AMD's Future Chips & SoC's: News, Info & Rumours.

[juanrga]

i'd be pleased to see a slight clock increase in the pinnacle ridge 'zen refresh'. ryzen cpus seem to scale very well in performance with clock speed.

I expect a 100--300MHz increase for Pinnacle Ridge.

 

[goldstone77]

AMD to launch 12nm Ryzen in February 2018, says mobo makers
Monica Chen, Taipei; Joseph Tsai, DIGITIMES [Wednesday 27 September 2017]

AMD has informed its partners that it plans to launch in February 2018 an upgrade version of its Ryzen series processors built using a 12nm low-power (12LP) process at Globalfoundries, according to sources at motherboard makers.

The company will initially release the CPUs codenamed Pinnacle 7, followed by mid-range Pinnacle 5 and entry-level Pinnacle 3 processors in March 2018, the sources disclosed. AMD is also expected to see its share of the desktop CPU market return to 30% in the first half of 2018.

AMD will launch the low-power version of Pinnacle processors in April 2018 and the enterprise version Pinnacle Pro in May 2018.

Their corresponding chipsets, the 400 series, will also become available in March 2018 with X470- or B450-based motherboards to be the first to hit the store shelves. The chipsets are still designed by ASMedia and its orders for the chipsets are expected to grow dramatically starting January 2018.

Thanks to stable chip orders for Microsoft's and Sony's game consoles, increased demand for graphics cards, growing sales for its Ryzen 7/5 processors, new Ryzen Pro product line for the enterprise sector and the top-end Ryzen Treadripper processors, AMD managed to achieve 19% sequential growth in second-quarter 2017 revenues and expects the amount to grow further by 23% in the third quarter.

AMD said it does not comment on products that have not been announced.

Edit: added link to source

 

[juanrga]

AMD to launch 12nm Ryzen in February 2018, says mobo makers
Monica Chen, Taipei; Joseph Tsai, DIGITIMES [Wednesday 27 September 2017]

AMD has informed its partners that it plans to launch in February 2018 an upgrade version of its Ryzen series processors built using a 12nm low-power (12LP) process at Globalfoundries, according to sources at motherboard makers.

The company will initially release the CPUs codenamed Pinnacle 7, followed by mid-range Pinnacle 5 and entry-level Pinnacle 3 processors in March 2018, the sources disclosed. AMD is also expected to see its share of the desktop CPU market return to 30% in the first half of 2018.

AMD will launch the low-power version of Pinnacle processors in April 2018 and the enterprise version Pinnacle Pro in May 2018.

Their corresponding chipsets, the 400 series, will also become available in March 2018 with X470- or B450-based motherboards to be the first to hit the store shelves. The chipsets are still designed by ASMedia and its orders for the chipsets are expected to grow dramatically starting January 2018.

Thanks to stable chip orders for Microsoft's and Sony's game consoles, increased demand for graphics cards, growing sales for its Ryzen 7/5 processors, new Ryzen Pro product line for the enterprise sector and the top-end Ryzen Treadripper processors, AMD managed to achieve 19% sequential growth in second-quarter 2017 revenues and expects the amount to grow further by 23% in the third quarter.

AMD said it does not comment on products that have not been announced.

Edit: added link to source

I believe that LP acronym doesn't mean Low Power.

Didn't Glofo say that 12LP risk production start in H1 2018?

Interesting that Pinnacle Ridge requires a new set of chipsets and mobos.

 

[aldaia]

LP stands for Leading Performance

 

[goldstone77]

AMD to launch 12nm Ryzen in February 2018, says mobo makers
Monica Chen, Taipei; Joseph Tsai, DIGITIMES [Wednesday 27 September 2017]

AMD has informed its partners that it plans to launch in February 2018 an upgrade version of its Ryzen series processors built using a 12nm low-power (12LP) process at Globalfoundries, according to sources at motherboard makers.

The company will initially release the CPUs codenamed Pinnacle 7, followed by mid-range Pinnacle 5 and entry-level Pinnacle 3 processors in March 2018, the sources disclosed. AMD is also expected to see its share of the desktop CPU market return to 30% in the first half of 2018.

AMD will launch the low-power version of Pinnacle processors in April 2018 and the enterprise version Pinnacle Pro in May 2018.

Their corresponding chipsets, the 400 series, will also become available in March 2018 with X470- or B450-based motherboards to be the first to hit the store shelves. The chipsets are still designed by ASMedia and its orders for the chipsets are expected to grow dramatically starting January 2018.

Thanks to stable chip orders for Microsoft's and Sony's game consoles, increased demand for graphics cards, growing sales for its Ryzen 7/5 processors, new Ryzen Pro product line for the enterprise sector and the top-end Ryzen Treadripper processors, AMD managed to achieve 19% sequential growth in second-quarter 2017 revenues and expects the amount to grow further by 23% in the third quarter.

AMD said it does not comment on products that have not been announced.

Edit: added link to source

I believe that LP acronym doesn't mean Low Power.

Didn't Glofo say that 12LP risk production start in H1 2018?

Interesting that Pinnacle Ridge requires a new set of chipsets and mobos.

Goflo calls LP lead performance. Yes the marketing slide said risk production 1H 2018.
http://www.guru3d.com/news-story/amd-to-launch-12nm-ryzen-in-february.html
Require new motherboards? Will it still be AM4 socket? Will these chips work with old motherboards? These are the questions.

 

[adamsleath]

lol.. as promised? still am4 socket but a new chipset...that's amusing.

 

[jdwii]

i'd be pleased to see a slight clock increase in the pinnacle ridge 'zen refresh'. ryzen cpus seem to scale very well in performance with clock speed.

The problem with current 14nm Zen was build on Samsung 14nmLPP for 3GHz operation, and is being pushed to it's architectural limitations 3.8,3.9,4.0, and 4.1GHz depending the the CPU this varies greatly. Once a particular CPU hit above normal operation frequency threshold the voltage required to increase just 100-300MHz spikes! If kept within normal operation it's very efficient, and runs cool. I'm interested to see what changes they have made in the new 12nm.

Good news is that newer chips are requiring less voltage to hit 3.8ghz many new chips are hitting 3.8ghz at 1.2V now where my chip needs 1.35-.1.375V to do that. Still the chips are not hitting any higher then 4.1ghz on the forums with 100% stability.

I think we will see a small 200-300mhz bump on the top-end model of ryzen but all chips will probably hit 4.0ghz at 1.3-1.35V. That's my best guess at the moment.

 

[jdwii]

AMD to launch 12nm Ryzen in February 2018, says mobo makers
Monica Chen, Taipei; Joseph Tsai, DIGITIMES [Wednesday 27 September 2017]

AMD has informed its partners that it plans to launch in February 2018 an upgrade version of its Ryzen series processors built using a 12nm low-power (12LP) process at Globalfoundries, according to sources at motherboard makers.

The company will initially release the CPUs codenamed Pinnacle 7, followed by mid-range Pinnacle 5 and entry-level Pinnacle 3 processors in March 2018, the sources disclosed. AMD is also expected to see its share of the desktop CPU market return to 30% in the first half of 2018.

AMD will launch the low-power version of Pinnacle processors in April 2018 and the enterprise version Pinnacle Pro in May 2018.

Their corresponding chipsets, the 400 series, will also become available in March 2018 with X470- or B450-based motherboards to be the first to hit the store shelves. The chipsets are still designed by ASMedia and its orders for the chipsets are expected to grow dramatically starting January 2018.

Thanks to stable chip orders for Microsoft's and Sony's game consoles, increased demand for graphics cards, growing sales for its Ryzen 7/5 processors, new Ryzen Pro product line for the enterprise sector and the top-end Ryzen Treadripper processors, AMD managed to achieve 19% sequential growth in second-quarter 2017 revenues and expects the amount to grow further by 23% in the third quarter.

AMD said it does not comment on products that have not been announced.

Edit: added link to source

I believe that LP acronym doesn't mean Low Power.

Didn't Glofo say that 12LP risk production start in H1 2018?

Interesting that Pinnacle Ridge requires a new set of chipsets and mobos.

"requires" i did not see that part all i saw was new chipsets which is 100% normal with Amd with newer releases

 

[goldstone77]

AMD 12nm Pinnacle Ridge & 7nm Matisse CPUs Leaked, Launching In 2018 & 2019 Respectively On AM4 – Picasso APU Succeeding Raven Ridge In 2019
By Khalid Moammer
Sep 26

AMD’s latest internal CPU & APU roadmap for 2018 and 2019 has been leaked. The new roadmap shows the company introducing Pinnacle Ridge & Matisse CPUs in 2018 and 2019 respectively. As well as Raven Ridge and Picasso APUs in 2018 and 2019 respectively.

AMD Pinnacle Ridge (Ryzen 2) & Matisse (Ryzen 3) CPUs Due In 2018 & 2019 On AM4
This latest leak comes courtesy of VCZ and details AMD’s computing products for the next couple of years on desktops and notebooks. Next year will see the the company introduce its Pinnacle Ridge family of CPUs as part of its 12nm LP refresh that we covered a few days back. These CPUs will be based on AMD’s Zen microarchitecture and will debut in the form of second generation Ryzen 2000 series processors.
In 2019 we’ll see AMD launch its first CPU products based on the Zen 2 core built on 7nm technology. Amazingly, these processors will be compatible with AMD’s current AM4 socket, so all current Ryzen owners will be able to seamlessly upgrade two years later without having to switch out their motherboards. A welcome change of pace in the market and a stark contrast to what Intel is doing.
Raven Ridge & Picasso APUs In 2018 & 2019 Respectively
On the APU side of the equation the roadmap shows Raven Ridge as the company’s 2018 product for notebooks, featuring up to 4 Zen cores and 11 Vega compute units. Raven Ridge is actually expected to debut in notebooks closer to the holiday season this year.

Succeeding it will be Picasso, AMD’s second generation APU based on the Zen microarchitecture. These processors, much like Pinnacle Ridge, will be refreshed parts built on GlobalFoundries’ new 12nm LP process technology. Both generations will also maintain compatibility with AMD’s AM4 socket on the desktop.

AMD CPU/APU Roadmap

 

[goldstone77]

AMD 12nm Ryzen 2 Pinnacle Ridge CPUs Launching In February 2018 Alongside X470 Chipset
By Khalid Moammer
6 hours ago

AMD has reportedly informed its motherboard partners of its plans to introduce the second generation Ryzen “Pinnacle Ridge” family of CPUs in February of next year. The new lineup will include 2000 series Ryzen 7, Ryzen 5 and Ryzen 3 microprocessors.

AMD 12nm Ryzen 2 “Pinnacle Ridge” CPUs Launching February 2018 Alongside New 400 Series Chipset
The new family of processors is based on the company’s Zen+ CPU microarchitecture, built on 12nm Leading Performance process technology at Globalfoundries. The company will begin the roll out of Pinnacle Ridge starting with Ryzen 7 in February, followed by Ryzen 5 and Ryzen 3 in March.
Low power Pinnacle Ridge processors are expected to be released in April and 2nd generation Ryzen Pro parts to be introduced in May. AMD expects to command 30% of desktop market share before the end of the first half of next year, the report claims.

Alongside AMD’s upcoming second generation Ryzen CPUs the company is also introducing a brand new 400 series chipset options, including X470 and B450. Motherboards based on the new chipset are expected to begin shipping in January in time for Pinnacle Ridge’s debut a month later.

 

[juanrga]

Which is the reason to develop a new chipset for Pinnacle Ridge and have it ready a month before Pinnacle Ridge launch if it is not "required" by Pinnacle Ridge? I take that DigiTimes information like meaning Pinnacle Ridge requiring a motherboard with a 400-series chipset.

Must I remark that AMD only mentioned that will use the same socket until 2019/2020. AMD never said anything about motherboards or chipsets. It is possible that AMD reuses the same socket but we see different chipsets and mobos for each family: 300-series for Summit Ridge, 400-series for Pinnacle Ridge, 500-series for Mattise...

And that roadmap is terrible! Pinnacle Rdige on 2018 and Zen2 Mattise for 2019 is just like expected, but Raven Ridge delayed to 2018 and Picasso still using four Zen cores in 2019 when we already have six-core CoffeLake this year... Wow!

 

[looncraz]

Which is the reason to develop a new chipset for Pinnacle Ridge and have it ready a month before Pinnacle Ridge launch if it is not "required" by Pinnacle Ridge? I take that DigiTimes information like meaning Pinnacle Ridge requiring a motherboard with a 400-series chipset.

Must I remark that AMD only mentioned that will use the same socket until 2019/2020. AMD never said anything about motherboards or chipsets. It is possible that AMD reuses the same socket but we see different chipsets and mobos for each family: 300-series for Summit Ridge, 400-series for Pinnacle Ridge, 500-series for Mattise...

And that roadmap is terrible! Pinnacle Rdige on 2018 and Zen2 Mattise for 2019 is just like expected, but Raven Ridge delayed to 2018 and Picasso still using four Zen cores in 2019 when we already have six-core CoffeLake this year... Wow!

Can't find the interview right now, but AMD actually said that the chipset was a client of the SoC rather than the other way around. Meaning they can swap chipsets all they want - it's just a PCI-e 4x device with a couple minor paths to the SoC.

The only factor will be BIOS support, IMHO.

BTW, Pinnacle Ridge is a bigger step from Summit Ridge than Piledriver was from Bulldozer (as a result of a process shift).

Piledriver (OR-C0) added ~400MHz, ~9% IPC, modestly reduced power draw, and more... despite being only one base layer update away from Bulldozer (OR-B2).

 

[jdwii]

Which is the reason to develop a new chipset for Pinnacle Ridge and have it ready a month before Pinnacle Ridge launch if it is not "required" by Pinnacle Ridge? I take that DigiTimes information like meaning Pinnacle Ridge requiring a motherboard with a 400-series chipset.

Must I remark that AMD only mentioned that will use the same socket until 2019/2020. AMD never said anything about motherboards or chipsets. It is possible that AMD reuses the same socket but we see different chipsets and mobos for each family: 300-series for Summit Ridge, 400-series for Pinnacle Ridge, 500-series for Mattise...

And that roadmap is terrible! Pinnacle Rdige on 2018 and Zen2 Mattise for 2019 is just like expected, but Raven Ridge delayed to 2018 and Picasso still using four Zen cores in 2019 when we already have six-core CoffeLake this year... Wow!

We will see juan but this time around i'm pretty sure as long as motherboard manufactures provide bios updates Ryzen 2 and 3 will work on X370 and B350 boards with bios updates its not asking much its already been done in Amd's history!

 

[-Fran-]

I really hope so. They have no reason, other than providing fixes and improvements that should be optional to customers if they want them (based on price), to be swapping MoBos for new CPUs.

Now, that being said, I'll still flip a table if they make the new MoBos required.

Cheers!

 

[juanrga]

Which is the reason to develop a new chipset for Pinnacle Ridge and have it ready a month before Pinnacle Ridge launch if it is not "required" by Pinnacle Ridge? I take that DigiTimes information like meaning Pinnacle Ridge requiring a motherboard with a 400-series chipset.

Must I remark that AMD only mentioned that will use the same socket until 2019/2020. AMD never said anything about motherboards or chipsets. It is possible that AMD reuses the same socket but we see different chipsets and mobos for each family: 300-series for Summit Ridge, 400-series for Pinnacle Ridge, 500-series for Mattise...

And that roadmap is terrible! Pinnacle Rdige on 2018 and Zen2 Mattise for 2019 is just like expected, but Raven Ridge delayed to 2018 and Picasso still using four Zen cores in 2019 when we already have six-core CoffeLake this year... Wow!

Can't find the interview right now, but AMD actually said that the chipset was a client of the SoC rather than the other way around. Meaning they can swap chipsets all they want - it's just a PCI-e 4x device with a couple minor paths to the SoC.

The only factor will be BIOS support, IMHO.

BTW, Pinnacle Ridge is a bigger step from Summit Ridge than Piledriver was from Bulldozer (as a result of a process shift).

Piledriver (OR-C0) added ~400MHz, ~9% IPC, modestly reduced power draw, and more... despite being only one base layer update away from Bulldozer (OR-B2).

We will see juan but this time around i'm pretty sure as long as motherboard manufactures provide bios updates Ryzen 2 and 3 will work on X370 and B350 boards with bios updates its not asking much its already been done in Amd's history!

I really hope so. They have no reason, other than providing fixes and improvements that should be optional to customers if they want them (based on price), to be swapping MoBos for new CPUs.

Now, that being said, I'll still flip a table if they make the new MoBos required.

Sorry but nothing of this gives me a valid answer. If they want to add extra features to customers they can simply develop a new chipset (e.g. a 390X) with extras not found in current chipsets and continue releasing current chipsets for Pinnacle Ridge. The production of a new family of chipsets, from B450 to X470, suggests me that new chipsets are mandatory for Pinnacle Ridge. Time will say.

I don't think the correct comparison is with Bulldozer--> Piledriver. Those are two different muarchs. The correct comparison is with Trinity --> Richland. Aka Pinnacle Ridge is a Richland-like refresh of Summit Ridge.

 

[looncraz]

Sorry but nothing of this gives me a valid answer. If they want to add extra features to customers they can simply develop a new chipset (e.g. a 390X) with extras not found in current chipsets and continue releasing current chipsets for Pinnacle Ridge. The production of a new family of chipsets, from B450 to X470, suggests me that new chipsets are mandatory for Pinnacle Ridge. Time will say.

I don't think the correct comparison is with Bulldozer--> Piledriver. Those are two different muarchs. The correct comparison is with Trinity --> Richland. Aka Pinnacle Ridge is a Richland-like refresh of Summit Ridge.

Holy fsck... where to start!?

1. A new chipset family ONLY denotes a new family of features and does not, in any way, denote socket incompatibility.
2. Piledriver is OROCHI C0. Bulldozer is OROCHI B2. They're practically identical - which is why AMD called Piledriver a stepping of Orochi.

Summit Ridge and Pinnacle Ridge are both ZEPPLIN. We already have Zepplin B2. We are just waiting for the new stepping (Pinnacle Ridge).

Update: For clarification

Orochi is the name of the Bulldozer/Piledriver 8-core die series. It has its own versioning system - a letter change in the first position denotes a base layer update (transistor layout) and a number change in the second position denotes a metal layer update.

Zepplin is the name of the Summit/Pinnacle Ridge 8-core die series. Same naming convention applies.

Bulldozer was a new ground-up design with lots of room for improvement - much of which was delivered upon by Piledriver just one year later.
Summit Ridge is a new ground-up design with lots of room for improvement - much of which should be delivered upon by Pinnacle Ridge in Q1 2018 - one year after the release of Summit Ridge.

Most large companies operate on a cadence - AMD is no exception, they just have had a lot of timeline slips.

 

[juanrga]

Piledriver is not a steeping of Bulldozer, but a different microarchitecture. The changes introduced are mentioned in the above slide.

On the other hand Pinnacle Rdige uses the same Zen microarchitecture than Summit Ridge. Pinnacle Ridge is Summit Ridge, but with higher clocks thanks to a more mature process. Just as Richland and Trinity used the same Piledriver cores, but Richland had higher clocks thanks to a more mature process.

 

[-Fran-]

Semantics... But in this case, I guess you're using them somewhat correctly. PD (FX8350) is to BD (FX8150) just like Thuban (PhenomII 1100T) was to Deneb (PhenomII 965BE). They are strictly speaking different uArchs, but essentially the same family of uArch that have more in common than not.

Like I said, there were instances where you could drop an 8350 in an unsupported MoBo and it would just work with a Beta or tweaked BIOS. I believe the same could be done for the Phenoms as long as you had the correct RAM support.

 

[juanrga]

Not semantics. Piledriver is a different muarch that increased the IPC, added new instructions, new turbo mode,...

Pinnacle Ridge uses the same Zen muarch than Summit Ridge. The IPC is the same, the instructions can execute are the same, turbo/XFR is the same...

 

[-Fran-]

Not semantics. Piledriver is a different muarch that increased the IPC, added new instructions, new turbo mode,...

Pinnacle Ridge uses the same Zen muarch than Summit Ridge. The IPC is the same, the instructions can execute are the same, turbo/XFR is the same...

Is that a confirmed fact or your belief?

 

[juanrga]

Not semantics. Piledriver is a different muarch that increased the IPC, added new instructions, new turbo mode,...

Pinnacle Ridge uses the same Zen muarch than Summit Ridge. The IPC is the same, the instructions can execute are the same, turbo/XFR is the same...

Is that a confirmed fact or your belief?

All AMD slides and roadmaps claim that Pinnacle Ridge uses the same Zen microarchitecture than Summit Ridge. So I take it so fact-like as Trinity and Richland using the same Piledriver microarchitecture.

There is no microarchitecture change until 2019 with Zen2.

 

[-Fran-]

Ok, fair enough.

I'm not fully buying they won't be tweaking things, but it is true they're explicitly saying the same "codename" for the CPU component in the slides.

 

[looncraz]

All AMD slides and roadmaps claim that Pinnacle Ridge uses the same Zen microarchitecture than Summit Ridge. So I take it so fact-like as Trinity and Richland using the same Piledriver microarchitecture.

There is no microarchitecture change until 2019 with Zen2.

I love to watch you be wrong sometimes. Other times it's just annoying.

So... you are saying that AMD is going to release the SAME EXACT PROCESSOR twice?

No, that's not even remotely logical.

Also, Bulldozer, Piledriver, Steamroller, and Excavator are ALL part of the same architecture family (15h). Bulldozer and Piledriver are BOTH Orochi CPUs with only ONE update between them.

Most of the improvements in Piledriver are SUPER minor and do NOT constitute an architectural shift (the clock mesh tech aside, perhaps).

The changes are:

Higher frequency (achieved by critical path optimization and clock mesh), lower power consumption (achieved by the aforementioned methods and hard-edge flip-flops), updated turbo implementation, updated IMC, repaired division hardware, update branch predictor (minor), improved scheduling (minor), additional instruction set support (basically just microcode), enlarged TLB...

Remember: that's just what they did in a year. Also, all AMD **REAL** slides simply show Pinnacle Ridge as "Zen." If a slide says "Summit Ridge architecture" it's most certainly fake or made by some low level idiot who doesn't know what an architecture is... there is no such thing as a Summit Ridge architecture in any of AMD's other slides or marketing... and the one slide that shows that has a couple other errors (a huge and obvious typo (k APU) and a false claim (Bristol Ridge using Polaris graphics).

Mark my words: Pinnacle Ridge will be a new stepping of Zepplin (same architecture as Summit Ridge) and will contain changes nearly as significant as those found from Bulldozer to Piledriver.

Why? Because AMD uses iterative IP blocks and synthesized design and we have numerous execs BRAGGING about how AMD doesn't do minor steps between generations.

Likely Pinnacle Ridge improvements:

Improved IMC
Improved scheduling
Improved turbo (Ryzen turbo is quite fussy)
Improved inter-CCX communication
Improved branch prediction
AVX and other instruction set support/optimization
Critical path optimizations
Tweaking for lower power
Tweaking for higher clocks
Decently revised process

Sound familiar?

 

[jaymc]

@Juan

You claim 100 to 300 clock speed increase I mean come on why would they release a new chip that is only 100mhz faster on a process designed for speed..

I'd say were looking at 400/500mhz increase at least..

@looncraz
I agree completely there's plenty to fix an upgrade for sure. it would be negligent not to do so... i would be shocked if they didn't especially with the competition coming from coffee lake. They may even increase transistor count the option is there wishful thinking I know.but we live in hope.

A 100mhz increase ridiculous lol...

 

[aldaia]

According to GloFo 12LP offers up to 10% performance increase, so I would expect somewhere in the 300-400Mhz freq increase.

Considering 1800X easily overclocks to 4.1GHz (there are reported cases hitting 4.2GHz and beyond but I wouldn't bet on that) it's 12LP implementation (will it be 2800X?) should reach 4.4-4.5 GHz.