Discussion PSU recommendations and power supply discussion thread - Tom's hardware

[Darkbreeze]

Based on amazon link, it isn't manufacturer refurbished. Instead, it is:


For warranty period, it comes with 90 days.
For comparison, brand new RM650 comes with 10 years of warranty.

I wouldn't buy it.

Obviously, that's even worse than "manufacturer refurbished", because at least those units normally get like a 1 year warranty, but the difference in price between that unit and other units that come with FULL warranty, like I said before, MORE than justifies the extra expense. You WILL kick yourself as hard as possible, right in the ass-tronimical area, if you buy a refurb unit and it fails two days after the warranty expires. Besides which, you wouldn't buy a used car without knowing how many miles it has on it, and there is no way to know that with a power supply, which makes it a very risky proposition. Especially when it's not a manufacturer refurb unit.

 

[NightHawkRMX]

The fact that mining is big right now also adds another risk. Miners do not treat their power supplies very well, and the unit might have been abused.

For example, It is extremely often that I see PSUs on eBay with burned out modular ports caused by miners running like 20 GPUs off of a sata lead.

Often times the same people selling the clearly ex mining PSUs with burned ports are also selling completely dead PSUs, which I would assume we're killed by mining and excessive use.

 

[refillable]

I don't know if this has been discussed here before or not, but it seems that Seasonic has some new budget oriented PSUs up their sleeve:

https://seasonic.com/b12-bc

G12 GC

G12 GC

seasonic.com

I don't know what I think about them though, there are no internal shots of these. But I reckon these are similar in some way to the S12III?

 

[Rogue Leader]

I don't know if this has been discussed here before or not, but it seems that Seasonic has some new budget oriented PSUs up their sleeve:

https://seasonic.com/b12-bc

G12 GC

G12 GC

seasonic.com

I don't know what I think about them though, there are no internal shots of these. But I reckon these are similar in some way to the S12III?

Hopefully they are based off the old G series. Certainly the branding looks it but I guess we will see.

The S12 design needs to be taken behind the barn and shot already.

 

[refillable]

Hopefully they are based off the old G series. Certainly the branding looks it but I guess we will see.

The S12 design needs to be taken behind the barn and shot already.

What is interesting is that the new PSUs apparently are missing OTP and UVP, at least in the tech specs of the page. This might have been a mistake, though.

I will be really disappointed if it has the S12III design, but I lean towards it especially that it is on the same "group" of PSUs in their website and also the missing protections (though the S12III is missing OTP and OCP instead of OTP and UVP). The S12III has LLC and might be able to clear gold with few tweaks (not sure about their secondary topology, though).

It might be a decent competitor to the CX, MWE V2, and the TUF Bronze.

 

[Darkbreeze]

ANY unit missing common protections, from Seasonic, is a unit that I'd be VERY dubious about. Especially when it's a new or newER platform, with no excuse for it to not be there other than cost. Can't cost that much to include these, I've seen them on very much budget units from other OEMs on their cheap units so it seems like maybe it's Seasonic being too cheap, again, or an oversight on the page. Either way, makes for some head scratching for sure.

 

[refillable]

ANY unit missing common protections, from Seasonic, is a unit that I'd be VERY dubious about. Especially when it's a new or newER platform, with no excuse for it to not be there other than cost. Can't cost that much to include these, I've seen them on very much budget units from other OEMs on their cheap units so it seems like maybe it's Seasonic being too cheap, again, or an oversight on the page. Either way, makes for some head scratching for sure.

Yes, too bad Seasonic doesn't seem to care about their budget product right now... They could compete with the likes of Corsair, Cooler Master, and ASUS but they just blew it off with missing protection.

 

[NightHawkRMX]

Temp rating is decent. Full power at 40c, 80% at 50c. I believe the focus gold has the same rating.

 

[maxamillionfeettall]

In the video on their page, it briefly lifts the cover to the cg internals. It looks like there are some dc-dc boards, which is unlike the dual mag amp found on the s12III. The layout doesn't look like the s12III or focus lineup, and doesn't remind me of anything in particular.

 

[refillable]

In the video on their page, it briefly lifts the cover to the cg internals. It looks like there are some dc-dc boards, which is unlike the dual mag amp found on the s12III. The layout doesn't look like the s12III or focus lineup, and doesn't remind me of anything in particular.

Nice find! I'm so glad it isn't the S12III then. Probably a new platform altogether?

 

[Aeacus]

By the looks of it, it could be, where:

G-series -> G12 GC (80+ Gold), link: https://seasonic.com/g12-gc
M12II EVO -> B12-BC (80+ Bronze), link: https://seasonic.com/b12-bc
??? -> A12 (80+ White) non-US, with input of 200V - 240V, link: https://seasonic.com/a12

All three are fully-wired, where G12 and B12 have 5 years of warranty while A12 has 3 years of warranty.

 

[NightHawkRMX]

Just screen capped for anyone that doesn't wanna watch the video.

https://imgur.com/H7UhQPJ

View: https://imgur.com/H7UhQPJ


I see a mix of good and bad there. Sleeve bearing fan and the AsiaX cap isn't very reassuring, but I am pleased to see the105c Nichicon bulk cap, although 400v.

And I do see the DC-DC as well, but I wonder if it is double forward primary, and I lack the knowledge to identify that. That would just be my guess.
Edit, I should do research before saying things like that ^

In addition to being greatly efficient, the G12 GC units utilize the LLC resonant converter design...

This is from SeaSonics website ^

Will have to see a proper review before I judge it too much.

On another note, the A12 looks a bit like a turd. 240v only? I mean its not intended for north America but still.

 

[refillable]

By the looks of it, it could be, where:

G-series -> G12 GC (80+ Gold), link: https://seasonic.com/g12-gc
M12II EVO -> B12-BC (80+ Bronze), link: https://seasonic.com/b12-bc
??? -> A12 (80+ White) non-US, with input of 200V - 240V, link: https://seasonic.com/a12

All three are fully-wired, where G12 and B12 have 5 years of warranty while A12 has 3 years of warranty.

I don't know how you come up with that conclusion, the internal shots @maxamillionfeettall gave us doesn't indicate that.

Just screen capped for anyone that doesn't wanna watch the video.

https://imgur.com/H7UhQPJ

View: https://imgur.com/H7UhQPJ


I see a mix of good and bad there. Sleeve bearing fan and the AsiaX cap isn't very reassuring, but I am pleased to see the105c Nichicon bulk cap, although 400v.

And I do see the DC-DC as well, but I wonder if it is double forward primary, and I lack the knowledge to identify that. That would just be my guess.

Edit, I should do research before saying things like that ^

Will have to see a proper review before I judge it too much.

On another note, the A12 looks a bit like a turd. 240v only? I mean its not intended for north America but still.

Thanks for the screenshots! I didn't see big coil on the secondary line side there, so it should have LLC resonant converter. How did you get to know AsiaX caps? And yeah, the A12 is a turd.

Hopefully Aris will have his hands on one of these.

 

[Saga Lout]

IMHO, the words electricity and budget should not be seen in the same paragraph.

 

[Darkbreeze]

Why not?

"I really need to budget my money this month if I'm going to be able to pay for the electricity" seems to be a perfectly valid use of those two words in the same sentence, with no harm, no foul. JK

 

[Karadjgne]

IMHO, the words electricity and budget should not be seen in the same paragraph.

I dunno about that as a blanket statement, wasn't all that long ago that the go-to psu was the XFX Ts/pro 550w, a Seasonic GB, and at $25-$30 was most definitely in the 'budget' class of psu. The S12-II/M12-II 520w wasn't far behind either, being a staple for Seasonic for years.

 

[Aeacus]

I don't know how you come up with that conclusion

My conclusion is, that i think that those new G12, B12 series PSUs are spiritual successors to the previous gen PSU series (M12II EVO and G-series). E.g like S12III was a successor of S12II, albeit that was a huge flop.

 

[NightHawkRMX]

I am looking at a pico psu that lets you use a laptop power brick with a desktop.

What are you guys thoughts on these? Are they safe? Do any reputable brands make these, like Corsair or evga for example?

 

[Rogue Leader]

I am looking at a pico psu that lets you use a laptop power brick with a desktop.

What are you guys thoughts on these? Are they safe? Do any reputable brands make these, like Corsair or evga for example?

None of the "good" brands make one. Also most are pretty small, I think the biggest I've ever seen is like 300w.

Safe? Probably unless you try to drive the crap out of them. 300w isn't very much, unless they used astronomically garbage components, they should last. They are made for a very specific application (tiny system with no GPU).

 

[Darkbreeze]

I know of at least one person who has tried using one of these, resulting in a fire. That is a sample of one, and I have no other samples to include, so from my experience, it looks like a 100% failure rate. LOL.

Truthfully it totally depends, at least on paper, on the hardware. Some of those Alienware machines came with similar power supply solutions but very low power draw cards too.

 

[maxamillionfeettall]

The highest capacity model I've seen is a 384w from picobox(the advertised wattage is 500w combining all rails), and that has to use two power bricks as the unit has two rails at 192w each. The advertised wattage rating is kinda scummy and it's only rated at 25°C, but at least they mention that
"Forced air ventilation is required for load larger than 180 Watts. For fanless or improper ventilation operation, de-rate the output current of each rails by at least 30%."

But that's the largest I've seen.

 

[Rogue Leader]

Some of those Alienware machines came with similar power supply solutions but very low power draw cards too.

I don't think those were Pico though, I think they were proprietary.

The highest capacity model I've seen is a 384w from picobox(the advertised wattage is 500w combining all rails), and that has to use two power bricks as the unit has two rails at 192w each. The advertised wattage rating is kinda scummy and it's only rated at 25°C, but at least they mention that
"Forced air ventilation is required for load larger than 180 Watts. For fanless or improper ventilation operation, de-rate the output current of each rails by at least 30%."

This sounds like a solution looking for a problem.

 

[Darkbreeze]

Right, they are proprietary, but they are pretty similar in general.

To me, it's just a bad idea to run something on a power brick of any kind that really ought to be running off some kind of standard power supply. If it's really low power draw, like, without discreet graphics or with very low powered discreet graphics, then fine. I guess. Otherwise, it's definitely a problem looking for an opportunity.

 

[--SID--]

Just screen capped for anyone that doesn't wanna watch the video.

https://imgur.com/H7UhQPJ

View: https://imgur.com/H7UhQPJ


I see a mix of good and bad there. Sleeve bearing fan and the AsiaX cap isn't very reassuring, but I am pleased to see the105c Nichicon bulk cap, although 400v.

And I do see the DC-DC as well, but I wonder if it is double forward primary, and I lack the knowledge to identify that. That would just be my guess.
Edit, I should do research before saying things like that ^

This is from SeaSonics website ^

Will have to see a proper review before I judge it too much.

On another note, the A12 looks a bit like a turd. 240v only? I mean its not intended for north America but still.

Last week I opened up a B12.
It's a LLC platform from Helly Technology loaded with Ltec and AsiaX caps and a sleeve bearing fan from Yate Loon.
LLC controller is a CM6901T6X
Protection IC is a PS223
DC-DC controllers are APW7073

 

[NightHawkRMX]

Thanks for tearing it down.

Not impressed with the component quality to be honest.

The outgoing s12ii/m12ii were MUCH better in that regard.