AMD Piledriver rumours ... and expert conjecture

[Reynod]

We have had several requests for a sticky on AMD's yet to be released Piledriver architecture ... so here it is.

I want to make a few things clear though.

Post a question relevant to the topic, or information about the topic, or it will be deleted.

Post any negative personal comments about another user ... and they will be deleted.

Post flame baiting comments about the blue, red and green team and they will be deleted.

Enjoy ...

 

[truegenius]

winzip ??
But my gpu does not support ocl 😱

its guesstimation time 😀
pd will be equal to phenom 2 in ipc
means ~20% improvements over bd with low power usage
i wouldn't be surprised to see a 4.2Ghz 8 core piledriver with the IPC of the Phenom II and a 125/140 watt TDP rating. (copy, paste edited) 😀

 

[jdwii]

i thought about replacing my current 1090t system with a piledriver one but maybe i just need to oc my current system, get an ssd, and get a water cooler instead? that'll probably hold me over for another year or so. 😀

It depends on what you do i know a SSD will be better then piledriver, What i mean is it will be a nice upgrade, i recommend Samsung 830 SSD they have a nice 128GB one for 200$ or even less.

 

[jimmysmitty]

AMD has fewer sockets since the Socket 7 days

Intel sockets:
- Slot 1
- Socket 370 (okay, I'll roll all 3 370 variants- PPGA 370, PGA 370, FCPGA2- into one here...)
- Socket 423
- Socket 478
- Socket 775
- Socket 771 (Skulltrail)
- Socket 1156
- Socket 1366
- Socket 1155
- Socket 2011

AMD sockets
- Slot A
- Socket A
- Socket 754
- Socket 940
- Socket 939
- Socket AM2/AM2+
- Socket L1 (QuadFX)
- Socket AM3/AM3+
- Socket FM1

Intel has used one more socket than AMD has. Intel actually had a Timna socket too that I could have counted, although it never made it into production. I count 9 AMD sockets and 10 Intel sockets. What is the 11th AMD socket? Super 7 is Socket 7 with a different VRM scheme and support for a 100 MHz FSB.

Super Socket 7 was just Socket 7 but it was still a AMD only socket, or when AMD started to push their own setups instead of using Intels sockets. So it would still count.

As for AM2/AM2+, I wouldn't count them as the same overall since not every CPU can work in both. Same with AM3/AM3+. Although they are the same, BD cannot go into a AM3 socket at all which means AM3+ in itself is somewhat its own socket designed mainly for BD with support for Phenom II. I haven't seen any AM3 mobos with BD support, and if they are they are AM3 mobos equipped with a AM3+ socket (black vs AM3s white).

I also left out the 771 (as it was mainly a server socket just the mobo was designed for DT) and L1 as they were very small specilized setups, not common enough. In fact out of both, I have only met one person who had one, which was a Quad FX, and none nave graced my work place yet.

 

[nforce4max]

Wow boredom has set in for many here lol not that I am alone. Been dusting off old dos rigs >.< As for super 7 it shouldn't count towards amd and intel as they were not the only ones that took advantage of it.

 

[noob2222]

Super Socket 7 was just Socket 7 but it was still a AMD only socket, or when AMD started to push their own setups instead of using Intels sockets. So it would still count.

As for AM2/AM2+, I wouldn't count them as the same overall since not every CPU can work in both. Same with AM3/AM3+. Although they are the same, BD cannot go into a AM3 socket at all which means AM3+ in itself is somewhat its own socket designed mainly for BD with support for Phenom II. I haven't seen any AM3 mobos with BD support, and if they are they are AM3 mobos equipped with a AM3+ socket (black vs AM3s white).

I also left out the 771 (as it was mainly a server socket just the mobo was designed for DT) and L1 as they were very small specilized setups, not common enough. In fact out of both, I have only met one person who had one, which was a Quad FX, and none nave graced my work place yet.

what about all the 775s that were only half compatible with newst cpus, (not to mention Rambus to ddr2, ddr3, all "socket 775")? kinda same thing just didn't change the actual socket or rename it for that matter. At least AMD buyers would know that its slightly different.

how many generations were the 775 changed but the name remained the same?

 

[nforce4max]

what about all the 775s that were only half compatible with newst cpus, (not to mention Rambus to ddr2, ddr3, all "socket 775")? kinda same thing just didn't change the actual socket or rename it for that matter. At least AMD buyers would know that its slightly different.

how many generations were the 775 changed but the name remained the same?

There are sub generations but they are not counted.

 

[noob2222]

because it adds to intel's count even though its the same changes that am2/am2+/am3 brought but didn't rename?

 

[Chad Boga]

*cough*

Well...he sure hasn't been around since we hosed him with all we have...both Baron and Chad stress tested that guy for sure. I fell bad for this poor soul!

I wouldn't be so sure of thinking anything on this forum stressed him out, it was verging on ridiculous how many forums he was posting on.

 

[nforce4max]

because it adds to intel's count even though its the same changes that am2/am2+/am3 brought but didn't rename?

No, because the only thing that has changed was the memory controller but still offered backward support for older cpus for the same socket that was not only mechanically the same but also electrical as well. As for am2 ect I don't count them as being different sockets as they are still mechanically and electrically more or less the same while am3 was pinned differently.

 

[de5_Roy]

may 15.......
http://www.fudzilla.com/home/item/26878-trinity-chips-tip-up-in-two-asus-notebooks
brazos 2.0 is also on the way... according to rumors
http://www.fudzilla.com/home/item/26863-trinity-and-brazos-20-coming-soon

 

[notsleep]

never mind on oc'ing my 1090t system, it appears the stock cpu cooler, power supply, and mob can't handle it. 🙁

oh, well. i guess i'll go with an ssd. thanks for the samsung 830 128 gb suggestion. i was going to go with crucial for less money but it looks like 830 performs better.

heck, i might end up getting 2 of them with the desktop kit to upgrade my q6600 intel system as well. although, my q6600 intel system only have sata ii not sata iii. since 830 is sata iii, connecting it to a sata ii system is going to reduce it's performance. 🙁

$339.98 for two 830s at $169.99 each isn't a bad upgrade for my amd and intel systems. i'm hoping it'll quench my 'upgrade' fix until steamroller/haswell. 😀

 

[Reynod]

^
MU_E
FM2 is ten for AMD.
11 is still unofficial I think but I hope you will know.

you could count AM2 and AM2+ as two and not one socket.
same for AM3 and AM3+.
no.?

In that case there are three socket 775 Intel variants ... the early models, the middle era and the last EOL variants.

Upgrading from Pentium to core2 could be a major issue there too.

Add those into the mix and both have about 15 sockets essentially due to power and chipset iterations.

mu could spell it all out in a masterful 1500 word post ... then again he might just say "yes".

 

[Reynod]

*cough*

Well...he sure hasn't been around since we hosed him with all we have...both Baron and Chad stress tested that guy for sure. I fell bad for this poor soul!

And JF leaving this forum due to the behaviour of users here is a good thing?

Think it through.

Our loss not his.

Unless the topic returns to Piledriver this thread will get closed.

Gloating over previous poor behaviour ... implies guilt ... should I attach an appropriate ban?

 

[nforce4max]

And JF leaving this forum due to the behaviour of users here is a good thing?

Think it through.

Our loss not his.

Unless the topic returns to Piledriver this thread will get closed.

Gloating over previous poor behaviour ... implies guilt ... should I attach an appropriate ban?

Good, this thread has outlasted it's purpose by far than it should have done. There is just nothing meaningful about Piledriver for the foreseeable future unless something pops up :s

 

[truegenius]

-9999
🙁

 

[truegenius]

instead rename it to
'amd thread'
or
'amd cpu disscusion (current topic is pd/trinity)'
or something like that, so as to keep every thing about amd in 1 thread and the words in bracket will show current disscusion (suposed disscusion)

 

[de5_Roy]

+1 to temp. closure.
imo when ivb comes out, there's a chance that intel fanboys will troll this thread like nvidia fanboys did in the radeon 7000 thread when gtx 680 came out. same thing might happen with ivy bridge thread when trinity/pd comes out but i think it'll happen much later.
this amd-related thread has already had it's 'bd vs sb', 'amd vs intel', and lastly, the perpetual, 'intel is ebil' arguments. legend is, when all these three arguments are had ... something will rise up/descend and walk the earth.. or something... or nothing will change in real life.

 

[jimmysmitty]

what about all the 775s that were only half compatible with newst cpus, (not to mention Rambus to ddr2, ddr3, all "socket 775")? kinda same thing just didn't change the actual socket or rename it for that matter. At least AMD buyers would know that its slightly different.

how many generations were the 775 changed but the name remained the same?

One correction here, there was no Rambus 775 socket. Rambus was S423 Pentium 4s. When Intel felt it was too expensive to keep trying a super proprietary designed memory, they moved to DDR on S478.

775 was never changed, more like the chipset. Same thing with AMDs AM2 or AM2+. If there were certain changes, normally higher TDP, then a older mobo may not support it as well as not have BIOS support.

In that case there are three socket 775 Intel variants ... the early models, the middle era and the last EOL variants.

Upgrading from Pentium to core2 could be a major issue there too.

Add those into the mix and both have about 15 sockets essentially due to power and chipset iterations.

mu could spell it all out in a masterful 1500 word post ... then again he might just say "yes".

Power was the main thing with it, mainly that the VRMs were not strong enough. Thats why some of the earlier chipset mobos would support Core 2 Duos, but not Core 2 Quads. There was a few Asus mobos with early 9 series chipsets that had support for 65nm Core 2 and 45nm Core 2. Forget which ones but they were pretty high end ones.

Same thing happens to all sockets, thats why BD cannot run on AM3 which is essentially the same socket, except for certain power layouts made just for BD in AM3+.

 

[jimmysmitty]

I sold an awesome AM2+ unit to go straight to AM3+.
the motherboard, SSD and RAM were a good upgrade of course but I was very content with my AM2+ on a WD Raptor HDD.

then Bulldozer came out and it failed.
I had the money for the FX-4100 in my hand when I stayed up that night to read the reviews.
next morning I upgraded to another Phenom II X4.
I went from a Phenom II X4 940 C2 to now a 975BE C3.

So if Piledriver blows then what....?
I do not need a 1100T ...😉

PD wont blow. I feel it will do a Phenom II per say. I just don't think it will catch up to whatever Intels current will be (be it IB or Haswell depending on when PD is released).

 

[truegenius]

but i assume that pd will be equal to a phenom 2 with half power usage
while bd is not able to match phenom 2 in same tdp
so it is a huge uplift

 

[EXT64]

So PD is supposed to fit in AM3+ still, right? Also, any news on whether they plan to add another module or two (10-12 "cores", 5-6 modules)?

 

[nforce4max]

at least can it actually surpass LGA 1156......?
not just here and there, actually be better than..

I doubt that but it would help to have a better memory controller to make up for some of the weaknesses.

 

[jimmysmitty]

http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/cpu/display/20120202124109_AMD_Cancels_10_Core_20_Core_Server_Processors.html

.......................................bring no improvements on the platform level.......postpones the introduction of support for PCI-E Gen 3

AMD skipping PCIe 3.0 this gen would hurt them in the longevity run. Intel did play it smart as did the mobo manufactures putting PCIe 3.0 into current mobos.

Still PCIe 3.0 wont be needed for another 2-3 card gens, if that. But then again with the extra PCIe 3.0 bandwidth, nVidia and AMD might excellerate their need and try to utilize it sooner.

Still since AMD has a PCIe 3.0 GPU, why would they not add PCIe 3.0 into PD? Would only make sense.

 

[jimmysmitty]

I doubt that but it would help to have a better memory controller to make up for some of the weaknesses.

I agree that AMD has had a pretty weak memory controller since Intel went IMC. A 2500K with DDR3 1600MHz using CAS 9 is about 18-20GB/s for read, write and copy. BD keeps up in copy but read and write is 25-50% slower, even with faster RAM.

But that said, it wont make any real world difference for us only servers that need that kind of bandwidth.

 

[dogman_1234]

I wouldn't be so sure of thinking anything on this forum stressed him out, it was verging on ridiculous how many forums he was posting on.

True.

I have had the liberty to see him post on them as well. Seen the same thing: Hounded about BD. Asking question, the same questions, over and over. I would not want to continue either.

And JF leaving this forum due to the behaviour of users here is a good thing?

Think it through.

Our loss not his.

Unless the topic returns to Piledriver this thread will get closed.

Gloating over previous poor behaviour ... implies guilt ... should I attach an appropriate ban?

I think there should be a temporary closure of the thread. Open it when AMD actually has stuff for us...which will possibly be on PD's release date!

Are you asking if I think I should be banned?

AMD skipping PCIe 3.0 this gen would hurt them in the longevity run. Intel did play it smart as did the mobo manufactures putting PCIe 3.0 into current mobos.

Still PCIe 3.0 wont be needed for another 2-3 card gens, if that. But then again with the extra PCIe 3.0 bandwidth, nVidia and AMD might excellerate their need and try to utilize it sooner.

Still since AMD has a PCIe 3.0 GPU, why would they not add PCIe 3.0 into PD? Would only make sense.

Could they be integrating in into PD? Or was that SR? (Steamroller)