Nvidia GTX 1080, 1070 'Founders Editions' Just Reference Cards

[edward_23]

I'm guessing that Nvidia MSRP are paper price and actual product from partner will be equal to the founder price anyway. Asus strix, EVGA ACX, Gigabyte WF will all have 30% price hike and maybe there some basic product with cheaper cooling that closer to MSRP

 

[xyriin]

Well the reference design has the upside that all heat is blown out the back of the case. When the closed loop watercooler for the CPU does the same thing, this means that I have better temperatures on the air entering the fans. For all components.

Closed loop water cooling as an exhaust lol it should be intake. Also, I lol to having closed loop watercooling when you only own a GTX 1070 and that watercooling won't do crap to help over a better GPU.

If your place your radiator on the intake then sure, you'll have a slightly higher delta T due to the cooler incoming air and your water will go back to the component slightly cooler. However, you're now dumping all that heat you removed right back into the case surrounding the component you just cooled. Doesn't make much sense does it? Remove heat from the CPU and dump it right back around the CPU which makes the ambient temperature skyrocket. You don't remove any heat from the case in that scenario. Then you have to add additional fans to get even higher airflow in the case to reduce ambient temperature.

Now if you place the radiator as an exhaust all the heat from your CPU is going to be exhausted directly out of the case. In a radiator exhaust setup your ambient temps are also going to be much lower and this means the difference between room temperature air outside the case and ambient temperature inside the case won't be that different.

The added bonus for exhaust radiators? You need less fans in the case for airflow which reduces noise as well. The radiator exhaust setup is just more efficient unless you plan on having a wind tunnel in your case and want to spend more money on fans.

Most people who experience overheating issues typically don't overheat the CPU itself, more often it's ambient temperature related because they're dumping CPU and/or GPU heat right back into their case increasing all the temps across the board.

Also, while it's been ignored by many posters, the non-reference GPU cooler is a horrible setup for SLI because your top card is dumping all the heat onto the bottom card, not to mention there isn't great airflow for multiple fan exhausts anyway. There is a reason the back exhaust cooler is the reference design...it's made to work in SLI mode.

 

[grimfox]

Gigabyte teasing a custom cooler can match the founders card coolers. Factory OC gigabyte 1080's cards of 2Ghz+ should be out by June.

The default clock on the 1080 is like 2.1GHz. Maybe the cooler is better but honestly at 180W the standard blower type coolers and anything aftermarket, parts that were originally designed to handle 300W, should be more than capable of handling a 1080. Almost no design work required.

 

[Questors]

The official Fanboy version; for those with no objectivity and more money than sense.

 

[Jake Hall]

They should just call it them "Anal editions" cause they are basically shoving a big one up everyone butt who buys one.

Not overclocked and not even a binned GPU so we can be assured of good overclocks yet $100 higher for your reference cooler??

LOL Gimmie a break.

If there was an "Anal Edition" I certainly would be buying one

 

[Clamyboy74]

Typical business tactics from Nvidia, not supersonic that they want to earn even more money

 

[cheesemanx]

I look at this price setup and see a GTX 1080/1070 for $699/$449 with Nvidia allowing the board partners to offer budget version for less ($599/$379 respectively). Makes for an easier decision save money buy from someone else, you want the card as Nvidia intended buy a Founders Edition.

In the process of typing this a thought has occurred to me but how is this going to affect OEM card prices. Usually OEM cards have reference style coolers, but are sold at lower cost to builders, so will Nvidia allow the Founders Edition to be sold for less to builders allowing an even larger gap between prices?

 

[Andrew_130]

i knew that those greedy bastards couldn't go without some sort of scandal right out of the gate

 

[Guest]

Perfect buy is getting 2 x 1070 for $379 and put them in SLI. It is like getting two Titan X for the price of $379 each.

 

[Questors]

Well the reference design has the upside that all heat is blown out the back of the case. When the closed loop watercooler for the CPU does the same thing, this means that I have better temperatures on the air entering the fans. For all components.

Closed loop water cooling as an exhaust lol it should be intake. Also, I lol to having closed loop watercooling when you only own a GTX 1070 and that watercooling won't do crap to help over a better GPU.

If your place your radiator on the intake then sure, you'll have a slightly higher delta T due to the cooler incoming air and your water will go back to the component slightly cooler. However, you're now dumping all that heat you removed right back into the case surrounding the component you just cooled. Doesn't make much sense does it? Remove heat from the CPU and dump it right back around the CPU which makes the ambient temperature skyrocket. You don't remove any heat from the case in that scenario. Then you have to add additional fans to get even higher airflow in the case to reduce ambient temperature.

Now if you place the radiator as an exhaust all the heat from your CPU is going to be exhausted directly out of the case. In a radiator exhaust setup your ambient temps are also going to be much lower and this means the difference between room temperature air outside the case and ambient temperature inside the case won't be that different.

The added bonus for exhaust radiators? You need less fans in the case for airflow which reduces noise as well. The radiator exhaust setup is just more efficient unless you plan on having a wind tunnel in your case and want to spend more money on fans.

Most people who experience overheating issues typically don't overheat the CPU itself, more often it's ambient temperature related because they're dumping CPU and/or GPU heat right back into their case increasing all the temps across the board.

Also, while it's been ignored by many posters, the non-reference GPU cooler is a horrible setup for SLI because your top card is dumping all the heat onto the bottom card, not to mention there isn't great airflow for multiple fan exhausts anyway. There is a reason the back exhaust cooler is the reference design...it's made to work in SLI mode.

Radiators shouldn't pull heated air into them. That is akin to placing the bomb inside the bomb proof bunker. The purpose of the idea is defeated. A custom water loop will normalize and any heated air introduced into the case should have no significant impact in raising internal case temperatures. Experiencing significant rise of internal case temperatures can include insufficient exhaust fans, not enough radiator space for the cooling requirement, too little flow (gpm) through the loop(s), insufficient air CFM and/or insufficient fan air pressure to push enough air through the radiator(s). I am sure there are more reasons/causes that escape me at the moment. The best case (no pun intended) scenario is to move the rads into a rad box, into a pedestal, or otherwise outside the case to intake cooler external air and exhaust this air back into a larger external space.
If running a custom water cooled loop, the GPUs will most likely be under water like the CPU (& vice versa); the idea it is necessary to add a significant number of extra fans as pure exhaust is not realistic.

Both non-reference cooling solutions and reference blower style coolers, pick up hot air from inside the case to cool a hot running graphics chip. This is rather counter-intuitive from the start. Both types of solutions exhaust a certain amount of that hot air inside the case as well. A non-blower type solution will obviously dump a larger volume of air back into case. This is why proper air flow through a case is so important. A case and/or fans many not allow/provide enough air to flow through the case necessary to provide effective cooling, not to mention failing to eliminating dead air spots and properly exhausting the "used" hot air.
I have two 18 year old Antec cases (model 1080 AMG - one stock - one modded with dual top exhaust fans) utilizing only 80mm fans and both keep air cooled Crossfire/SLI configured GPUs within 2° - 3° F and allow for "normal" OCing on air. The modded case is about 3° to 4° F cooler in general.
My main rig consists of a CaseLabs Merlin ST10 on top of dual pedestals. One pedestal mounts two, 480mm rads and the other pedestal mounts two, 360mm radiators. Of course there is no problem with radiators dumping heat into the case. Prior to expanding the system into the pedestals, the ST10 case housed three, 360mm radiators in push-pull, all used as air intake with two 120mm exhaust fans – the power supply and one other fan. This caused no adverse air temperatures inside the case.

 

[spartanmk2]

So when do the actual Pascal units ship and not rebadged hardware?

 

[Darkbreeze]

If your place your radiator on the intake then sure, you'll have a slightly higher delta T due to the cooler incoming air and your water will go back to the component slightly cooler. However, you're now dumping all that heat you removed right back into the case surrounding the component you just cooled. Doesn't make much sense does it?

Makes a lot of sense, because unless you're using some crappy old case or one with very little cooling support, there should be no reason to not be using a sufficient quantity of quality fans in exhaust configurations that exchange the heated air inside the case, to the outside of the case, several times per second under high RPM fan operation. Since the card will be cooling with the water loop rather than using internal case air, it should be a non-factor.

The only time using a radiator configured for intake should be an issue is if you don't have adequate case cooling for whatever reason, most especially in the exhaust locations. As to how this might affect CPU cooling, depends on the type of cooling used for that, the case model and how many OTHER intake fan locations you have in addition to those being taken up by your GPU card loop.

 

[Martell1977]

So nVidia is taking notes from Apple, it's all about marketing. You can offer an average product, jack up the price and claim it's "Premium". If you fool even a few people, you will have made a nice chuck of extra money.

That being said, the price/performance looks like it will be pretty good on the aftermarket ones...not so much on the "ultimate fanboy editions".

 

[Darkbreeze]

I'm not sure how a product that doubles, or almost doubles, the performance of the previous standard card which in this case we'll call the 980 TI (Not a lot of people shelled out the money on a Titan, but a lot of people bought the 980 TI), for about the same money that card sold for at introduction, is or can be considered a rip off, but ok.

 

[lieutenantfrost]

I wish AMD would get their act together and create some price competition again. This pricing scheme is bordering on socialist.

 

[Johan Kryger Haglert]

No reason to buy reference especially since aftermarket are better and can be cheaper.

Better can be argued.
The "hairblower"-blower pushes the heat outside of the case and doesn't heat it as much which have got advantages too.

 

[ern88]

Think my i5 2500K @4.6 ghz with a 1440p@144 hz monitor won't bottleneck the new GTX 1080/1070 GPU'S?

 

[mrv_co]

Time (and benchmarks) will tell, but this sounds more like the "Suckers Edition" than a "Founders Edition".

 

[Mousemonkey]

Think my i5 2500K @4.6 ghz with a 1440p@144 hz monitor won't bottleneck the new GTX 1080/1070 GPU'S?

I might try one (or two) on my stock 2600k and four 1080 monitors, so let's hope not eh? 😉

 

[TechyInAZ]

Think my i5 2500K @4.6 ghz with a 1440p@144 hz monitor won't bottleneck the new GTX 1080/1070 GPU'S?

I might try one (or two) on my stock 2600k and four 1080 monitors, so let's hope not eh? 😉

I think it should bottleneck a core i5 sandy, but I'm not entirely sure. Now I'm curious though.

 

[doomtomb]

look. somebody worked really hard to make this new cooler look like a corvette. give nvidia a pay day, they need it!

 

[turkey3_scratch]

look. somebody worked really hard to make this new cooler look like a corvette. give nvidia a pay day, they need it!

IMO I'm not a huge fan of the Corvette style.

 

[IntelDiesel]

This
Custom Nvidia GTX 1080 Cards Teased By Gigabyte & Galax - 2Ghz Factory Overclocked 1080s On The Horizon?
http://wccftech.com/nvidia-gtx-1080-gigayte-galax-custom-cards-teased/

 

[knowom]

Aftermarket all the way for me cheaper and generally speaking better cooling for typical use. If your talking about a 3way/4way or great SLI setyo which incurs a lot greater overhead penalty sure a blower style fan cooler provided it's not a jet engine might be more ideal.

 

[rhysiam]

I'm not sure how a product that doubles, or almost doubles, the performance of the previous standard card which in this case we'll call the 980 TI (Not a lot of people shelled out the money on a Titan, but a lot of people bought the 980 TI), for about the same money that card sold for at introduction, is or can be considered a rip off, but ok.

But Nvidia did not really ever claim that it's double 980TI performance. This is a quote taken completely out of context that Tom's HW and other sites are now spreading around. I've left two comments now on the launch article requesting THW fix their misinformation, but it's not happening and people are being misled.

That specific "double performance" claim was related to Pascal's "special features", NOT overall performance. In fact, what Nvidia actually claimed was that it's faster than 980 SLI (so maybe 160-170% performance of the standard 980). Plus, Nvidia's own chart shown in the presentation plots "relative performance", and you can clearly see that they're talking something like 20-25% faster than 980TI/TitanX, and maybe 60-70% faster than 980. This is exactly what Anandtech have reported: http://www.anandtech.com/show/10304/nvidia-announces-the-geforce-gtx-1080-1070/2

I have no idea how Nvidia is calculating "relative performance", but you can bet for a marketing event like this that if they were genuinely expecting double 980ti performance overall, it would be reflected on their own slides.

We'll get full reviews with benchmark suites soon enough and we'll know for sure, but anyone expecting 2x980TI performance is going to be extremely disappointed and they can blame this site (along with others) for uncritically taking quotes out of context spreading nonsense.

The GPU has just over 7 billion transistors, fewer than a 980TI/Titan X. Sure it's clocked faster and the new architecture probably gets more done with less resources, but do we really expect that Nvidia has more than doubled performance-per-transistor?