What features do you want in a Cyberpunk RL?

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Auric__ wrote:
> On 19 May 2005 05:52:35 -0700, "BFBeast" <chris5975@web.de> wrote:
>
>
>>As goofy as the movie was, the short story _was_ written by William
>>Gibson 🙂
>
>
> I have to agree with TO here. In the message you replied to, there are
> no less than 6 movies mentioned. *Which* one was based on a Gibson
> story?

I'm guessing he's talking about Johnny Mnemonic, which was a mediocre
movie based on a William Gibson short story. There's also New Rose
Hotel, which I don't remember much of that was also based on a Gibson story.

 

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Twisted One wrote:
> Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
>
>> Well, I was the same -- the first manga/anime contact was
>> Pokemon/Dragonball/Sailor Moon -- talk about an unapealing (to me)
>> mix. But then someone borrowed me a few CD's with anime especialy
>> Berserk. I fell in love ;-).
>>
>> You to should try it some day ;-).
>
> Too bad that would cost money -- the local stations' late-night movies
> invariably are something that can't conceivably be mistaken for anime
> even by an idiot. And on my budget, I want to be absolutely sure I'm not
> going to be wasting my money before I plonk down $30-40 on any store
> countertop. ;P

Well, to be honest -- "Use the P2P, Luke!". And it's not even considered
a crime, cause most of the decent Anime's out there weren't licensed in
the US yet. And if you're really that lazy have someone send you a
burned DVD ;-)
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"11 years and no binary. And it's not vapourware" -- Igor Savin

 

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Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
> Twisted One wrote:
>
>> Too bad that would cost money -- the local stations' late-night movies
>> invariably are something that can't conceivably be mistaken for anime
>> even by an idiot. And on my budget, I want to be absolutely sure I'm
>> not going to be wasting my money before I plonk down $30-40 on any
>> store countertop. ;P
>
> Well, to be honest -- "Use the P2P, Luke!". And it's not even considered
> a crime, cause most of the decent Anime's out there weren't licensed in
> the US yet. And if you're really that lazy have someone send you a
> burned DVD ;-)

Don't get me wrong. I've got no qualms about downloading stuff. The
entertainment industry has done nothing to convince me it needs or
deserves any more money.

It's the disk space. Huge 4GB globs of .avi file just aren't compatible
with a 60GB drive and not much of a budget for getting a second drive.
And I don't have a DVD burner -- just a plain DVD-ROM, and a CD-RW.

--
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
Palladium? Trusted Computing? DRM? Microsoft? Sauron.
"One ring to rule them all, one ring to find them
One ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them."

 

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Twisted One wrote:
> Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
>
>> Twisted One wrote:
>
> >
>
>>> Too bad that would cost money -- the local stations' late-night
>>> movies invariably are something that can't conceivably be mistaken
>>> for anime even by an idiot. And on my budget, I want to be absolutely
>>> sure I'm not going to be wasting my money before I plonk down $30-40
>>> on any store countertop. ;P
>>
>>
>> Well, to be honest -- "Use the P2P, Luke!". And it's not even
>> considered a crime, cause most of the decent Anime's out there weren't
>> licensed in the US yet. And if you're really that lazy have someone
>> send you a burned DVD ;-)
>
>
> Don't get me wrong. I've got no qualms about downloading stuff. The
> entertainment industry has done nothing to convince me it needs or
> deserves any more money.
>
> It's the disk space. Huge 4GB globs of .avi file just aren't compatible
> with a 60GB drive and not much of a budget for getting a second drive.
> And I don't have a DVD burner -- just a plain DVD-ROM, and a CD-RW.

4GB? Most high-quality movies I download fit on a standard CD-R. I
frequently go over to my friend's house, download several movies, and
burn them all to disk. It's as cheap as it gets. I had a full five
seasons of South Park downloaded, and it was still a hair under 4GB.
There's no way a movie could match up to that. I don't expect a
pirated copy of the anime flick Kornel mentioned would take up more
than 650MB.


--
Read more about my three projects, SoulEaterRL,
Necropolis, and a little toy RL.

http://www.freewebs.com/timsrl/index.htm

--

 

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Timothy Pruett wrote:
> 4GB? Most high-quality movies I download fit on a standard CD-R. I
> frequently go over to my friend's house, download several movies, and
> burn them all to disk. It's as cheap as it gets. I had a full five
> seasons of South Park downloaded, and it was still a hair under 4GB.
> There's no way a movie could match up to that. I don't expect a pirated
> copy of the anime flick Kornel mentioned would take up more than 650MB.

You must be thinking of a thumbnail-sized, low-framerate low quality
version then -- a dvd-quality feature-length film will take, presumably,
1 DVD worth of storage space. That's 4GB last I checked.

--
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
Palladium? Trusted Computing? DRM? Microsoft? Sauron.
"One ring to rule them all, one ring to find them
One ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them."

 

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Twisted One wrote:
> Timothy Pruett wrote:
>
>> 4GB? Most high-quality movies I download fit on a standard CD-R. I
>> frequently go over to my friend's house, download several movies, and
>> burn them all to disk. It's as cheap as it gets. I had a full five
>> seasons of South Park downloaded, and it was still a hair under 4GB.
>> There's no way a movie could match up to that. I don't expect a
>> pirated copy of the anime flick Kornel mentioned would take up more
>> than 650MB.
>
>
> You must be thinking of a thumbnail-sized, low-framerate low quality
> version then -- a dvd-quality feature-length film will take, presumably,
> 1 DVD worth of storage space. That's 4GB last I checked.

I have a massive collection of pirated movies, and all of them are
high-quality. And by high-quality, I mean they can run at full screen
on a 1280x1028 resolution, and it looks fantastic. I discard any and
all ugly copies. You do realize that this funny little thing called
"compression" can make a movie a hell of a lot smaller, right?

Also, I have yet to see a single download of any sort coming even
close to 4GB on any file-sharing program. All of my copies are only
slightly worse to view than a DVD copy. With some, the difference is
unnoticeable. Also, how many movies do you think manage to come even
close to filling up a full DVD? Most movies leave a hefty amount of
blank space on the disc, so I highly doubt you'll find many
normal-length movies coming in at 4GB, uncompressed.

But, you know what, you obviously have your opinion on the matter,
even if nobody else shares the same experience, and nothing I say is
going to change your mind. If you're unwilling to even *try* to
download a normal, compressed movie before judging how "low-quality"
it will be, then don't. You're the one who's missing out.


--
Read more about my three projects, SoulEaterRL,
Necropolis, and a little toy RL.

http://www.freewebs.com/timsrl/index.htm

--

 

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Twisted One wrote:

> You must be thinking of a thumbnail-sized, low-framerate low quality
> version then

You can fit an MPEG-1 compressed movie onto a VCD, and many recent DVD
players will play them. It's 1/2 the resolution of NTSC each way -
320x200. That's not full DVD quality, but it's about as good as VHS tape.

Not what I would consider "archival" or "collector" quality, but it's
watchable. It's certainly good enough to sample a few movies to see if
you'd like the genre.

sherm--

--
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Hire me! My resume: http://www.dot-app.org

 

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Timothy Pruett wrote:
> I have a massive collection of pirated movies, and all of them are
> high-quality. And by high-quality, I mean they can run at full screen
> on a 1280x1028 resolution, and it looks fantastic. I discard any and
> all ugly copies. You do realize that this funny little thing called
> "compression" can make a movie a hell of a lot smaller, right?

Ugly compression artifacts bug me. If you've got a dvd resolution
feature length film encoded in under 650MB, you've got flat-colored
backgrounds full of faint lines and square patterns like tiles
flickering. For an example of this, rent the Lost in Space movie DVD and
watch for compression artifacts. And they didn't even have the excuse of
needing to fit on a CD for that. This is what happens when you make an
MPEG video stream too small for the resolution. It looks horrid.

> Also, how many movies do you think manage to come even
> close to filling up a full DVD? Most movies leave a hefty amount of
> blank space on the disc, so I highly doubt you'll find many
> normal-length movies coming in at 4GB, uncompressed.

They don't have to. They just have to exceed the space on a CD, about
650MB. And obviously they do, since movies come on DVDs instead of
specially formatted CDs. They wouldn't have gone to all the trouble of
developing a new, higher-capacity disk type if it wasn't necessary for
some reason.

--
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
Palladium? Trusted Computing? DRM? Microsoft? Sauron.
"One ring to rule them all, one ring to find them
One ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them."

 

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Twisted One wrote:
> Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
>> Twisted One wrote:
>>> Too bad that would cost money -- the local stations' late-night
>>> movies invariably are something that can't conceivably be mistaken
>>> for anime even by an idiot. And on my budget, I want to be absolutely
>>> sure I'm not going to be wasting my money before I plonk down $30-40
>>> on any store countertop. ;P
>>
>> Well, to be honest -- "Use the P2P, Luke!". And it's not even
>> considered a crime, cause most of the decent Anime's out there weren't
>> licensed in the US yet. And if you're really that lazy have someone
>> send you a burned DVD ;-)
>
> Don't get me wrong. I've got no qualms about downloading stuff. The
> entertainment industry has done nothing to convince me it needs or
> deserves any more money.

So I thought ;-).

> It's the disk space. Huge 4GB globs of .avi file just aren't compatible
> with a 60GB drive and not much of a budget for getting a second drive.

I've got a 60GB drive too, and I survive (despite the fact that I
sometimes have to work with uncompressed avi files (sic!)). What I do,
is I either remove a series after watching it, or burn it to a DVD/CD
and dispose of it.

If you watch movies there's no problem -- they're either 1 or 2 CD
sized. Watch, then either burn and delete, or just delete them. If
watching series, download them a couple at a time and do the same.

> And I don't have a DVD burner -- just a plain DVD-ROM, and a CD-RW.

A DVD-Burner for people with small HD's is a miracle. An investment that
pays back quickly 🙂. And it's not as expensive as a HD -- I don't know
how it is elsewhere, but here in Poland you can get one around 30-40$.
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"Shadows universe is non-heroic, unfair, cruel and designed to
start playing on your nerves and sanity." -- Anubis

 

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Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
>> It's the disk space. Huge 4GB globs of .avi file just aren't
>> compatible with a 60GB drive and not much of a budget for getting a
>> second drive.
>
> I've got a 60GB drive too, and I survive (despite the fact that I
> sometimes have to work with uncompressed avi files (sic!)). What I do,
> is I either remove a series after watching it, or burn it to a DVD/CD
> and dispose of it.

Lucky you. Evidently you have more free space on yours than I have on
mine, and you have a DVD burner.

> If you watch movies there's no problem -- they're either 1 or 2 CD
> sized. Watch, then either burn and delete, or just delete them. If
> watching series, download them a couple at a time and do the same.

Splitting them and spanning them across multiple CDs is certainly
possible, but the movie will be unwatchable that way. You'd either have
to watch it in installments, or load all the sections back onto your HD
and reassemble them necessitating leaving aside about a tenth of your
drive's space for this purpose alone, unable to store anything
permanently in those GBs without losing the capability of watching the
spanned files. Watching it in installments would require decoding,
dividing up, and reencoding as multiple smaller avis, each under 650MB,
and each reencoding of lossy-compressed media tends to come with an
incremental drop in quality. (So would crunching the whole thing down to
650MB.)

> A DVD-Burner for people with small HD's is a miracle. An investment that
> pays back quickly 🙂.

I don't see external ones for sale here, and the blank disks don't come
cheap here.

> And it's not as expensive as a HD -- I don't know
> how it is elsewhere, but here in Poland you can get one around 30-40$.

No doubt. It's also only 4GB a disk. A HD at that price is likely to be
ten times that. The drive plus ten disks costs more than $40 I'll bet.

--
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
Palladium? Trusted Computing? DRM? Microsoft? Sauron.
"One ring to rule them all, one ring to find them
One ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them."

 

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Twisted One wrote:
> Timothy Pruett wrote:
>
>> 4GB? Most high-quality movies I download fit on a standard CD-R. I
>> frequently go over to my friend's house, download several movies, and
>> burn them all to disk. It's as cheap as it gets. I had a full five
>> seasons of South Park downloaded, and it was still a hair under 4GB.
>> There's no way a movie could match up to that. I don't expect a
>> pirated copy of the anime flick Kornel mentioned would take up more
>> than 650MB.
>
> You must be thinking of a thumbnail-sized, low-framerate low quality
> version then -- a dvd-quality feature-length film will take, presumably,
> 1 DVD worth of storage space. That's 4GB last I checked.

A proffesionaly encoded 1,5-2h DIVX movie fits into a CD with ease and
is still better quality then new video-cassetes (at least IMHO).
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"Come on, Kornel. 11 years and no binary? And it's not
vapourware?" -- Mike Blackney

 

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Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
> A proffesionaly encoded 1,5-2h DIVX movie fits into a CD with ease and
> is still better quality then new video-cassetes (at least IMHO).

VHS? Uh-uh. Not good enough. I want to actually see the whole movie, not
just bits of it through a keyhole in a postage stamp sized window, thank
you very much. Widescreen, dvd quality for me.

--
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
Palladium? Trusted Computing? DRM? Microsoft? Sauron.
"One ring to rule them all, one ring to find them
One ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them."

 

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Twisted One wrote:
> Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
>>> It's the disk space. Huge 4GB globs of .avi file just aren't
>>> compatible with a 60GB drive and not much of a budget for getting a
>>> second drive.
>> I've got a 60GB drive too, and I survive (despite the fact that I
>> sometimes have to work with uncompressed avi files (sic!)). What I do,
>> is I either remove a series after watching it, or burn it to a DVD/CD
>> and dispose of it.
>
> Lucky you. Evidently you have more free space on yours than I have on
> mine, and you have a DVD burner.

At any given moment I have at most ~1GB of space on every of the three
partitions. I wouldn't count that as a lot... A typical 320x200
uncompressed rendering eats that up :-(.

>> If you watch movies there's no problem -- they're either 1 or 2 CD
>> sized. Watch, then either burn and delete, or just delete them. If
>> watching series, download them a couple at a time and do the same.
>
> Splitting them and spanning them across multiple CDs is certainly
> possible, but the movie will be unwatchable that way. You'd either have
> to watch it in installments, or load all the sections back onto your HD
> and reassemble them necessitating leaving aside about a tenth of your
> drive's space for this purpose alone, unable to store anything
> permanently in those GBs without losing the capability of watching the
> spanned files.

You're just lazy ;-). And I've seen movies taking 700MB of space of
*remarkable* quality -- Ghost In The Shell comes up to mind...

>> A DVD-Burner for people with small HD's is a miracle. An investment
>> that pays back quickly 🙂.
>
> I don't see external ones for sale here,

Why external? Once you have a DVD-Burner you don't need either a CD-RW
nor a DVD-ROM. Unless you work on a laptop... anyway, external ones via
USB are only 5-10$ more expensive....

> and the blank disks don't come
> cheap here.
[snip]
> The drive plus ten disks costs more than $40 I'll bet.

Well, this is the *most* ridiculous thing you wrote... or is it
different in the US? In Poland a blank DVD costs range from 80gr (0.25$)
a piece... that's half a Terrabyte for 25$...
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"Due to Pascal's original purpose as a teaching language it forces one
to learn good habits - and those good habits stay with you, even when
you later migrate to a much more forgiving language." - Sherm Pendley

 

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Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
> Why external? Once you have a DVD-Burner you don't need either a CD-RW
> nor a DVD-ROM. Unless you work on a laptop... anyway, external ones via
> USB are only 5-10$ more expensive....

Why external? Because adding the cost of taking the whole machine in to
be disassembled and reassembled would, well, add cost, that's why.

> Well, this is the *most* ridiculous thing you wrote... or is it
> different in the US? In Poland a blank DVD costs range from 80gr (0.25$)
> a piece... that's half a Terrabyte for 25$...

Erm? A terabyte is a lot more than 8GB. Like, 128 times that size. And
blank DVDs here are at least two, three bucks a disk.

--
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
Palladium? Trusted Computing? DRM? Microsoft? Sauron.
"One ring to rule them all, one ring to find them
One ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them."

 

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Twisted One wrote:
> Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
>
>> Why external? Once you have a DVD-Burner you don't need either a CD-RW
>> nor a DVD-ROM. Unless you work on a laptop... anyway, external ones
>> via USB are only 5-10$ more expensive....
>
>
> Why external? Because adding the cost of taking the whole machine in to
> be disassembled and reassembled would, well, add cost, that's why.

Oh, come on. Are you going to tell me you can't install a new disk
drive into your machine, without help? That's an easy two-minute job,
that anyone can handle. Hell, you don't even have to understand
computer hardware to do that. Just take a peek at how your old disk
drive was hooked up, and the new one will go in pretty much the same way.

>> Well, this is the *most* ridiculous thing you wrote... or is it
>> different in the US? In Poland a blank DVD costs range from 80gr
>> (0.25$) a piece... that's half a Terrabyte for 25$...
>
>
> Erm? A terabyte is a lot more than 8GB. Like, 128 times that size. And
> blank DVDs here are at least two, three bucks a disk.

Blank DVDs quit being that expensive a long time ago.


--
Read more about my three projects, SoulEaterRL,
Necropolis, and a little toy RL.

http://www.freewebs.com/timsrl/index.htm

--

 

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In article <DtKdnXRU1qorBw_fRVn-hw@rogers.com>, Twisted One wrote:
> Timothy Pruett wrote:
>> I have a massive collection of pirated movies, and all of them are
>> high-quality. And by high-quality, I mean they can run at full screen
>> on a 1280x1028 resolution, and it looks fantastic. I discard any and
>> all ugly copies. You do realize that this funny little thing called
>> "compression" can make a movie a hell of a lot smaller, right?
> Ugly compression artifacts bug me. If you've got a dvd resolution
> feature length film encoded in under 650MB, you've got flat-colored
> backgrounds full of faint lines and square patterns like tiles
> flickering. For an example of this, rent the Lost in Space movie DVD and
> watch for compression artifacts. And they didn't even have the excuse of
> needing to fit on a CD for that. This is what happens when you make an
> MPEG video stream too small for the resolution. It looks horrid.
>> Also, how many movies do you think manage to come even
>> close to filling up a full DVD? Most movies leave a hefty amount of
>> blank space on the disc, so I highly doubt you'll find many
>> normal-length movies coming in at 4GB, uncompressed.
> They don't have to. They just have to exceed the space on a CD, about
> 650MB. And obviously they do, since movies come on DVDs instead of
> specially formatted CDs. They wouldn't have gone to all the trouble of
> developing a new, higher-capacity disk type if it wasn't necessary for
> some reason.

You do realise that there are different types of compression?

MPEG2 requires a (relatively) large amount of disk space, but a (relatively)
small amount of CPU power. It is therefore suited to settop devices.

MPEG4 requires a (relatively) small amount of disk space, but a (relatively)
large amount of CPU power. It is therefore suited to downloading and
playings on PCs.

A film can look good in MPEG4 in dramatically less disk space than MPEG2.

 

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In article <J4SdnbczEMt2Jg_fRVn-tA@rogers.com>, Twisted One wrote:
> Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
>> Why external? Once you have a DVD-Burner you don't need either a CD-RW
>> nor a DVD-ROM. Unless you work on a laptop... anyway, external ones via
>> USB are only 5-10$ more expensive....
> Why external? Because adding the cost of taking the whole machine in to
> be disassembled and reassembled would, well, add cost, that's why.
>> Well, this is the *most* ridiculous thing you wrote... or is it
>> different in the US? In Poland a blank DVD costs range from 80gr (0.25$)
>> a piece... that's half a Terrabyte for 25$...
> Erm? A terabyte is a lot more than 8GB. Like, 128 times that size. And

1 DVD = 4.5Gb
1 DVD = 0.25$
=> 25$ = 100 DVD
= 450Gb
~= half a terabyte

 

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Timothy Pruett wrote:
> Oh, come on. Are you going to tell me you can't install a new disk
> drive into your machine, without help? That's an easy two-minute job,
> that anyone can handle. Hell, you don't even have to understand
> computer hardware to do that. Just take a peek at how your old disk
> drive was hooked up, and the new one will go in pretty much the same way.

Are you seriously suggesting that I void my warranty and take the thing
apart myself?

Even if lots of ubergeeks customize their machines unassisted, it's not
something J. Random End User should be expected to do.

> Blank DVDs quit being that expensive a long time ago.

Not here, they didn't. Media taxes. 🙁

--
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
Palladium? Trusted Computing? DRM? Microsoft? Sauron.
"One ring to rule them all, one ring to find them
One ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them."

 

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Twisted One wrote:
> Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
>> Well, this is the *most* ridiculous thing you wrote... or is it
>> different in the US? In Poland a blank DVD costs range from 80gr
>> (0.25$) a piece... that's half a Terrabyte for 25$...
>
> Erm? A terabyte is a lot more than 8GB. Like, 128 times that size. And
> blank DVDs here are at least two, three bucks a disk.

Oh come on, you're just to lazy, don't plan watching any anime at all,
and try to find a reason for that ;-). EOT from my side.
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"Come on, Kornel. 11 years and no binary? And it's not
vapourware?" -- Mike Blackney

 

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The Sheep wrote:
> Dnia 20 May 2005 22:03:36 GMT,
> Mark 'Kamikaze' Hughes napisal(a):
*SNIP*
>> How I'd do a cyberpunk roguelike:
>
>> Generate random, escalating missions to send the player into corporate
>>buildings. The player has to fight or sneak past groups of security
>>drones and mooks and a few higher-level enemies, get to the objective,
>>and return to the evac point. Netrunning can be used to create false
>>alarms elsewhere in the building to draw away guards, or to disable
>>existing alarms so you can sneak past inattentive guards.
>
>> Between missions, the city could be shown in a large abstract
>>overview, as if you're driving around. Your hideout lets you store
>>items and money and do some netrunning to research missions. Agents who
>>want to hire you call you (or send email) at your hideout, and you meet
>>them at the bar to get the details. Stores sell equipment. The
>>hospital repairs wounds and installs cyberware (I wouldn't let the
>>player heal significantly in-mission, that just doesn't feel right for
>>the genre). Some mission sites would be in the city, others would
>>require going to the airport or spaceport.
>
>> That's just the obvious stuff off the top of my head. If I was going
>>to sit down and make a cyberpunk roguelike, I'd start with that, go
>>reread a few choice books, and from there start designing to emulate the
>>parts I liked.
>
> Allright, that's description of the setting. You could produce any story
> out of it.

True, but I like the structure. Add ShockFrost's growing city
and it could be interesting for any genre RL! Perhaps in-mission
you can choose to try and escape rather than complete it when
things look dire - adding that dichotomy of survival/completion
(would have to be permadeath though). On escape that mission is
permanently failed thus changing the plot (/permafailure/????)

> But how do you do "exploring new technologies and using them to change the
> world" or that "identity search" thing you say cyberpunk is all about?

--
ABCGi ---- (abcgi@yahoo.com) ---- http://codemonkey.sunsite.dk
Fun RLs in rgrd that I have tested recently!
DoomRL - DwellerMobile - HWorld - AburaTan - DiabloRL
Heroic Adventure - Powder - CastlevaniaRL - TheTombs

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development (More info?)

On 17 May 2005 23:46:17 GMT, Mark 'Kamikaze' Hughes
<kamikaze@kuoi.asui.uidaho.edu> wrote:

>R Dan Henry <danhenry@inreach.com>
>wrote on Sun, 15 May 2005 11:39:16 -0700:
>> Okay, here's an attempt to bring together the available info, with my
>> own little additions, as usual.
>> Cyberpunk as a sub-genre label was a marketing label almost from the
>> beginning, and hence, almost completely meaningless.
>
> This is false, a base insult that was created by the New Wave and
>"literary" SF wankers to attack a literary movement they didn't like or
>control.

It isn't an insult. That more or less true of *every* genre label, so
it's borderline paranoid to find it insulting, but I know you just
like to be argumentative. But, yes, I think it was more true than
average for cyberpunk labeling. Clearly your opinion differs; that's
fine, the relevant fact is that there's a fair range of disagreement
as to how cyberpunk is defined and I will be sticking to what you'll
consider a cliched view, because that's the best approach for a
genre-based game: give the people what they expect.

> Cyberpunk is two words.

Nope, it is one word. Note how the letter follow on one to the other
with no spaces in between. That's rather a big hint, as that's what
defines something as one word in English.

As for its compound, construction, thank you for condescendingly
pointing out what we already know. Clearly, that makes you a very
clever boy. But your blatant factual error, combined with your history
of being argumentative for the sake of argumentative convinces me I
have better things to do than read your ranting. Skimming over it
shows you have an unhealthy emotional investment in "cyberpunk"
"winning" in SF. Yes, I can definitely skip that.

--
R. Dan Henry = danhenry@inreach.com
Dance, Puppet, dance!
But why are there *humans* dancing for the puppet?

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development (More info?)

BFBeast wrote:

>For example, if a skill system is used (which should be)

Why so many people still like the skill system - escapes me completely.
Yes, lets shoot 25 warbots and gain an increase to hacking skill.

Additional sources :

A very special "post-cyberpunk" piece of art called "Blame!"
by Tsutomu Nihei.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development (More info?)

Dnia Sun, 05 Jun 2005 00:42:45 -0700,
R Dan Henry napisal(a):

> I want (somehow, somewhen) to allow using duct tape to bind together
> several kinds of weapons, so that you can wield it and shoot
> simultaneously, just like at the end of Aliens 2. [-- the Sheep]

Wow! Where did you dig it up? ^^)

--
Radomir `The Sheep' Dopieralski @**@_
(Uu) 3 Sigh!
. . . ..v.vVvVVvVvv.v.. .

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development (More info?)

On Sun, 5 Jun 2005 16:32:26 +0000 (UTC), The Sheep <thesheep@
sheep.prv.pl> wrote:

>Dnia Sun, 05 Jun 2005 00:42:45 -0700,
> R Dan Henry napisal(a):
>
>> I want (somehow, somewhen) to allow using duct tape to bind together
>> several kinds of weapons, so that you can wield it and shoot
>> simultaneously, just like at the end of Aliens 2. [-- the Sheep]
>
>Wow! Where did you dig it up? ^^)

Google Groups search on rgrd for "cyberpunk".

--
R. Dan Henry = danhenry@inreach.com
Dance, Puppet, dance!
But why are there *humans* dancing for the puppet?

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development (More info?)

R. Dan Henry wrote:
> This is the final revision before I put it on roguebasin. I'm also
> going to try getting together the (rather smaller) pool of ideas on
> Westerns in the near future. I've also edited the RL Themes page to
> create links to (so far unbuilt) pages to place lists of ideas and
> resources like this one.
*SNIP*
> And, of course, wikipedia and Google will allow one to find many more
> items of source material.

Nice, imagine a game that could randomly generate elements
of many of those types! hmmm maybe lets not...

--
ABCGi ---- (abcgi@yahoo.com) ---- http://codemonkey.sunsite.dk
..Hajo's H-World - RogueLike/RPG Engine SourceForge Project...
.......Downloads - https://sourceforge.net/projects/h-world...
............Home - http://h-world.simugraph.com...............