Why Windows 8 Has New Start Screen and Metro Apps

[littleleo]

"We knew full well casual users wouldn't like it initially. Hopefully in 5 years we'll look back and see we made the right decision," he writes.Lets piss off the casual user that is the biggest segment out there.

Actually the biggest segment is business, is way way way larger than the consumer side of things.

Your right Business is a huge segment but Windows 8 will never be adopted by businesses, and most businesses don't even consider it an option. Of the remaining segments that may use Windows 8 they choose to piss off a huge slice of the remaining pie.

 

[michaeldean]

***"It's designed for your computer illiterate little sister, for grandpas who don't know how to use that computer dofangle thingy, and for mom who just wants to look up apple pie recipes. It's simple, clear, and does one thing (and only one thing) relatively easily," Miller writes.***Umm, this guy should be fired. Those are the exact people who dislike Windows 8. My grandmother would rather use Windows Vista. My mom would rather use Linux Mint.The fact they could have made the OS better but didn't because it would alienate those who just want to click on shiny things makes me hope Steam OS really kicks up and takes a decent chunk of Windows usage out of the world. A world where I can game without having to use Windows would be heaven.

 

[AndreT]

Lies! Microsoft themselves address it as METRO!

They originally called/branded it Metro but they decided to rename it "Modern" a few months after launch, don't remember the reason if one was given. By then though, most people had already adopted the Metro branding and ignored Microsoft name swap so many people still call it Metro today and use Metro/Modern interchangeably when talking about Win8.x's new interface.

They changed the name to Modern UI to avoid a lawsuit from These guys. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metro_AG

 

[childofthekorn]

On one hand, we have 3rd party applets that allow us to turn windows 8 desktop into something more like windows 7. Why couldn't/can't microsoft do that now? Why haven't they done this in the year(s) that its been released? I'm waiting to see what comes out with 8.2/8.3 which apparently is supposed to be big step for Win8. Otherwise, if history keeps repeating itself, Windows 9 will blow it all out of the water.

Oh please! Microsoft has been at it since right after Windows 7 was released. They're going for the "walled garden" effect that Apple has, which is probably the most moronic business decision I've seen a big company make in the last few years. It's just as retarded as McDonalds suddenly turn all their restaurants into coffe shops, because Starbucks is doing so well.

It is retarded. Windows Phone store is a perfect example of how retarded it is: there are few applications because Microsoft is too restrictive. I remember this because, very early on (when the store's terms of usage were first released), Mozilla came out and said they won't be releasing a Firefox version for Windows Phone, because Microsoft's policies were compatible with their open-source license. It's also the reason there is no Firefox (or many other browsers, for that matter) for iOS.[/quotemsg]

If by "At it" you mean design and implementation then they were doing that prior to win 7's release. They generally start planning years before even starting to program. While Win 7 was beginning to be produced they realized it wasn't fit for mobile devices, as it wasn't designed for such, so they focused on that with win 8. Yet Sinofsky, for some reason or another, didn't plan to have anyone deviate from the Modern UI (metro). From the sounds of it, coming from various articles around the web, this would be the reason why Sinofsky was fired.

And of course they're going to create a walled garden with an app store they host when its an operating system designed specifically for mobile devices. They don't want a bunch of incompatible items running where converted Apple and Android user, who are used to using the respective app stores, trying to download an incompatible item and then complaining up a storm when it doesn't work and then skip it for the competitors products. Its just them playing catchup, as usual, to a game that's been played out for awhile now.

 

[AndreT]

Please change your forum software so that it stops auto scrolling, it's impossible to get back to display more contacts, without it constantly scrolling down, then up, then back down, all without input from me. It's driving me nuts! Not to mention that it renders my back button useless. If I press back it just scrolls through all the articles again instead of taking me to the home screen where I can just browse the topics. So frustrating! It's like taking a page right out of the Microsoft "How to alienate your userbase" rulebook.

 

[childofthekorn]

It's easy to criticize the decision here, but they can't survive by just catering to the power/hardcore users. They NEED to entice casual users, which are a growing portion of the computing community, as many of the complainers here have repeatedly noted. They could have stuck with a strategy to keep with heavy users, turning off casual users, but in a few years they'd be in real financial trouble. In less than five years everyone would start bashing them for not having the foresight to see that trend and act on it.

I understand that. Sinofsky wanted to make 1 os to bring to several different platforms. Unfortunately this resulted in the desktop having the same UI as tablets, phones, laptops and any assorted devices i left out. I find that unfortunate seeing at how much development power microsoft has and that they couldn't differentiate between devices in time.

On one hand, we have 3rd party applets that allow us to turn windows 8 desktop into something more like windows 7. Why couldn't/can't microsoft do that now? Why haven't they done this in the year(s) that its been released? I'm waiting to see what comes out with 8.2/8.3 which apparently is supposed to be big step for Win8. Otherwise, if history keeps repeating itself, Windows 9 will blow it all out of the water.

Oh please! Microsoft has been at it since right after Windows 7 was released. They're going for the "walled garden" effect that Apple has, which is probably the most moronic business decision I've seen a big company make in the last few years. It's just as retarded as McDonalds suddenly turn all their restaurants into coffe shops, because Starbucks is doing so well.

It is retarded. Windows Phone store is a perfect example of how retarded it is: there are few applications because Microsoft is too restrictive. I remember this because, very early on (when the store's terms of usage were first released), Mozilla came out and said they won't be releasing a Firefox version for Windows Phone, because Microsoft's policies were compatible with their open-source license. It's also the reason there is no Firefox (or many other browsers, for that matter) for iOS.

If by "At it" you mean design and implementation then they were doing that prior to win 7's release. They generally start planning years before even starting to program. While Win 7 was beginning to be produced they realized it wasn't fit for mobile devices, as it wasn't designed for such, so they focused on that with win 8. Yet Sinofsky, for some reason or another, didn't plan to have anyone deviate from the Modern UI (metro). From the sounds of it, coming from various articles around the web, this would be the reason why Sinofsky was fired.

And of course they're going to create a walled garden with an app store they host when its an operating system designed specifically for mobile devices. They don't want a bunch of incompatible items running where converted Apple and Android user, who are used to using the respective app stores, trying to download an incompatible item and then complaining up a storm when it doesn't work and then skip it for the competitors products. Its just them playing catchup, as usual, to a game that's been played out for awhile now.

 

[DRosencraft]

The problem is that they had a plan, that was apparent. But the public wasn't patient enough to see it through. Those who lived through almost every past iteration of Windows saw how every attempt to change things or adapt things to meet needs were sloppy or ill-received. The difference was, they had time to let it settle in. The beloved Start menu was also hated when it first debuted, but the outlet for complaints wasn't as verbose, so MSFT got to keep pushing it, and now they're at the point where it's so loved they can't seem to get people to accept moving on from it. These things get tested and retested. The laboratory of the public obviously allows for a wider range of tests than what any company can manage in their relatively limited capacity. For that reason, new things need tome to evolve under the light of day.

I don't like everything MSFT does. A lot of their moves are stupid. For instance, I have absolutely zero interest in the XBOne, I'll be getting the PS4 later this year. But the plan for Win8 was always relatively obvious. My point from the start was that they needed to try something new, and simply drilling down on a power-user's version of Windows for the next iteration after 7 made no logical sense. Most power users ignore and work around stuff like start menus or the new metro start screen, or even further abandon Windows altogether and use Linux. The vast majority of the public are causal users. The ideas behind Win8 are not entirely bad ones to cater to them. They may not be well received or as effective as they or apparently many consumers would desire, but this was something they needed to do. Better to try and fail than not try at all.

 

[CloudReaper]

I would love to have a eye to eye with the Windows developers. They seem to have gone off of the beaten track. 1. Metro is anything BUT user friendly2. WPF & XAML? Why do you have web developers developing front ends. It just over complicates things, there was nothing wrong with the Win32 methedologies. Web developers need to keep their noses out of app development. The two methedologies do NOT mix and it only results in poorly designed software that break all coding rules.3. Now you need to parse XML and all kinds of nonsense, instead of straight forward compiled code to start up a application and .Net is insecured enough as it is so users can now mess around with ui's if they stumble upon a couple of secrets.4. What in hell posessed Microsoft to implement it on Server Os's then??? System administrators are not computer illiterate...your insulting us.Microsoft, PLEASE come to your senses.This is nonsense, especially the fact that you are forcing the entire development community to adopt a new methedology that most have not vitod nor want anything to do with. There is a reason any Software Developer worth his salt called Win32 VB "not a proper programming language", because it's interpreted...adding a extra layer that the CPU has to go through, now Microsoft is extending that kind of thinking.CPU's improve, RAM improve, GPU improve but what does Microsoft do? Microsofty just senselesly creates methodologies that just eats up all the resources that was added by the improvemens and were back to square one.If it wasn't that most companies now blocks VM tools from running apps/games, I would be running Linux + Wine/VMWare.I have allways loved Microsoft but they have broken my trust and love for their products. Right now, Microsoft is like a weed...no matter how many tech boffins figure out how to bypass the VM Block, they will allways be there.

 

[Thermium]

What a bunch of morons. Who cares about the casual users, they don't even care about themselves. Have you seen a casual users computer? It's more than likely a node on some Russian spam bot than it is a computer. They should sell two different versions of the OS then, one for idiots, and one for the rest of us. The idiots wouldn't get to change anything, and they could be herded along by MS and it's advertising. The rest of us would get to change anything and everything with no limitations, and block all advertising. There, I just fixed the problem.

 

[soahs]

The only thing more incompetant than a character thinks this way - is that this employee actually GETS PAID to think like this.Here's an idea - let users use any interface they want - XP, W7, even W98 & W2000. Let US - your customer - decide how we want the operating system to look.WE the customer have more to do on computers than to "check Facebook, view photos or watch Supernatural." And it has been awhile since my household has looked up an apple pie recipe.Many MANY features got cut? Pay attention Genius. If you implement Windows to allow users to use any interface they want - let's see now what would happen. Maybe the "many MANY features that got cut" could be put back. For us - for power users - for YOUR customer.Anyone that talks like you do will no doubt ignore this suggestion. Then while you are ignoring, ignore this at your own peril - desktop PC sales are on a steep dowward spiral. Not too many laptops are being sold. All we hear - I just got a new computer with Windows 8 and hate it. Can I put Windows 7 on?Let US decide how to use our computers. We do not need you to decide for us. Sliding sales of Windows are telling you that.

 

[littleleo]

Well MS has already cut off retail versions of Windows 7, one more year and they will cut off the OEM versions too. Then if this O/S isn't fixed their sales, and sales of desktops, and notebooks is going to nose dive. Tablets anyone, lol. Linux hasn't stepped up to take advantage of MS great failure with Windows 8, I wonder if there is another solution coming.

 

[InvalidError]

Well MS has already cut off retail versions of Windows 7, one more year and they will cut off the OEM versions too. I wonder if there is another solution coming.

The same solution they had in the past: extend sales beyond their original retirement date if sales show no sign of picking up just like they did with XP when people and business clearly did not want Vista. So we might see Win7 OEM extended until M$ either "fixes" Win8 or launches Win9.

Personally, I haven't had any major problems with Vista or 8.0/8.1 aside from the annoying UI shuffle and duplicated/forked/split configuration options that make formerly simple stuff unnecessarily convoluted.

 

[egilbe]

Apparently win8 is such a dismal failure that microsoft dropped the priced charged to OEM's to $15. Office365 is a joke and Microsoft's support is horrid. The company is in a death spiral at this point.

 

[ceh4702]

It is asking too much to let someone boot to the Desktop. How about a choice? I have an idea; just skip windows 8 and install Win7.

 

[Morbus]

It is asking too much to let someone boot to the Desktop. How about a choice? I have an idea; just skip windows 8 and install Win7.

That's asking too little, and Windows 8.1 lets you boot to desktop.

 

[InvalidError]

It is asking too much to let someone boot to the Desktop.

I tried the Metro UI for about a week to give it a chance but when it became clear I wouldn't get used to it, I installed Classic Shell. Boots to Desktop, provides a real Start menu with your pick of XP, Vista or 7 style and a lot more functionality than any official Start Menu has ever had.

 

[PMSoft_hub]

I would prefer the Microsoft Start Button I have gotten used to period. Micorsoft just wants it's consumer to get hooked to their app stor, but unfortunately people didn't buy the idea. So eager to see what Windows 9 will have to offer. Will they be able to make a drastic move to correct their mistake? Let's wait and see.

 

[68vistacruiser]

so basically microsoft decided to alienate a group of their most ardent fans and drive even more of them toward linux, in a failed attempt to recruit some of the iSheep users?doesn't sound like a very good business strategy to me -_-

so basically microsoft decided to alienate a group of their most ardent fans and drive even more of them toward linux, in a failed attempt to recruit some of the iSheep users?doesn't sound like a very good business strategy to me -_-

Not even Metro could make me run Linux, or go to Apple for that matter. Neither serves my purposes.

 

[childofthekorn]

so basically microsoft decided to alienate a group of their most ardent fans and drive even more of them toward linux, in a failed attempt to recruit some of the iSheep users?doesn't sound like a very good business strategy to me -_-

so basically microsoft decided to alienate a group of their most ardent fans and drive even more of them toward linux, in a failed attempt to recruit some of the iSheep users?doesn't sound like a very good business strategy to me -_-

Not even Metro could make me run Linux, or go to Apple for that matter. Neither serves my purposes.

I'm curious. What purposes do you use windows for that you could not use linux for?

 

[InvalidError]

I'm curious. What purposes do you use windows for that you could not use linux for?

A large chunk of THG readers are PC gamers so I would bet many of those uses are gaming without having to mess around with Wine and all those other quirks that come with running Windows/DirectX games under Linux. Most stuff "simply works" with Windows but still requires more messing around than people like on Linux.

 

[childofthekorn]

I'm curious. What purposes do you use windows for that you could not use linux for?

A large chunk of THG readers are PC gamers so I would bet many of those uses are gaming without having to mess around with Wine and all those other quirks that come with running Windows/DirectX games under Linux. Most stuff "simply works" with Windows but still requires more messing around than people like on Linux.

With the Linux game portfolio growing as rapidly and backed by a growing number of publishers, most of that will be true until a short time in the future. I was thinking along the lines of more business oriented decisions of why he wouldn't deviate from Windows.

 

[InvalidError]

I was thinking along the lines of more business oriented decisions of why he wouldn't deviate from Windows.

The biggest obstacle would be that most large-ish businesses that chose to rely on Windows have their whole network, server back-end, client front-end and everything else in-between built around Windows so switching over would require a lot more work than just switching OS on employees' work PCs assuming fully interoperable drop-in software equivalents are available for Linux. Otherwise, you end up with having to do document conversions, cross-checks to clean up conversion glitches, make sure other people and business you have to receive documents from or send them to are also capable of opening or saving in your new formats, etc.

 

[childofthekorn]

I was thinking along the lines of more business oriented decisions of why he wouldn't deviate from Windows.

The biggest obstacle would be that most large-ish businesses that chose to rely on Windows have their whole network, server back-end, client front-end and everything else in-between built around Windows so switching over would require a lot more work than just switching OS on employees' work PCs assuming fully interoperable drop-in software equivalents are available for Linux. Otherwise, you end up with having to do document conversions, cross-checks to clean up conversion glitches, make sure other people and business you have to receive documents from or send them to are also capable of opening or saving in your new formats, etc.

Correct, this is under the assumption that he worked for a larger company. Or exactly what hes working with (some linux office-like programs are fully compatible with microsofts I was going to leave it to him to give us an idea of his working situation.

Even in a larger environment we still have nearly 20 Linux based machines handling a wide variety of vulnerability scans, task management, automated file transfer, simple FTP, database log collection, imaging software, physical security resolution, print management, so it still has its uses. We wouldn't know exactly what hes using only a windows system until he states.

 

[nikolajj]

If a power user gets alienated, its not power user...

 

[Morbus]

If a power user uses Windows 8, they're not a power user...