GF100 (Fermi) previews and discussion

[rofl_my_waffle]

Honestly I was waiting for those GTX 480 before I bought a 5970 instead. At the current speculations that doesn't seem like a bad idea since the 480 is offered at such a premium and doesn't even seem faster.

I think Nvidia is going to have a hard time in the next quarter. Since they haven't annouced any plans for a mid range segment except the GT300 series which is just a rebrand of older cards.

 

[Mousemonkey]

GT300 series which is just a rebrand of older cards.

A die shrink and a hardware tweak, just like these 'new' 5 series cards which are just a die shrunk version of the 4 series with a hardware tweak.

 

[jennyh]

What 'hardware tweak' are you talking about? Double shaders, ROP's and higher clocks you mean?

 

[IzzyCraft]

architecture wise they aren't new, just minor continual tweaks and shrinks and respins of the R600 chip. But hey performance is performance.

Also jennyh you mean lower clocks don't cha~~~

 

[JAYDEEJOHN]

Much better MC, newer shader designs etc Im thinking
Having 2 rasters etc

 

[Mousemonkey]

But they are 'new' unlike the G300's which are a die shrink and DX tweak but just a 're badge'. So no double standards going on here eh?

 

[JAYDEEJOHN]

Im thinking new, or not off from last gen, but from this gen, and yes, this is factually correct, and some are even from 2 gens ago. Thats correct, no double standards
Die shrink holds, but not all sport GDDR5 do they? And DX11? New shaders as well? SM5? CS? HS?Anything like this type of new, or more like the older type of new?

 

[Mousemonkey]

40nm is not 55 or 65nm thus it's new, DX10 HW can't do DX10.1 thus it's new. Facts mate don't you just love 'em. 😉

 

[JAYDEEJOHN]

So, as i said, 40nm asside, the old "new" HW/SW

 

[Mousemonkey]

So DX10 cards can do DX10.1? Why all the talk of NV holding back game dev if their cards can do what is just a SW change then?

 

[JAYDEEJOHN]

Its a change to an old solution, its what Im saying, yes their HW needed to be upgraded to an old solution, nothing to go around bragging about tho

PS And Im sure thats why they were so quietly let into availability with out all the nVidia PR fanfare as well

 

[Mousemonkey]

Who's bragging? I just said that as it's a change along with the die shrink they cannot be called the same as as the G200b GPU's which you keep on insisting they are with all your re badgeing talk.

 

[JAYDEEJOHN]

No, not you, but nVidias quiet bringing forth of these "new" models of splenditure
Especially after their DX10.1 announcements of it being unimportant etc

 

[Mousemonkey]

As far as the general gaming public is concerned DX10.1 has been and continues be unimportant but the OEM's probably demanded these cards as part of contractual agreements made a long time ago which is why they are now being made, that and it was a way of testing the 40nm process just as ATi did with the 4770. You keep on suggesting that something underhand is going on and this is somehow being done to fool consumers but as the cards are only really going to the OEM's with the exception of a couple of low end retail parts, what's the big deal?

 

[notty22]

Heres some news .
[strike] http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/video/display/20100225062603_Lower_Cost_Fermi_Graphics_Processors_Due_in_the_Middle_of_the_Year_Nvidia.html[/strike] Lower-Cost Fermi Graphics Processors Due in the Middle of the Year – Nvidia.

Fermi is an entire architecture and it is a modular architecture that allows us to scale the feature-set depending on the market need. So, we will taping out and announcing a whole stack of Fermi products that will be very specific for computing at the very high-end of the stack and others will be targeted at desktops and personal computing,” added Mr. White.

 

[sabot00]

Only 8 months behind ATI!

 

[JAYDEEJOHN]

First off, DX10.1 when used is very helpful, or dont you think so?
Secondly, saying its unimportant, then doing it anyways is disengenuous and deceptive, unless, like I said, you dont think DX10.1 offers any perf increases in games that can use it?
Or, for that matter, W7?
Im hinting at a few things here, but we all know there wasnt a need to do this, and we also know it takes awhile to implement these things, and nVidia said not long ago of its worthlessness.
Many of these cards are G92 direct takeoffs, 1 I believe is a G200, the most expensive one.
If say, AC without the patch is run on these cards, Id like to see how worthless it is, or any DX10.1 game, tho I suspect we wont see this being benched, for obvious reasons.

Lets just call it another dirty little skeleton in nVidias closet

 

[TheGreatGrapeApe]

But they are 'new' unlike the G300's which are a die shrink and DX tweak but just a 're badge'. So no double standards going on here eh?

He didn't say G300, he said GT300, which really are just tweaks.

The G300 (ie GTX480) is different, and trying to equate the changes in HD5K to those in GT300 is ridiculous.

 

[IzzyCraft]

And the G92 is a tweak on the G80 which is as old as the R600, it just seems nvidia hit the wall on tweaking an old arch to get new performance from it much earlier then ati did.

 

[TheGreatGrapeApe]

Heres some news .
[strike] http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/video/display/20100225062603_Lower_Cost_Fermi_Graphics_Processors_Due_in_the_Middle_of_the_Year_Nvidia.html[/strike] Lower-Cost Fermi Graphics Processors Due in the Middle of the Year – Nvidia.

What happened to the statement that they would launch from top to bottom at the same time because it's so modular and scalable?

 

[EXT64]

I guess it crashed into the "midrange crowd doesn't need new tech" comment and resulted in a midyear release.

 

[JAYDEEJOHN]

I think their PR dept it put together with wood screws lately, or something

 

[EXT64]

Well, if it is put together with wood screws, it probably is very modular (and scalable, just take it to the table saw and voila, a little fermi).

 

[Mousemonkey]

First off, DX10.1 when used is very helpful, or dont you think so?
Secondly, saying its unimportant, then doing it anyways is disengenuous and deceptive, unless, like I said, you dont think DX10.1 offers any perf increases in games that can use it?
Or, for that matter, W7?
Im hinting at a few things here, but we all know there wasnt a need to do this, and we also know it takes awhile to implement these things, and nVidia said not long ago of its worthlessness.
Many of these cards are G92 direct takeoffs, 1 I believe is a G200, the most expensive one.
If say, AC without the patch is run on these cards, Id like to see how worthless it is, or any DX10.1 game, tho I suspect we wont see this being benched, for obvious reasons.

Lets just call it another dirty little skeleton in nVidias closet

Considering the rather small gap between Vista and W7, I don't think DX10.1 was worth it sorry.

He didn't say G300, he said GT300, which really are just tweaks.

The G300 (ie GTX480) is different, and trying to equate the changes in HD5K to those in GT300 is ridiculous.

The impression being given is that the G300's are just G200b cards with a different sticker on, which is not the case. That's what I've been trying to get across and the GTX4xx are being referred to as GF100 as well as NV60, G300, and GT300 but until one of the cards turn up and someone peels the HSF off I'm going to refer to it as GF100.

There will be one chip – GF100 – powering high-end GeForce GTX 470 and GeForce GTX 480 high-end graphics cards as well as Tesla C2050 and C2070 add-in computing boards

 

[TheGreatGrapeApe]

I agree the G300 =/= a refresh, buy the GT3xx series is, and despite others mistakes, we've been pretty clear in the difference which is why it seemed strange you would equate the two when he said GT300 the OEMs you know and not G300 what we'd been calling Fermi/GF100 for some time.