AMD Piledriver rumours ... and expert conjecture

[Reynod]

We have had several requests for a sticky on AMD's yet to be released Piledriver architecture ... so here it is.

I want to make a few things clear though.

Post a question relevant to the topic, or information about the topic, or it will be deleted.

Post any negative personal comments about another user ... and they will be deleted.

Post flame baiting comments about the blue, red and green team and they will be deleted.

Enjoy ...

 

[nforce4max]

whenever on anandtech reading an article or whatever (BS'n) do you ever run a few comparisons just for amusement.?
and since they all are charted at stock (or reference in GPU section) it's kinda fun with the different combinations.
example
i5-760 vs 980BE
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/191?vs=362
i5-760 vs FX-8150
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/191?vs=434
i5-760 vs A8-3850
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/191?vs=399

there's nothing like benching and seeing it for yourself but messing with the different combos can be interesting..
though it means little..

Yea, A little tweaking on the side does a lot to skew results and I don't place to much trust nor value in their reviews. Stumbled across this today.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1r5dOwUS6Y

 

[noob2222]

No, because the only thing that has changed was the memory controller but still offered backward support for older cpus for the same socket that was not only mechanically the same but also electrical as well. As for am2 ect I don't count them as being different sockets as they are still mechanically and electrically more or less the same while am3 was pinned differently.

pinned differently to keep people from frying their am2 motherboard with an am3+ cpu. you can buy an AM2 cpu and put it in any motherboard. The only thing that got dropped off the support list is the phenom (I) cpus. http://www.gigabyte.com/support-downloads/cpu-support-popup.aspx?pid=4001

same could not be said for intel 775. buy a c2q and plug it into an old motherboard and scratch your head as to why it won't work, after all it fits, it should work... AMD made more sense by changing the name and reducing compatibility issues with a new cpu on old board. argue all you want, 775 changed just as much as am2/am2+/am3/am3+ without letting people know its different.

One correction here, there was no Rambus 775 socket. Rambus was S423 Pentium 4s. When Intel felt it was too expensive to keep trying a super proprietary designed memory, they moved to DDR on S478.

thought I saw some with rdr. but didn't notice it went from ddr first, so thats still 3 gens under the same name.

 

[nforce4max]

pinned differently to keep people from frying their am2 motherboard with an am3+ cpu. you can buy an AM2 cpu and put it in any motherboard. The only thing that got dropped off the support list is the phenom (I) cpus. http://www.gigabyte.com/support-downloads/cpu-support-popup.aspx?pid=4001

same could not be said for intel 775. buy a c2q and plug it into an old motherboard and scratch your head as to why it won't work, after all it fits, it should work... AMD made more sense by changing the name and reducing compatibility issues with a new cpu on old board. argue all you want, 775 changed just as much as am2/am2+/am3/am3+ without letting people know its different.

One correction here, there was no Rambus 775 socket. Rambus was S423 Pentium 4s. When Intel felt it was too expensive to keep trying a super proprietary designed memory, they moved to DDR on S478.

thought I saw some with rdr. but didn't notice it went from ddr first, so thats still 3 gens under the same name.

Same socket but people shouldn't expect old boards to have the best support and that hasn't changed. Rdram also made it to socket 478 and 603 but not 604. Only Rambus is to blame for rdram for being a failure that it was. Performance wise the memory did improve over time but that didn't save it.

 

[nforce4max]

now I have to take notes...

It was just my opinion though, if it helps people then it is ok but personally just don't think highly of them. Their charts are more fuzzy math to me. Phenom 2 isn't bad and amd does still have some advantages in it's favor but for some things there is no substitute for that i5 quad.

 

[jimmysmitty]

pinned differently to keep people from frying their am2 motherboard with an am3+ cpu. you can buy an AM2 cpu and put it in any motherboard. The only thing that got dropped off the support list is the phenom (I) cpus. http://www.gigabyte.com/support-downloads/cpu-support-popup.aspx?pid=4001

same could not be said for intel 775. buy a c2q and plug it into an old motherboard and scratch your head as to why it won't work, after all it fits, it should work... AMD made more sense by changing the name and reducing compatibility issues with a new cpu on old board. argue all you want, 775 changed just as much as am2/am2+/am3/am3+ without letting people know its different.

One correction here, there was no Rambus 775 socket. Rambus was S423 Pentium 4s. When Intel felt it was too expensive to keep trying a super proprietary designed memory, they moved to DDR on S478.

thought I saw some with rdr. but didn't notice it went from ddr first, so thats still 3 gens under the same name.

The difference was mainly the chipset, that was set to have each chipset specifically designed for a certain arch, i.e. 9 series for Pentium D, 3 series for Core 2, 4 series for Core 2 45nm. But that did not mean you had to have it in order to get support as it depends on the mobo you buy. Not every AM2 mobo supported Phenom I due to VRM constraints or they were just too lazy to update the BIOS for support.

As for 775, it only had two memory types, DDR2 and DDR3 but there were some companies that designed the boards with older DDR1 since the CPU did not matter there, just the chipset. So if they wanted to and could push the support somehow, you could put a Core 2 Quad with DDR or a Pentium D with DDR3.

Now that the CPU determines the memory type, not the chipset, it turns out that when changing, you need a new board. Anything thats on AM3+ when AMD moves to DDR4 will be dead, mainly because of the major change that DDR4 is making vs the small changes in DDR->DDR2->DDR3 (lower voltage, higher speeds larger sizes due to smaller proces for SRAM). Same will go for Intel or anyone else who moves to DDR4.

And actually, Intel let everyone know that the best support for a released CPU is the chipset they designed it with. Every time. While IB will work in a Z68 with a BIOS update, its still best to have a Z77 for the best support and capabilities.

 

[jdwii]

never mind on oc'ing my 1090t system, it appears the stock cpu cooler, power supply, and mob can't handle it. 🙁

oh, well. i guess i'll go with an ssd. thanks for the samsung 830 128 gb suggestion. i was going to go with crucial for less money but it looks like 830 performs better.

heck, i might end up getting 2 of them with the desktop kit to upgrade my q6600 intel system as well. although, my q6600 intel system only have sata ii not sata iii. since 830 is sata iii, connecting it to a sata ii system is going to reduce it's performance. 🙁

$339.98 for two 830s at $169.99 each isn't a bad upgrade for my amd and intel systems. i'm hoping it'll quench my 'upgrade' fix until steamroller/haswell. 😀

Great Choice! Pile driver will be out around 3Q of 2012 if amd does not make a boom boom! If so i except a 4Q release.

 

[king smp]

just read this article
sure most of it is old news to die hards on here but I thought it was a good article for somebody like me that isnt up to date on all the latest news

http://arstechnica.com/business/news/2012/02/amd-sets-out-its-plans-for-2013-hints-at-a-possible-arm-future.ars

from February but really filled in some gaps for me if this author is well informed

 

[jimmysmitty]

just read this article
sure most of it is old news to die hards on here but I thought it was a good article for somebody like me that isnt up to date on all the latest news

http://arstechnica.com/business/news/2012/02/amd-sets-out-its-plans-for-2013-hints-at-a-possible-arm-future.ars

from February but really filled in some gaps for me if this author is well informed

One problem with this is that for each, Intel is already pushing there.

Intel already has Atom for ultra mobility (smartphones/tablets) and IB will probably be the best for notebooks.

In Cloud, Intel has already created a CPU just for cloud specific computing. Not sure when it will be 100% but its already in testing.

Another thing, focusing on emerging markets is fine but in a lot of those countries, the majority does not have the money to spend like the US and some EU nations do. My girls home country, she said meat is something like $10/ pound and most things we take for granted, like oranges and juice drinks etc, are more of a luxury item. And a lot of the countries they want to focus on, the majority is not able to buy such items.

AMD needs to regroup and focus on improving their existing designs and only making major changes that will benefit instead of trying to completley change their CPU design every new arch. So far its worked for Intel sticking with a core design. But almost every CPU arch redesign (minus K8) has flopped in performance expectation.

 

[sarinaide]

I can get hold of a Piledriver sample in about 2-3 months, though the premium of around $600 makes it rather questionable.

I can see PD sitting somewhere between first gen and second gen Intel chips, on the premise that BD already had fundamentally stronger multithreaded performance than even the contemporary Intel chips, at the price point I can see it matching pretty well with higher end 1156/1366 chips at the same price point. I don't see it matching the i7 980 upwards though, that is out of the price point that AMD competes, but you never really know for sure.

 

[-Fran-]

http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=24506

That's the latest I have found, but it's more confirmation of the roadmap AMD is following.

Cheers!

 

[jdwii]

Lol ivy sure was disappointing on the CPU side of things i see its 5% or so faster then sandy while not even being that much better on the TDP side of things, And not winning heads on overclocking(even though its still pretty good) If i owned a I5 2500K or a 2600K i would see know reason to switch.

But the GPU surprises me quite a bit its around 30% slower then Llano but still a pretty big jump for Intel. What's funny is if Amd cant push Intel on the CPU side of things they sure can on the Graphics side of things.


If Intel really wanted to kick amd they should price the 3770K at 299.99$ and the I5 3570K at 199.99$ but that would be to nice and Intel has no reason to do it since their the only choice for lots of consumers.

 

[gamerk316]

If Intel really wanted to kick amd they should price the 3770K at 299.99$ and the I5 3570K at 199.99$ but that would be to nice and Intel has no reason to do it since their the only choice for lots of consumers.

Well, they are selling the i5 3570k @ $212 right now...about where it should be.

 

[sarinaide]

I use Intel and AMD on a daily basis, it is a hobby, but AMD leaves you with a feeling of getting more for less, there is a sense of nostalgia and eloquence about AMD chips past and present, I am one of the few that a FX 8XXX does suit my needs and better and more affordable than what Intel offers.

With Intel while numbers are impressive, its the same thing different flavor, and HT is a luke warm effort at SMT and Intel know it yet they give you what looks like chips of old with bolted on instruction sets and refined architecture, nothing exciting at any end.

 

[JAYDEEJOHN]

They do have margins to make, and low pricing would alter their production as well.

 

[earl45]

Of course Ivy Bridge isnt gonna be any faster, it's just a die shrink with relatively similar clocks and similar Cache.....

2 good things about IB.
1) It's not worst then SB clock for clock.
2) Encoding is my thing and that's a plus on IB.

 

[esrever]

2 good things about IB.
1) It's not worst then SB clock for clock.
2) Encoding is my thing and that's a plus on IB.

I find it strange that you say bulldozer wasn't worth it for encoding but ivybridge is.

 

[nforce4max]

I use Intel and AMD on a daily basis, it is a hobby, but AMD leaves you with a feeling of getting more for less, there is a sense of nostalgia and eloquence about AMD chips past and present, I am one of the few that a FX 8XXX does suit my needs and better and more affordable than what Intel offers.

With Intel while numbers are impressive, its the same thing different flavor, and HT is a luke warm effort at SMT and Intel know it yet they give you what looks like chips of old with bolted on instruction sets and refined architecture, nothing exciting at any end.

There are plenty of things about AMD in general that are too easily taken for granted. Many amd boards have very wonderful I/O performance such as very responsive sata and ide controllers as well rather quick usb compared to many intel based boards. The differences are small for most people out there to notice but they do make up for some of the weaknesses of amd in general. There is plenty of reasons why amd was so popular a few years ago in the high end server and workstation market. Personally they need to merge their high end desktop line with the low end server line (example am3+ and socket G34) so there are fewer platforms that they have to support but also enrich the features available to both markets.

 

[Cazalan]

2 good things about IB.
1) It's not worst then SB clock for clock.
2) Encoding is my thing and that's a plus on IB.

3) PileDriver has a chance to catch up some

 

[nforce4max]

3) PileDriver has a chance to catch up some

I have my doubts but if amd does a decent job and polishes out some of the major flaws it will be a decent product compared to BD.

 

[earl45]

I find it strange that you say bulldozer wasn't worth it for encoding but ivybridge is.

Because I use the programs that make use of the GPU in the CPU and my CF setup so
encoding is pretty damn fast, and you can't get that kind of performance out of the FX
line period.

 

[dogman_1234]

Why so?

 

[earl45]

and here we go.....
ding ding ding.

Mal cut it out

 

[g4114rd0]

GCC 4.7 is available with support for AMD Opteron™ 6200 series and AMD FX series processors..."
http://blogs.amd.com/developer/2012/04/23/gcc-4-7-is-available-with-support-for-amd-opteron%E2%84%A2-6200-series-and-amd-fx-series-processors/

AMD to Present at J.P. Morgan Global Technology, Media and Telecom Conference..."
http://ir.amd.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=74093&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=1686140&highlight=

AFDS Virtual Scavenger Hunt – What You Need to Know..."
http://blogs.amd.com/fusion/2012/04/23/afds-virtual-scavenger-hunt-what-you-need-to-know/

 

[fazers_on_stun]

I find it strange that you say bulldozer wasn't worth it for encoding but ivybridge is.

Note that the 8150 is using the GTX 680 for encoding according to Hexus:

For this benchmark, we're specifically testing the performance of Intel's Quick Sync technology by using CyberLink's MediaEspresso to convert an hour-long 720p movie clip to a 480x360 .mp4 file that's friendly with our BlackBerry Bold smartphones.

We've previously been impressed with Quick Sync performance, but Intel has clearly gone one better; the i7-3770K manages to encode the clip in less than three minutes. That's a good 26 per cent quicker than the best Sandy Bridge part (i7-2700K) and a stonking 38 per cent quicker than using a discrete GPU (NVIDIA's top-of-the-range GeForce GTX 680, no less).

 

[earl45]

http://img685.imageshack.us/img685/1484/graph07.png

Note that the 8150 is using the GTX 680 for encoding according to Hexus:

For this benchmark, we're specifically testing the performance of Intel's Quick Sync technology by using CyberLink's MediaEspresso to convert an hour-long 720p movie clip to a 480x360 .mp4 file that's friendly with our BlackBerry Bold smartphones.

We've previously been impressed with Quick Sync performance, but Intel has clearly gone one better; the i7-3770K manages to encode the clip in less than three minutes. That's a good 26 per cent quicker than the best Sandy Bridge part (i7-2700K) and a stonking 38 per cent quicker than using a discrete GPU (NVIDIA's top-of-the-range GeForce GTX 680, no less).

Thank you that's all I want to say is what you said. :lol: