News Pre-Launch 'Jedi: Survivor' Eats 21GB of VRAM, Struggles on RTX 4090

[bigdragon]

It's 2023. Why are people still pre-ordering EA games? Actually...why are people still pre-ordering AAA games in general? Every single release is unoptimized or broken. Every single one. Excessive VRAM use and performance problems are the things gathering headlines right now. We all know there is other stuff broken that hasn't been highlighted yet. The game will be "finished" via patches over the next 6 months and sale prices will hit in 3 weeks -- no need to pre-order.

 

[Colif]

one guy says he's getting 40 fps on a 2080 Ti with 3700x... he reviewed it with that hardware because most don't have a 4090 and that hardware is more baseline. Makes sense.

i bet I know that review... Skill Up. i watched it earlier

It's 2023. Why are people still pre-ordering EA games? Actually...why are people still pre-ordering AAA games in general? Every single release is unoptimized or broken. Every single one. Excessive VRAM use and performance problems are the things gathering headlines right now. We all know there is other stuff broken that hasn't been highlighted yet. The game will be "finished" via patches over the next 6 months and sale prices will hit in 3 weeks -- no need to pre-order.

its not a pre order if its free with CPU... that is where a lot are getting it from

 

[Deleted member 2838871]

It's 2023. Why are people still pre-ordering EA games? Actually...why are people still pre-ordering AAA games in general? Every single release is unoptimized or broken. Every single one. Excessive VRAM use and performance problems are the things gathering headlines right now. We all know there is other stuff broken that hasn't been highlighted yet. The game will be "finished" via patches over the next 6 months and sale prices will hit in 3 weeks -- no need to pre-order.

You're right. I never pre-order.

I did purchase CP2077 on release day... and have never played it. Ever... due to all the complaints it had at launch.

All I've done is install it and update patches. I am meaning to finally play it though soon after the most recent updates and the new PC build... just been busy playing other stuff.

i bet I know that review... Skill Up. i watched it earlier


its not a pre order if its free with CPU... that is where a lot are getting it from

Yep that's the review... and yeah... I definitely wouldn't have the game if I had to pay money for it. Redfall comes out in a couple days and I got that with the 4090. Haven't seen much about that game though but it looks cool.

 

[sreams]

It's less of an optimization problem and more of Nvidia being an utter cheapscake with their contemptible VRAM rationing. No new card should have less than 16gb VRAM these days, let alone a 700-plus dollar one.

"cheapscake"

Props. I love your new word.

 

[zx128k]

I think some people don't get that AMD cards appear to use more VRAM than nVidia ones. The videos I have seen so far show nVidia at 12-13GB and AMD at 15-17GB.

 

[razor512]

game doesn't use enough cores but I don't know if that will help reduce memory usage.

More games to come that use more vram as the devs swap from PS4 with 8gb to PS5 with up to 16gb.
The usage of this needs to be reduced in some aspects to work on console as they only have 16gb ram.

That behavior looks similar to games that had the double gut punch of denuvo + VMprotect where there would be 1 or 2 threads that would be pegged at 100% worth of 1 CPU core worth of time but hopping between cores thus every core looks to be underutilized, where that behavior ended up stopping when the DRM was removed.

 

[TerryLaze]

I think some people don't get that AMD cards appear to use more VRAM than nVidia ones. The videos I have seen so far show nVidia at 12-13GB and AMD at 15-17GB.

That's just down to how each company deals with the texture compression.
At least that would be my guess.
Example:

Announcing the NVIDIA Texture Tools Exporter 2020.1 | NVIDIA Technical Blog

We’re releasing the free NVIDIA Texture Tools Exporter, the new version of our DDS texture compression tool, available both as a standalone application and as a plugin for Adobe Photoshop.

developer.nvidia.com

 

[Phaaze88]

Gamers: Wants more and moar demanding visual eye candy.
Devs: Sure, we can do all that, we just need time to implement it all, and for playtesting.
Publisher: Doesn't give them the time, and probably not enough playtesters.

*game launches
Gamers: WTH, why does this run so poorly, etc...
Devs: Rush to put out a patch, because they weren't given enough time, and probably playtesters.
Publisher: monotone "We're sorry..." [Think of that one South Park episode]

This can't all be blamed on 'lazy devs' every time things go wrong. The more they need to add in, the more time they need. Plus, console has the same specs; just plain easier for them to work their magic.
The publisher is only going to wait so long, and - UGH, AAA games are more about the shareholders now. Not that they weren't before, but it's definitely worse than it used to be.

The consoles' unified memory is faster and more efficient than the PC's outdated separate one. So with 'all the bells and whistles' enabled on PC's slower throughput, more vram will be used to compensate.
Hmm... maybe that's one of the reasons Nvidia wanted their own cpus(ARM)? Nah, couldn't be...

 

[Richj444]

I actually downloaded it this morning to see if it would play ok on my system (I5-13500, RTX 3060 TI). But I never got that far; when I realized I couldn't remap the movement keys to my preferred option (arrow keys) I refunded it. Screw that.

 

[lmcnabney]

This is all very very very bad for PC gaming.

The hardware to run AAA games on PC is getting out of hand. We are now to the point that only a small minority of PC gamers have rigs that can run current games at resolutions over 1080. That is a pretty small market to do additional development on - which is why the PC version has not even been optimized yet. All of the resources are going into making sure the console versions are in top shape.

AAA games are going to get lower and lower sales as time passes due gamers not having expensive enough PCs and more of the market putting off the purchase for 6-12 months. That means low revenue from the developer's PC sales channel. We know what that leads to.

The return of console-only titles.

 

[TerryLaze]

The return of console-only titles.

Very doubtful, consoles being x86 means next to no porting cost and digital distribution means next to no cost for that, so there will be no reason for them to not release a game for PC because any amount of money they make from that will be profit.

 

[zx128k]

That's just down to how each company deals with the texture compression.
At least that would be my guess.
Example:

Announcing the NVIDIA Texture Tools Exporter 2020.1 | NVIDIA Technical Blog

We’re releasing the free NVIDIA Texture Tools Exporter, the new version of our DDS texture compression tool, available both as a standalone application and as a plugin for Adobe Photoshop.

developer.nvidia.com

Introducing Compressonator v4.3 - Brotli-G, multi-texture mipmap generation, and more

Compressonator v4.3 is out now! v4.3 features Brotli-G lossless compression, multi-texture mipmap generation, and much more.

gpuopen.com

Getting the Most Out of Delta Color Compression

DCC is a domain-specific compression that tries to take advantage of data coherence. It’s lossless, and adapted for 3D rendering. The key idea is to process whole blocks instead of individual pixels.

gpuopen.com

Lots more for AMD.

On memory compression,

NVIDIA Turing GeForce RTX Technology & Architecture

NVIDIA Turing architecture is the company's best-kept secret if it's indeed 15 years in the making. It comes together with the new RTX technology to fulfill the long-cherished dream of games: real-time ray tracing. We dive deep into the theory and background of the two and explore their possible...

www.techpowerup.com

Hell here's a video.

 

[Deleted member 2838871]

This is all very very very bad for PC gaming.

The hardware to run AAA games on PC is getting out of hand. We are now to the point that only a small minority of PC gamers have rigs that can run current games at resolutions over 1080. That is a pretty small market to do additional development on - which is why the PC version has not even been optimized yet. All of the resources are going into making sure the console versions are in top shape.

I saw some Steam data last week that said that the overwhelming majority of PC gamers (at least on Steam) are still gaming in 1080p.

LOL... I sure didn't build mine for 1080p... I built it for 4K 60 Ultra but to each their own.

The same 1080p users complain about GPU prices being out of hand... but what kind of GPU is needed to run at 1080p? Certainly not the 4090.

 

[lmcnabney]

Very doubtful, consoles being x86 means next to no porting cost and digital distribution means next to no cost for that, so there will be no reason for them to not release a game for PC because any amount of money they make from that will be profit.

x86 <> Windows

The performance penalty for Windows and the development / QC / and support are all real costs. The developers know the margins for different platforms. They also know that quite a few PC gamers also have consoles so they will only lose a fraction of the PC sales if they release to consoles alone.
This is also nothing new. The oughts were a wasteland of titles that didn't get a PC release. It took two years for Halo to get onto the PC. PS3 ports to PC were very few back then.

 

[lmcnabney]

I saw some Steam data last week that said that the overwhelming majority of PC gamers (at least on Steam) are still gaming in 1080p.

LOL... I sure didn't build mine for 1080p... I built it for 4K 60 Ultra but to each their own.

The same 1080p users complain about GPU prices being out of hand... but what kind of GPU is needed to run at 1080p? Certainly not the 4090.

Steam is an extremely broad market that has serious volume in 'casual' and outdated titles. My daughter's steam account has nothing purchased more stressful than Mass Effect.

I would like to see the same type of data for accounts that purchased AAA games released in 2022. What percentage of their user base fall into that category and what type of gear to they use.

 

[nerdvous]

What's strange and sad about this is that Respawn have generally been pretty good for PC. Titanfall 2 ran like a dream on my (by then already outdated) computer, able to hit 1080p60 at max settings, and three years later it could still handle Apex Legends. I wonder how much of that is to the credit of those being Source engine games...

 

[TerryLaze]

x86 <> Windows

The performance penalty for Windows and the development / QC / and support are all real costs.

Real costs that they can skip, that's my point, not that there is no cost for doing a proper conversion.

We get games sometimes where you can't even quit with the esc key but have to do a prolonged press to get to the main menu and sometimes there is not even a quit to desktop and you have to do an alt+F4.

 

[waltc3]

I learned my lesson after The Last of Us Part I on PC to never pre-order a single player game ever again. The list of pre-order performance fails of 2023 is so high right now: Hogwarts Legacy, Dead Space, Forspoken, Diablo IV, Wild Hearts, Jedi: Survivor, and the Last of Us Part 1. Averaging $63 each at launch, it is just too expensive to reward developers for lazy programming. There have always been a couple of poor performance AAA games each year but I do not remember so many issues since Ultima IX.

Also, this is not an issue of lack of VRAM. The 3090 and 4090 both have 24GB of VRAM and they still struggle to play this game. The issue is optimization and focusing too heavily on PS5 and XBox.

Seems like people would learn their lessons about pre-ordering. There's no reason to do it--there's no limit on the number of copies the publisher can sell, etc. It simply allows the publisher to put out a horrible console port like this one long before it's ready for release. If they were offering a ~50% discount on pre-orders, well maybe, as then it would make some sense. But they always want full pop for pre-orders. Crazy.

Don't feel bad, though. I bought Baldur's Gate 3 the first day it was available, thinking the full game would be ready in ~6 months. Man, was I ever wrong about that...

 

[oofdragon]

LOL I LOVE IT

It runs flawlessly at 4K 120fps on a 7900XTX, smooth like butter. If this is a AMD "sponsored" game even better, that only goes to prove "RT" is but a gimmick purposely built to slow down cards not from Nvidia. Funny enough the RT setting actually ads to FPS this time.... I wonder why lol

 

[Richj444]

LOL I LOVE IT

It runs flawlessly at 4K 120fps on a 7900XTX, smooth like butter. If this is a AMD "sponsored" game even better, that only goes to prove "RT" is but a gimmick purposely built to slow down cards not from Nvidia. Funny enough the RT setting actually ads to FPS this time.... I wonder why lol

Yep, proof positive.

 

[teodoreh]

In a galaxy far far away, Chris Sawyer wrote RollerCoaster Tycoon entirely in assembly.

 

[ManDaddio]

Sometimes I think people live in a bubble in their head and no nothing. While it is nice to have lots of VRAM in a GPU it should not be necessary to have lots of it to enjoy modern games.
I have several top tier GPUs but am not only annoyed but losing respect for developers in general. 8gb of VRAM should be plenty to play any game at 1080p on any GPU from the 10 series Nvidia or 5000 series AMD up to today.

More than 50% of gamers don't have high end gpus and likely most of them can't just run out and buy a new GPU to play an already expensive new game.

Developers have to make PC games be able to play on any reasonably specced PC. Not 16gb and up GPUs only. That's not very in touch with consumers.
And I also blame consoles and AMD for this problem as well as new game engines that are also not optimized for a broad spectrum of hardware.
Big companies buy out game studios and this is what you get. Less concern for consumers and more out of touch with gamers.

There are many very nice looking games that run fine and don't need even 8gb of VRAM.
Got to get back to making games on PC then port to console or have two teams with one making a console version and one making a PC version.
Yada,yada,yada.

 

[Colif]

Many of the new games that expect high specs are coming from new companies made up of ex employees of bigger companies. They may not have the budgets to support lots of formats at once.

This may be a bad port but in general large AAA companies will support as many formats as they can to make money.

the money is in consoles, they unlikely to swap back to making games on PC first.

 

[ManDaddio]

Honestly it's not my type of game either... but since it was free I'll give it a look.

At work looking at YouTube reviews now... one guy says he's getting 40 fps on 4K Ultra on a 2080 Ti with 3700x... he reviewed it with that hardware because most don't have a 4090 and that hardware is more baseline. Makes sense.

I'm not gonna pass any judgment until I see it for myself on my machine... because I've seen dozens of complaints about Hogwart's and Last of Us... and both run beautifully on mine at 4K 60 Ultra.

Even though a 2080ti can do 4k it really is just a 1440p GPU now. I have one and love it but it's old now. But developers should make games to be able to run on games from 10 series and newer. That is most gamers now.

 

[kerberos_20]

I saw some Steam data last week that said that the overwhelming majority of PC gamers (at least on Steam) are still gaming in 1080p.

look carefuly, 50% of users are china based where internet cafes are common