AMD CPU speculation... and expert conjecture

[szatkus]

Edit: Also about the quote, "Discrete GPUs will be killed by about 2020," I recall that after watching either the 2013 or 2014 Nvidia conference that Jen-Hsun Huang had said that. I may be wrong, and I tried looking for it myself. Though I have not found it yet, I did only look for about 15 minutes before taking a break. I may be wrong, but I just wanted to put it out there. It may explain why it is not found in text, but possibly in voice.

Rather not possible for them. The only non-discrete GPU they have is in Tegra. Nvidia will do anything to keep discrete GPUs alive. Just like they're fighting now for their hopeless PhysX .

 

[Reynod]

Thanks Palladin.

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Tom.

 

[8350rocks]

Thanks Palladin.

Guys, those of you who have posted regularly in this thread over the past year or so will have now received a PM from one of our staff called "Tittilating" asking you for some details so we can ship you a Toms Case Badge for your PC.

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Tom.

Thanks!

Also, in other news, FX 8350 pushes SLI @ 4K resolution better than 4930K:

http://www.tweaktown.com/tweakipedia/56/amd-fx-8350-powering-gtx-780-sli-vs-gtx-980-sli-at-4k/index.html

 

[logainofhades]

I admit that is an interesting development. Looks like 4k is a highly GPU bound resolution.

 

[jdwii]

Thanks Palladin.

Guys, those of you who have posted regularly in this thread over the past year or so will have now received a PM from one of our staff called "Tittilating" asking you for some details so we can ship you a Toms Case Badge for your PC.

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Tom.

Thanks!

Also, in other news, FX 8350 pushes SLI @ 4K resolution better than 4930K:

http://www.tweaktown.com/tweakipedia/56/amd-fx-8350-powering-gtx-780-sli-vs-gtx-980-sli-at-4k/index.html

Wow i would of never guessed do you have any idea why? Even the PCI-E 3.0 alone on the Intel build should put intel ahead. Maybe its the fast ram i do notice the min frame rates are lower.
Starting to think the Evil within is just a bad port
http://www.dsogaming.com/news/rumor-the-evil-within-pc-may-be-locked-at-30fps/

 

[blackkstar]

Thanks Palladin.

Guys, those of you who have posted regularly in this thread over the past year or so will have now received a PM from one of our staff called "Tittilating" asking you for some details so we can ship you a Toms Case Badge for your PC.

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Tom.

Thanks!

Also, in other news, FX 8350 pushes SLI @ 4K resolution better than 4930K:

http://www.tweaktown.com/tweakipedia/56/amd-fx-8350-powering-gtx-780-sli-vs-gtx-980-sli-at-4k/index.html

Did not expect FX to do so well with minimum frame rates due to their single thread performance. But if anyone is telling you to spend less on GPU and more on CPU, I suppose this debunks that pretty easily. Far better to spend more on GPU and less on CPU.

Saving almost $100 by going FX over 4690k (if you will spend the same on both mobos) frees up a lot of money for GPU performance.

 

[Cazalan]

Wow i would of never guessed do you have any idea why? Even the PCI-E 3.0 alone on the Intel build should put intel ahead. Maybe its the fast ram i do notice the min frame rates are lower.

That hex core only turbos to 3.9GHz vs the 4.4GHz turbo of the 4790k. I don't think people are buying the 4930K for gaming unless they're overclocking with H2O.

Still a great showing for 8350K considering the price difference.

 

[jdwii]

Yes it could make the difference of a 280 vs a 260X or a 280 over a 970. Wondering if people should get a 8320FX however as a standard on the Amd side over games using 4 threads or more, on toms i try and have them get a 8320fx since its 140$. Still not 100% sure if a Locked I5(190$) is a better or worse deal when compared to a 8350FX(180-170). Also you can save 10-15$ on a mother board from Intel over Amd. To me its almost like tails vs heads.

 

[gamerk316]

Thanks Palladin.

Guys, those of you who have posted regularly in this thread over the past year or so will have now received a PM from one of our staff called "Tittilating" asking you for some details so we can ship you a Toms Case Badge for your PC.

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Tom.

Thanks!

Also, in other news, FX 8350 pushes SLI @ 4K resolution better than 4930K:

http://www.tweaktown.com/tweakipedia/56/amd-fx-8350-powering-gtx-780-sli-vs-gtx-980-sli-at-4k/index.html

Wow i would of never guessed do you have any idea why? Even the PCI-E 3.0 alone on the Intel build should put intel ahead. Maybe its the fast ram i do notice the min frame rates are lower.
Starting to think the Evil within is just a bad port
http://www.dsogaming.com/news/rumor-the-evil-within-pc-may-be-locked-at-30fps/

I've got a theory on that actually. Remember that so far, Intel Quads in newer titles, maxed out, are reaching the upper 70s in core usage in the worst case. As I've noted several times: The highest usage core is the one that will limit you the most. It's possible that at 4k, even though the GPU should be doing vastly more work, the Intel CPUs are getting just enough extra work where the two heavy threads are maxing out one core, creating a CPU bottleneck in the process. The effects are minor due to the GPU bottleneck at that res, but they are there.

Working that theory, Intel should see a gain from DX12/OGLNG/Mantel/Whatever due to reduced CPU loads, as that one heavy core wouldn't be a problem anymore. That would make per-core performance dominant again, which benefits Intel processors.

Again, just a theory. Would need core loading numbers to confirm.

 

[GOM3RPLY3R]

Yes it could make the difference of a 280 vs a 260X or a 280 over a 970. Wondering if people should get a 8320FX however as a standard on the Amd side over games using 4 threads or more, on toms i try and have them get a 8320fx since its 140$. Still not 100% sure if a Locked I5(190$) is a better or worse deal when compared to a 8350FX(180-170). Also you can save 10-15$ on a mother board from Intel over Amd. To me its almost like tails vs heads.

I've seen a lot of posts (and I'm sure you have to) where the i5-3570k vs FX-8350 battle has been raging on for quite some time now. I can find some sources, and having an i5-3570k myself, I think that (at least new comers) definitely should get an 8320 or 8350 as you said.

One thing I did find interesting however is that my friend has a 8350 and we both own Corsair h100is. I was able to get mine from 3.4 Ghz to 4.8 Ghz and he was only able to get his from 4.0 Ghz to 4.6 Ghz, which seemed unusual. It could be because he was running with a 200 Mhz BCLK and I'm running a 100 Mhz BCLK, but I can't be sure, it was really strange as I usually see people getting 4.8 Ghz to 5.2 Ghz online. Maybe just from a bad wafer?

Edit: Just Ran a Test and I'm pretty sure I need to reapply some thermal paste. I used to get about 80-85ºC with this, but now it's toasty warm, lol >.>

Spoiler

 

[h2323]

Yes it could make the difference of a 280 vs a 260X or a 280 over a 970. Wondering if people should get a 8320FX however as a standard on the Amd side over games using 4 threads or more, on toms i try and have them get a 8320fx since its 140$. Still not 100% sure if a Locked I5(190$) is a better or worse deal when compared to a 8350FX(180-170). Also you can save 10-15$ on a mother board from Intel over Amd. To me its almost like tails vs heads.

I've seen a lot of posts (and I'm sure you have to) where the i5-3570k vs FX-8350 battle has been raging on for quite some time now. I can find some sources, and having an i5-3570k myself, I think that (at least new comers) definitely should get an 8320 or 8350 as you said.

One thing I did find interesting however is that my friend has a 8350 and we both own Corsair h100is. I was able to get mine from 3.4 Ghz to 4.8 Ghz and he was only able to get his from 4.0 Ghz to 4.6 Ghz, which seemed unusual. It could be because he was running with a 200 Mhz BCLK and I'm running a 100 Mhz BCLK, but I can't be sure, it was really strange as I usually see people getting 4.8 Ghz to 5.2 Ghz online. Maybe just from a bad wafer?

hmmm, he could be doing something wrong. I run at 4.65 with 1.4180 volts, at 1.4250 I can go to 4.75 stable, many people go to 1.45+ to get to 4.8+. But I have all my thermal and load limits for the mobo set to 130% or extreme. Lots of little things things get it to level out. Anyway I stopped overclocking when I could keep my fans running slow and still hit close to peak perofrmance without much heat (9000 physics fire strike score, 13750 geekbench and 735 r15 cinebench.) Good enough performance.

PS: your overclock is extreme, nice work, pretty hot though (I idle at 20c max and never breach 50c full load with 2 slow quiet fans on my h100i.

 

[h2323]

Rory Read has stepped down as AMD's CEO following three years on the job. Lisa Su, just four months removed from being named COO, is replacing Read as CEO, and taking his board spot.

 

[GOM3RPLY3R]

Spoiler

Yes it could make the difference of a 280 vs a 260X or a 280 over a 970. Wondering if people should get a 8320FX however as a standard on the Amd side over games using 4 threads or more, on toms i try and have them get a 8320fx since its 140$. Still not 100% sure if a Locked I5(190$) is a better or worse deal when compared to a 8350FX(180-170). Also you can save 10-15$ on a mother board from Intel over Amd. To me its almost like tails vs heads.

I've seen a lot of posts (and I'm sure you have to) where the i5-3570k vs FX-8350 battle has been raging on for quite some time now. I can find some sources, and having an i5-3570k myself, I think that (at least new comers) definitely should get an 8320 or 8350 as you said.

One thing I did find interesting however is that my friend has a 8350 and we both own Corsair h100is. I was able to get mine from 3.4 Ghz to 4.8 Ghz and he was only able to get his from 4.0 Ghz to 4.6 Ghz, which seemed unusual. It could be because he was running with a 200 Mhz BCLK and I'm running a 100 Mhz BCLK, but I can't be sure, it was really strange as I usually see people getting 4.8 Ghz to 5.2 Ghz online. Maybe just from a bad wafer?

hmmm, he could be doing something wrong. I run at 4.65 with 1.4180 volts, at 1.4250 I can go to 4.75 stable, many people go to 1.45+ to get to 4.8+. But I have all my thermal and load limits for the mobo set to 130% or extreme. Lots of little things things get it to level out. Anyway I stopped overclocking when I could keep my fans running slow and still hit close to peak perofrmance without much heat (9000 physics fire strike score, 13750 geekbench and 735 r15 cinebench.) Good enough performance.

PS: your overclock is extreme, nice work, pretty hot though (I idle at 20c max and never breach 50c full load with 2 slow quiet fans on my h100i.

I have 3D Mark 11 but not 3D Mark, so I just did the Firestrike demo and got this:

Spoiler

The GTX 970 is @1549 Mhz Core and 7200 Mhz Memory.

I think that I got lucky on my wafer for my i5, however I really need to put some new arctic silver on there and / or try to bring the voltage down a bit. Those temps are a bit scary, :/

P.S: Thanks ^_^.

 

[vmN]

Thanks Palladin.

Guys, those of you who have posted regularly in this thread over the past year or so will have now received a PM from one of our staff called "Tittilating" asking you for some details so we can ship you a Toms Case Badge for your PC.

I went back through this thread and nominated about 10 of you.

Please respond to the link provided and you will get something in the mail in a couple of days.

Please feel free to post a pick of your pooter with the new case badge.

There are only a few of these so treasure them.


Tom.

Thanks!

Also, in other news, FX 8350 pushes SLI @ 4K resolution better than 4930K:

http://www.tweaktown.com/tweakipedia/56/amd-fx-8350-powering-gtx-780-sli-vs-gtx-980-sli-at-4k/index.html

Wow i would of never guessed do you have any idea why? Even the PCI-E 3.0 alone on the Intel build should put intel ahead. Maybe its the fast ram i do notice the min frame rates are lower.
Starting to think the Evil within is just a bad port
http://www.dsogaming.com/news/rumor-the-evil-within-pc-may-be-locked-at-30fps/

I've got a theory on that actually. Remember that so far, Intel Quads in newer titles, maxed out, are reaching the upper 70s in core usage in the worst case. As I've noted several times: The highest usage core is the one that will limit you the most. It's possible that at 4k, even though the GPU should be doing vastly more work, the Intel CPUs are getting just enough extra work where the two heavy threads are maxing out one core, creating a CPU bottleneck in the process. The effects are minor due to the GPU bottleneck at that res, but they are there.

Working that theory, Intel should see a gain from DX12/OGLNG/Mantel/Whatever due to reduced CPU loads, as that one heavy core wouldn't be a problem anymore. That would make per-core performance dominant again, which benefits Intel processors.

Again, just a theory. Would need core loading numbers to confirm.

So, the FX singlecore performance forces the game to split up the threads across more cores?
Windows SMT support should also avoid putting 2 heavy threads on the same core.

 

[jdwii]

It really could be a bad overclocker like mine, i gave up trying past 4.3Ghz which already gets to 61C on prime, granted that is with a 212+ cooler in a push and pull configuration. I think the later 8350fx(like mine) could of been lower bin CPU's so they could come out with the fx 9000 series and fx 8320E. Plus GOM3RPLY3R i think you got lucky a bit most haswell's get to 4.4Ghz i believe i know the I5 4460(not overclockable) gets to 85C on the stock cooler running prime 95 for 2 hours.

Running Fritz and Handbrake i noticed the 3.2Ghz haswell is 20% slower compared to the 8350fx at 4.0Ghz .
To be honest i would rather have an unlock I5 ivy-haswell vs my CPU but I’m not sure about the locked I5 vs my CPU (50-60$ difference not including 10-15$ you save on the Intel board) even if you aren’t overclocking again i think it’s a tossup, i could argue with Intel power consumption can save you money on a PSU and you won't have to be as worried about motherboard compatibility(VRM's, capacitors).
Either way I feel completely different about the I3 vs 8320fx or I3 vs 6300fx to me it’s quite simple what to choose.

 

[jdwii]

Rory Read has stepped down as AMD's CEO following three years on the job. Lisa Su, just four months removed from being named COO, is replacing Read as CEO, and taking his board spot.

Well from reading her background she seems to be extremely knowledgeable when it comes to engineering read wasn't that bad but i'm not sure if he was as skilled in engineering. However i must say Amd needs someone who will stay at the company for years to come not just every 2-3 years.

 

[h2323]

Spoiler

Yes it could make the difference of a 280 vs a 260X or a 280 over a 970. Wondering if people should get a 8320FX however as a standard on the Amd side over games using 4 threads or more, on toms i try and have them get a 8320fx since its 140$. Still not 100% sure if a Locked I5(190$) is a better or worse deal when compared to a 8350FX(180-170). Also you can save 10-15$ on a mother board from Intel over Amd. To me its almost like tails vs heads.

I've seen a lot of posts (and I'm sure you have to) where the i5-3570k vs FX-8350 battle has been raging on for quite some time now. I can find some sources, and having an i5-3570k myself, I think that (at least new comers) definitely should get an 8320 or 8350 as you said.

One thing I did find interesting however is that my friend has a 8350 and we both own Corsair h100is. I was able to get mine from 3.4 Ghz to 4.8 Ghz and he was only able to get his from 4.0 Ghz to 4.6 Ghz, which seemed unusual. It could be because he was running with a 200 Mhz BCLK and I'm running a 100 Mhz BCLK, but I can't be sure, it was really strange as I usually see people getting 4.8 Ghz to 5.2 Ghz online. Maybe just from a bad wafer?

hmmm, he could be doing something wrong. I run at 4.65 with 1.4180 volts, at 1.4250 I can go to 4.75 stable, many people go to 1.45+ to get to 4.8+. But I have all my thermal and load limits for the mobo set to 130% or extreme. Lots of little things things get it to level out. Anyway I stopped overclocking when I could keep my fans running slow and still hit close to peak perofrmance without much heat (9000 physics fire strike score, 13750 geekbench and 735 r15 cinebench.) Good enough performance.

PS: your overclock is extreme, nice work, pretty hot though (I idle at 20c max and never breach 50c full load with 2 slow quiet fans on my h100i.

I have 3D Mark 11 but not 3D Mark, so I just did the Firestrike demo and got this:

The GTX 970 is @1549 Mhz Core and 7200 Mhz Memory.

I think that I got lucky on my wafer for my i5, however I really need to put some new arctic silver on there and / or try to bring the voltage down a bit. Those temps are a bit scary, :/

P.S: Thanks ^_^.

That is an insane graphics score

 

[h2323]

CONFIDENTIAL – INTERNAL ONLY
To: All AMD
Subject: Q3 Preliminary Results

Team,

Yesterday, we announced our preliminary third quarter results indicating a decline in both our revenue and gross margin expectations. This was primarily due to weaker than expected demand across all product lines caused by the challenging macroeconomic environment. We expect Q3 revenues to decrease approximately 10% sequentially, where we previously forecasted third quarter 2012 revenue to decrease 1%, plus or minus 3% sequentially. We believe gross margin will be approximately 31%, down from the guidance of 44% due to $100 million inventory write-down, as well as weaker than expected demand. We expect operating expenses to be 7% below our prior guidance, which was accomplished through the efforts of AMDers across the business to reduce costs.

Clearly, these preliminary results are disappointing to all of us and not reflective of the hard work and commitment demonstrated by AMDers every day. There is no doubt we are working through significant change and are feeling the pressures of a challenging market environment. The factors that emerged earlier this year that impacted the market and our business remain, and we continue to feel those impacts. I am personally disappointed in our results but we will push forward.

The strategy we laid out at the beginning of the year is sound – building our differentiated IP through ambidextrous architectures, Heterogeneous Systems Architecture (HSA) and leadership in graphics and cores – but we must accelerate our plans to adjust to accelerating market tends. We have spent time with our Board of Directors and as an AMD Executive Team (AET) talking through our short and long-term strategy and the steps necessary to enable us to execute on the goals and objectives we set. We are paving and charting our own path to success, and we will face challenges and make tough decisions along the way.

I know you have many questions and we will address those in the coming weeks. Our earnings call will be held on October 18th and our next WorldCast on October 30th where we’ll talk about the evolution of our strategy in more detail along with our full Q3 financial results. The AET is committed to communicating as transparently as possible, and investing the time to ensure that we are all aligned across AMD.

The tough market conditions coupled with building a stronger AMD requires change to seize the opportunities in front of us – and we must embrace that change. I truly appreciate the hard work that has been put forth as we work through a difficult market and a changing business.

Rory

2012?

 

[GOM3RPLY3R]

Spoiler

Spoiler

Yes it could make the difference of a 280 vs a 260X or a 280 over a 970. Wondering if people should get a 8320FX however as a standard on the Amd side over games using 4 threads or more, on toms i try and have them get a 8320fx since its 140$. Still not 100% sure if a Locked I5(190$) is a better or worse deal when compared to a 8350FX(180-170). Also you can save 10-15$ on a mother board from Intel over Amd. To me its almost like tails vs heads.

I've seen a lot of posts (and I'm sure you have to) where the i5-3570k vs FX-8350 battle has been raging on for quite some time now. I can find some sources, and having an i5-3570k myself, I think that (at least new comers) definitely should get an 8320 or 8350 as you said.

One thing I did find interesting however is that my friend has a 8350 and we both own Corsair h100is. I was able to get mine from 3.4 Ghz to 4.8 Ghz and he was only able to get his from 4.0 Ghz to 4.6 Ghz, which seemed unusual. It could be because he was running with a 200 Mhz BCLK and I'm running a 100 Mhz BCLK, but I can't be sure, it was really strange as I usually see people getting 4.8 Ghz to 5.2 Ghz online. Maybe just from a bad wafer?

hmmm, he could be doing something wrong. I run at 4.65 with 1.4180 volts, at 1.4250 I can go to 4.75 stable, many people go to 1.45+ to get to 4.8+. But I have all my thermal and load limits for the mobo set to 130% or extreme. Lots of little things things get it to level out. Anyway I stopped overclocking when I could keep my fans running slow and still hit close to peak perofrmance without much heat (9000 physics fire strike score, 13750 geekbench and 735 r15 cinebench.) Good enough performance.

PS: your overclock is extreme, nice work, pretty hot though (I idle at 20c max and never breach 50c full load with 2 slow quiet fans on my h100i.

I have 3D Mark 11 but not 3D Mark, so I just did the Firestrike demo and got this:

The GTX 970 is @1549 Mhz Core and 7200 Mhz Memory.

I think that I got lucky on my wafer for my i5, however I really need to put some new arctic silver on there and / or try to bring the voltage down a bit. Those temps are a bit scary, :/

P.S: Thanks ^_^.

That is an insane graphics score

Thanks again. ^_^

I changed a few settings around in my voltage, and to my surprise I actually had previously set the Vcore to .175, not .215 (I feel like an idiot), lol. I put that down to .150 v and reduced my DRAM voltage from 1.56 v to 1.55 v and increased some others (VCCSA, PLL, etc.) a little bit, and now I'm at these temperatures :3 :

Spoiler

P.S: I know my DRAM voltage is a little high for 1866 Corsair Vengeance, however, if I put it below 1.54 v I usually get a blue screen error referring to RAM voltage.

 

[esrever]

I am disappointed in AMD switching CEOs so rapidly, they really need someone who can bring the company around in the long term and they probably won't do too well if management keeps changing. They seem to be constantly restructuring which is a bad thing if it continues indefinitely. Hopefully Lisa Lu will be there for a long time. I mean she does have the commitment to AMD by being there for so long. The company does look a lot better than when Read took over and I think he deserves credit but the outlook is still pretty unclear for AMD. Hopefully they can come out with competitive products with the talent they have currently.

 

[jdwii]

I am disappointed in AMD switching CEOs so rapidly, they really need someone who can bring the company around in the long term and they probably won't do too well if management keeps changing. They seem to be constantly restructuring which is a bad thing if it continues indefinitely. Hopefully Lisa Lu will be there for a long time. I mean she does have the commitment to AMD by being there for so long. The company does look a lot better than when Read took over and I think he deserves credit but the outlook is still pretty unclear for AMD. Hopefully they can come out with competitive products with the talent they have currently.

Well i love one thing about her she is a engineer and she has a great background maybe not as great as keller but still really good and way better then read in this area. However is she a great business person? Not even sure if that matters to me it seems like the stock holders control most of that end. I agree with you 100% though they need someone in their that's their for the long term. Also extremely surprised about him leaving like we didn't hear anything bad about him.
Wonder if this will change anything when it comes to Ken/K12?

 

[Cazalan]

^ Yes, He had a plan and imo it was working maybe not for the stockholders but to the average consumer rory reed really helped amd. Since 20011 reed has put more graphics horsepower in the hands of everyday consumers than anytime in iamd's history, His strength was in knowing what people wanted not what would make the bean counters happy

The ATI acquisition and Fusion plan came well before Rory.

Their biggest setback really was the 1.3 billion or so they paid in fees for breaking the wafer sort agreement with GF. Still never saw a good reason for that. Considering how well Richland did on SOI the earlier cat cores should have been fine without TSMC.

 

[jdwii]

Cazalan i'm not sure how you could support such a horrible fabrication company that delayed Amd's products time and time again when Amd paid those guys to go away i was happy personally and if they have Samsung make their future products it will almost solve all their issues since their engineering department has keller and now Lisi Su. Rory kinda stabilized the company financially.

 

[Cazalan]

Cazalan i'm not sure how you could support such a horrible fabrication company that delayed Amd's products time and time again when Amd paid those guys to go away i was happy personally and if they have Samsung make their future products it will almost solve all their issues since their engineering department has keller and now Lisi Su. Rory kinda stabilized the company financially.

They didn't go away, they shifted more production back to GF now. You do realize that "horrible fabrication company" was largely the ex-AMD employees that were responsible for making the Athlons that used to outperform the Pentium 4.

 

[jdwii]

^^^ Meh not sure man if you look at bulldozer they had to delay the CPU over GF. The history of an company means nothing even more so when its a tech company. GF used to be amazing i will give you that. But now they need to go they are noncompetitive.