AMD CPU speculation... and expert conjecture

[Cazalan]

Regarding the A1100 I hope Phoronix gets one soon. They seem to do the most thorough Linux benchmarking of anyone.

 

[Fidgetmaster]

its really damn slow at stock clocks....it needs oced waaay up there....

 

[jdwii]

its really damn slow at stock clocks....it needs oced waaay up there....

To be honest i was disappointed i never thought it would bottleneck a old 6950 so much and even the day to day performance on chrome felt slower i eventually overclock it to 4.4Ghz i kept telling him not to get it but he kept telling me "people don't use more than 4 cores anyways" and i kept telling him that it gets way slower once games use more than 2 cores heavily i tested that on my 8350fx on GTA4 locked the threads to 1,2,3,4 and it was way slower(20%). Most games still use 3 threads heavily which is why i recommend a 6300fx as a minimum choice from Amd for gaming if you care enough to not have random skips all the time, be even better if they can afford a 8320fx to future proof them more.

Also compared to my friends I5 Haswell i5-4460 (priced the same as a 8350fx) its actually quite even with my 8350fx and actually my friend compiles stuff a lot and wishes he went with my CPU but he also plays chess to and we put my PC at 4.3Ghz towards his at 3.2ghz and his creamed mine on using Arena chess. But in gaming such as BF4 and watch dogs he's I5 was weaker and slower but in simcity it came out even. I suspect in newer games he's CPU will continue to lose.

 

[noob2222]

would not classify a fx 4300 as a turd, at stock clocks it can be slow but does make up ground fast when you over clock.

for a budget build its ok. I did a lot of testing with my 8120 clocked at 4.7 ghz. cut off 4 cores and it runs most games with a 6970 @ 1ghz with all the cores pegged at 100%

4300 + high end graphics ... no, just don't, spend the extra $10 at newegg and get the 6300 at least, this gets you away from loading some moldules for the 20% penalty.

jdwii is correct, loading cores 0 2 4 6 >>0 2 4 5 >> 0 1 2 3, with the 4300, that's the only option. (ya, windows starts numbering with 0)

 

[jdwii]

http://www.anandtech.com/show/1543/10
Actually by accident was looking for Sims 2 benchmarks to see how much it killed CPU performance.
Found this old thing don't we all miss it well the ones who are old enough to remember and thanks noob was just saying a 4300 bottlenecked a lot of games my brother had it was actually sad

 

[jdwii]

A 6950 yes ,but a 7770 is weaker than my 650 ti and it does not bottleneck my 750k. 4300 should be faster

According to Techpowerup it is around 20% faster compared to a 7770 and around 5% slower than a 6850. My friend had a 6850HD for awhile(still has it setting around) and it was bottlenecking in some newer games with a phenom ii x4 but not a lot. You are not bottlenecking your video card but a 6950 is easily bottlenecking it and a 4 core fx which isn't much faster than your CPU. it really has to do with it being able to handle 4 threads heavily without a 20% hit. Most games now are starting to use 3 cores heavily if not more and when that happens a 4 core fx will bottleneck almost any mid-range GPU.

 

[de5_Roy]

wccftech makes a discovery so startling that i typed their name right:
AMD Toronto APU and CPUs will Include Dual IMCs for DDR3 and DDR4 Support
http://wccftech.com/amd-toronto-apu-feature-dual-imc-ddr3-ddr4-supported/
wut?! servers be using ddr4 memory and toronto to supprort ddr4 and ddr3 both with the hybrid imc that we already know about?!

two moar kaveri a10 7800 reviews
http://www.kitguru.net/site-news/highlights2/leo-waldock/amd-a10-7800-review/
http://lanoc.org/review/cpus/6905-amd-a10-7800-kaveri

 

[esrever]

I really wonder what the performance is like on toronto compared to their x86 cpus.

 

[szatkus]

wccftech makes a discovery so startling that i typed their name right:
AMD Toronto APU and CPUs will Include Dual IMCs for DDR3 and DDR4 Support
http://wccftech.com/amd-toronto-apu-feature-dual-imc-ddr3-ddr4-supported/
wut?! servers be using ddr4 memory and toronto to supprort ddr4 and ddr3 both with the hybrid imc that we already know about?!
http://lanoc.org/review/cpus/6905-amd-a10-7800-kaveri

Unbeliveable.

Oh, wait.

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/MSi-Eight-Memory-Slots,7214.html

 

[blackkstar]

wccftech makes a discovery so startling that i typed their name right:
AMD Toronto APU and CPUs will Include Dual IMCs for DDR3 and DDR4 Support
http://wccftech.com/amd-toronto-apu-feature-dual-imc-ddr3-ddr4-supported/
wut?! servers be using ddr4 memory and toronto to supprort ddr4 and ddr3 both with the hybrid imc that we already know about?!
http://lanoc.org/review/cpus/6905-amd-a10-7800-kaveri

Unbeliveable.

Oh, wait.

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/MSi-Eight-Memory-Slots,7214.html

I don't see them wasting DIMMs in a server when physical space is important. My guess is either DDR3 and DDR4 DIMMs are compatible or we will have two sockets.

 

[james pinnix]

What I dislike about amd right now is they are building awesome laptop cpus for the desktop.

Not to say hsa and mantle are not awesome but til they hit that point where they are more widely useful amd still needs to make 100% cpu options.

They don't have to make as many but give us a strong cpu without the gpu attached

At least until amd gets the apu to a r9 270 I don't see the point of buying a super laptop cpu for my desktop

Amd doesn't ever have to be intel they just need to be better then they are now

 

[jdwii]

Spoiler

What I dislike about amd right now is they are building awesome laptop cpus for the desktop.

Not to say hsa and mantle are not awesome but til they hit that point where they are more widely useful amd still needs to make 100% cpu options.

They don't have to make as many but give us a strong cpu without the gpu attached

At least until amd gets the apu to a r9 270 I don't see the point of buying a super laptop cpu for my desktop

Amd doesn't ever have to be intel they just need to be better then they are now

What I dislike about amd right now is they are building awesome laptop cpus for the desktop.

I don't know what you mean here do you mean small portable desktops?

They don't have to make as many but give us a strong cpu without the gpu attached

They have the FX series and the 6300 is a better choice then a I3 any day for modern gaming or applications and a 8320fx is a no brainier when compared to a I3 and a Athlon Steamroller 4 core will probably be a better choice then a Pentium for general computing and about even in gaming compared to a Pentium. The 8350fx really competes in price with a locked I5 haswell at only 3.2Ghz and in newer games the 8350fx wins and in a LOT of applications it also wins compared to that CPU.

At least until amd gets the apu to a r9 270

When that time comes a 270 will barley be able to play modern games at anything higher than medium settings at 1080P, they will probably not even make a discrete card with that level of performance since it would be a 100$ video card if that.

 

[Fidgetmaster]

At this rate they are long way off seeing 270 performance and yes by the time they get to it, it will be struggling to run anything.....

 

[james pinnix]

The laptop apu they are making are pointless for desktops what I mean is the a10-7850k is a ok quad with a good gpu that would be perfect ....for a laptop you can get a r7 265 and a amd athlon x4 760k for a couple of buck more then the apu alone and get way more juice out of it with minimal power

As far as the fx goes it's OK but they need to get closer to i5 not i3 plus fx is old and I would love to see a soild quad core on the fm2+ mofos

And the comment on the apu having a 270 on it is if amd is going to push this apu then give us something worth getting for our desktops a 270 level apu would fly off the market and would give amd a chance to push hsa while the people have an awesome cpu/gpu solution

 

[Fidgetmaster]

Nah FX is just rather bad....Bulldozer just devastated....PD doing better but ultimately just not good enough....

 

[jdwii]

The laptop apu they are making are pointless for desktops what I mean is the a10-7850k is a ok quad with a good gpu that would be perfect ....for a laptop you can get a r7 265 and a amd athlon x4 760k for a couple of buck more then the apu alone and get way more juice out of it with minimal power

As far as the fx goes it's OK but they need to get closer to i5 not i3 plus fx is old and I would love to see a soild quad core on the fm2+ mofos

And the comment on the apu having a 270 on it is if amd is going to push this apu then give us something worth getting for our desktops a 270 level apu would fly off the market and would give amd a chance to push hsa while the people have an awesome cpu/gpu solution

Well a certain user here is convinced that in the future a APU will be faster then a CPU+GPU combo not saying his previous predictions have been anywhere close to being accurate just saying its being talked about.
Also you will not be seeing anything decent on the FM2+ platform around the I5 level should give that up and the 8350 does not compete with the I3 its competing head on with a I5 haswell from 2 years after Piledriver came out remember its priced at the locked I5 at 3.2Ghz and that I5 loses most of the time in newer games and most applications. As pointed out before if you want maximum performance on 4 threads from piledriver you need to get a FX 8 core not a 6 or 4 core fx
As for steamroller its sad but we won't be seeing any 8 core steamroller processors Amd just can't afford it.

I'm also still confused you do not list any laptop processor just a A10 7850K and a Athlon 760K as well as a 265. Newer chips coming out from Amd for laptops probably sometime next year is rumored to not even be on the desktop just laptops, i even think poor kaveri will be around for a while, on desktops.

One last thing to remember do not expect anything great from Amd in terms of CPU performance until they get rid of this module design and start shipping their new architecture(2016-2017) which i doubt will be on FM2+ and not to be a debbie downer but don't expect miracles either even before the launch of the newer CPU design,

 

[james pinnix]

Jdwii I agree with ya til 2016 amd isn't ...well good....and it make me upset it's not a Intel amd thing it's the underdog thing amd has been my 1st pick for a long time

And for the 1st time ever I know when I upgrade my system it's gonna be intel .....unless amd is gonna pull a hat trick in 2016

It scares me really ....The battle of amd vs intel may over not with a battle royal but a slow long death

I hope they can make something work with the apus soon ..but I just don't see it

 

[de5_Roy]

it's no use putting a 1024-1280 core igpu on an apu die if it's bottlenecked by the memory. amd's igpus are faster than the memory it uses. if you put a 1024 core igpu on an apu and stick dual channel ddr3 memory, it won't work. i mean it will, technically, but it'll be severely bottlenecked by the cpu as well as the memory. right now, amd needs to up their memory performance. stacked ram wasn't prolly technologically and economically viable until now. as old rumors suggest, otherwise both amd and nvidia woulda gone that way years ago. even intel had to manufacture their own edram to get a headstart and their (those) cpus were prohibitively expensive.

 

[jdwii]

Jdwii I agree with ya til 2016 amd isn't ...well good....and it make me upset it's not a Intel amd thing it's the underdog thing amd has been my 1st pick for a long time

And for the 1st time ever I know when I upgrade my system it's gonna be intel .....unless amd is gonna pull a hat trick in 2016

It scares me really ....The battle of amd vs intel may over not with a battle royal but a slow long death

I hope they can make something work with the apus soon ..but I just don't see it

i wouldn't worry about Amd going under they are making money off GPU's and they are moving into newer markets with Arm soon and they did make the deal with consoles and now there's talk about Nintendo wanting to use Amd for their next portable device.
High-end doesn't earn them enough money mainstream products do. PC gaming is on a rise and i think Amd will come back i don't think they want to leave the gaming market anytime soon, just at this time its not economically feasible for them to produce a 8 core steamroller or excavator.
Amd is only a 3B company and in my opinion they are do well when compared to a company worth 3-4 times as much(nvidia) and they are also competing with a company worth 55 times as much(Intel).

 

[cdrkf]

The laptop apu they are making are pointless for desktops what I mean is the a10-7850k is a ok quad with a good gpu that would be perfect ....for a laptop you can get a r7 265 and a amd athlon x4 760k for a couple of buck more then the apu alone and get way more juice out of it with minimal power

As far as the fx goes it's OK but they need to get closer to i5 not i3 plus fx is old and I would love to see a soild quad core on the fm2+ mofos

And the comment on the apu having a 270 on it is if amd is going to push this apu then give us something worth getting for our desktops a 270 level apu would fly off the market and would give amd a chance to push hsa while the people have an awesome cpu/gpu solution

Given AMD's current portfolio of products, the only real thing they could offer you on FM2+ (beyond what they do now) would be a 3 module APU with a smaller graphics portion. That would actually make a lot of sense, but would require an additional die. At the moment I think all APUs are harvested from a single die (unless they make a separate smaller one of the dual cores?). Still given they can squeeze "12 computer cores" onto a die, offering a 6 + 6 might be a more balanced solution for some than the 4 + 8 configuration of the 7850K.

 

[de5_Roy]

slow news day, so the breaking news is something i parroted from s/a long time ago: radeon ssd 120-480GB
http://chinese.vr-zone.com/123141/amd-will-launch-an-ssd-product-called-radon-r7-series-by-using-ocz-solutions-08042014/
i think amd is trying to set up it's own shop. hmm....
edit: not thrilled to see "R7" showing up in the ssd model numbers. it'll increase confusion.

some console dev. stuff that mostly went over my head
http://gamingbolt.com/dx12-wont-change-xbox-ones-1080p-issue-but-devs-will-be-able-to-push-more-triangles-witcher-3-dev
http://gamingbolt.com/ps4-and-xbox-one-feature-modern-cpus-having-faster-memory-isnt-useful-if-the-processor-stalls
what's so good about OoO execution in consoles anyway? pcs and tablet socs have had it for years... i thought older console processors had OoO execution.

and lastly, tablets are the new pc
http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2014/08/op-ed-tables-really-are-pcsbecause-theres-no-point-in-buying-new-ones/

It took four years for tablet OEMs to do the same. The race to the bottom was fast, and it was furious, and you can get a Windows or Android tablet for $100 or less. Meanwhile, the companies trying to compete with slightly more expensive, higher-quality hardware—companies like Apple and Samsung—are seeing their sales decline.

only 4 years.

 

[8350rocks]

The only tablet I would like to see is the discovery project tablet AMD made. I told them if they ever "lost" one I would be much appreciative...LOL!

 

[szatkus]

some console dev. stuff that mostly went over my head
http://gamingbolt.com/dx12-wont-change-xbox-ones-1080p-issue-but-devs-will-be-able-to-push-more-triangles-witcher-3-dev
http://gamingbolt.com/ps4-and-xbox-one-feature-modern-cpus-having-faster-memory-isnt-useful-if-the-processor-stalls
what's so good about OoO execution in consoles anyway? pcs and tablet socs have had it for years... i thought older console processors had OoO execution.

CPUs in past-gens were in-order architecture.

 

[cdrkf]

The only tablet I would like to see is the discovery project tablet AMD made. I told them if they ever "lost" one I would be much appreciative...LOL!

Yeah that did look nice. I think AMD Mullins looks about the best fit for tablets right now. Sadly it looks destined to be bunged into bargain basement, under specified net books, rather than in a nice sleek tablet with a good quality screen *and* a decent battery.

This is the problem, many of the AMD A8 / A10 APU's would have been superb basis for decent laptops with a nice combination of gfx and cpu power (when you consider most laptops now are using the dual core ULV Intel parts), however all the offerings available are stuck with 768p screens, mechanical hard drives, single channel memory and pathetic speakers. It doesn't help that the kind of people working in computer shops in the UK don't know what they're talking about, and will blindly recommend inferior Intel products over AMD because 'its a better brand'... Ok AMD kit isn't the fastest at the top end, but if you have two £400 15" laptops, one has been built around an Atom (stupid but so many OEMs do this) and the other has an A8, and the guy recommends the Atom machine....

 

[jdwii]

I knew the xbox one wasn't going to sell anywhere near as good as the PS4 over its horrible hardware consoles fans are not as dumb as people think they are. I even knew Windows 8 was going to be a horrible ride as well for Microsoft as well as Windows server 2012(which we are not getting at my place). Hope next Windows Server and Windows 9 turns things around at Microsoft. The thing that really concerns me is Nintendo i'm hoping they can turn things around at this point i think they should team up with Steam that would solve all of Nintendo's problems it would fix their horrible online service it would fix 3rd party support and many PC gamers love Nintendo a lot so i expect nintendo would make lots of $$$. I would pay 60$ for so many games Nintendo made already for the PC its not even funny i would probably have 30% of my game inventory be nothing but Nintendo at 1080P 60FPS at ultra settings.