&th=1

That is a 2-pack with 3 output arms each. Among those, note that only ONE of the outputs has all 4 pins and you must plug one faninto that output. Now rtak intop account this feature of the new 4-pin fan design. Although it is best to use a 4-pin fan with the new PWM signal type, that fan has backwards compatibility and CAN be used WITH full contrlof its peed with an older 3-pin style mobo heade that does NOT provide the PWM signal but DOES vary the Voltage fed to the fan on Pin #2. So, no matter whether the Phanteks case fans are 3-0pin oir 4-pin, you CAN use them together on the SYS_FAN header by using a SPLITTER, Your chose whether you want to do that.

When you use a Splitter, all power for the fans comes from the host header. That header has a lomit of 1.0 A max current available. So you must check the max current spec for each fan on the Splitter and add them up. The total cannot exceed 1.0 A. For 2 typical modern fans, that will be no problem.

 

[DRagor]

To be precise the pinout on both headers is same, it is just the difference of how it is treated. In PWM 12V pin is just that - it supplies 12V to fan. But on DC header fan control is achieved by changing voltage, so it is also 12V pin just it can deliver other voltage as well.

Doh Paperdoc beat me to it so treat it as tldr of his post lol

 

[tautvexe5]

Your last post got it mostly correct. There are a couple things not quite understood.

Starting point: the main difference between 3- and 4-pin fans is the type of signals each requires from its host header (or hub). For 3-pin fans the ONLY way to control the fan speed is for the header to send out to it on Pin #2 a VARYING Voltage, from 12 VDC for full speed down to 5 VDC for minimum speed without stalling. For 4-pin fans the Voltage on Pin #2 of the header is always the full 12 VDC, but it also sends out from Pin #4 the new PWM signal. Inside such a fan there is a chip that uses this to modify the flow of current from the 12 VDC supply line though the windings to accomplish speed control. Most mobo fan headers now have 4 pins, but the BIOS Setup options for each header offer you a choice of whether it sends out signals in 3-pin (Voltage Control, or DC) or 4-pin (PWM) MODE. In your mobo, OP, it apears the CPU_FAN header works only in PWM Mode, but the SYS_FAN header (even though it has 4 pins) actually can only use the older Voltage Control Mode, so it cannot send any PWM signal from its Pin #4.

A HUB (which is what that Deepcool FH10 unit is) can be used ONLY with 4-pin fans, and with a signal feed from a proper 4-pin fan header. The Hub always supplies (from the PSU) a fixed full 12 VDC Voltage to Pin #2 of all its fans, drawing no power for fans from the host header. Then it shares the PWM signal from the host header to all its fans. So the Hub MUST have a PWM signal to work, AND it can send to all its fans only the PWM speed signal from the host header. So any 3-pin fan connected to that header will always run full speed because it has no special chip to use the PWM signal. Further, if you try to use the Hub from a host header that does NOT provide that PWM signal (such as your SYS_FAN header) the Hub can NOT control the speed of ANY fan. This latter is what you have experienced.

Most cetainly you can do as you suggest - use the Hub from the CPU_FAN header that DOES provide the PWM control signal, and connect all your fans to that header, ensuring that the only fan port that CAN send its fan's speed back to the header is the one used for the actual CPU chip cooler. There are two factors that come into play here. One is that ALL of your fans will be controlled according to the temperture sensor inside the CPU chip and that is not quite ideal for CASE vent fans. But there is a reasonable correlation between CPU workload and mobo component workload, so it is OK. The other is that IF your two_Phanteks case fans are really 3-pin units their speed cannot be controlled this way and those two always will run full speed.

You are not sure about the case fan type, but you can tell by looking. For each of those fans look at the WIRES in the cable from the fan motor to its end connector. Whether the connector itself has 3 or 4 holes in it, the WIRES will tell you. If there are only 3 wires, then it is an older "3-pin fan". If there are 4 wires you have a newer-type "4-pin fan" that CAN be used with that Hub.

The SYS_FAN header uses a different temperature snensor on the mobo to guide ite fans, so that is better for CASE vent fans than the CPU temp sensor. So it would be "ideal" to power and control the two Phanteks case vent fans from that header. Since that header can NOT supply the PWM signal, you must use a different device called a SPLITTER. Beware: sellers use the terms Splitter and Hub as if they were the same, and they are NOT. You have a HUB and will note that it must use a cable that connects to a SATA power output from the PSU for fan power. A SPLITTER does NOT have that PSU connection. It has only one input from a mobo SYS_FAN header, and several outputs to fans. Here's an example

https://www.amazon.com/Pack-PWM-Fan-Splitter-Cable/dp/B09WZSDBGR/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?crid=13W5BMR2UY50U&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.zWvfApLYoU9b0Au_EbrLN2cxuN50u4jKe_6dctrpUlGIERf-EG73pHXFuUFFFYtoCS6B1pOvkoNC5qQNf9nb65diZVpaNBZqZjXn2jpcGCs8tMBs5Kp--x96gYdp_8WVPpAIR3Qi3_SCb3RLXB7Zrz5tdE0zbHIgckp0MXhobd07YAtyLsZkqGlMfChvNyNoS5GMDEtCTM624l0wqhy5yzpDJoiEhmLIypCMvfvCkeo.C8Jqqg1NZDhPmIuSAZbPCVW5Xcw3bxkSG9UVUl9S1x0&dib_tag=se&keywords=fan+splitter&qid=1746544265&sprefix=fan+splitter,aps,131&sr=8-1-spons&sp_csd=d2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9hdGY&th=1

That is a 2-pack with 3 output arms each. Among those, note that only ONE of the outputs has all 4 pins and you must plug one faninto that output. Now rtak intop account this feature of the new 4-pin fan design. Although it is best to use a 4-pin fan with the new PWM signal type, that fan has backwards compatibility and CAN be used WITH full contrlof its peed with an older 3-pin style mobo heade that does NOT provide the PWM signal but DOES vary the Voltage fed to the fan on Pin #2. So, no matter whether the Phanteks case fans are 3-0pin oir 4-pin, you CAN use them together on the SYS_FAN header by using a SPLITTER, Your chose whether you want to do that.

When you use a Splitter, all power for the fans comes from the host header. That header has a lomit of 1.0 A max current available. So you must check the max current spec for each fan on the Splitter and add them up. The total cannot exceed 1.0 A. For 2 typical modern fans, that will be no problem.

yeah that's the conclusion i came to after reading a bunch of posts with questions, i know its not ideal but from what i seen spending time in bios "Case temperature" was okay most of the time, ofc i cant test load in bios but the fans are at least spinning, this mobo had spend most of its time before that in a case with only cpu fan so i'm not too worried (also had hotter GPU)

like i mentioned in the post above (probably you were writing your response as i edited my "conclusion") for now i will keep this, if i see that gpu gets hot i will probably get a splitter and run 2 case fans from SYS header as they dont make annoying sound when going full speed or just the middle one that directly feeds air to the gpu, and keep the other one tied in with CPU one (tried some little loads everything seems fine, and pc is way more quiet now its a bit weird)

thanks for taking your time to confirm everything appreciate it