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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz> wrote in message
news:tbpp91104urn2tna03gasa24ubmpguos11@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 31 May 2005 14:34:59 +0100, "Symbol" <jb70@talk21.com> carved
> upon a tablet of ether:
>
>>
>> "Christopher Adams" <mhacdebhandia@yahoo.invalid> wrote in message
>> news:1WDle.3043$BR4.1474@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
>>
>> > Tolkien, even Tolkien jazzed up by Jackson, just isn't my kind of
>> fantasy. Nice
>> > worldbuilding, I can appreciate the craft of it, but it does nothing
>> > for
>> me.
>>
>> That's fair enough. FWIW for gaming purposes it wouldn't be my cup of
>> tea.
>> I like darker settings and more ambigious heroes and villains. As novels,
>> however, I enjoyed them and I thought the extended versions of the movies
>> were excellent.
>
> How about a game set after the War of Ring, but in which Sauron wins,
> and has the One Ring? See
> <http://www.livejournal.com/users/whswhs/3061.html> for such a
> campaign background. Dark enough for you?

Nifty stuff. Ever check out the Midnight setting?

--
^v^v^Malachias Invictus^v^v^

It matters not how strait the gate,
How charged with punishment the scroll,
I am the Master of my fate:
I am the Captain of my soul.

from _Invictus_, by William Ernest Henley
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

Sea Wasp wrote:

(Games in Middle Earth where Sauron wins)

> I ran one of those, called Sauron's Triumph. Of course, it was
> EVENTUALLY Sauron's Failure, but it was about 500 years later that he
> finally Got His.

Now, I have a question. Is that because:

a) You honoured Tolkien's crypto-Catholic Evil Always Loses motif?
b) You feel Evil Always Loses (Eventually) yourself (bearing in mind I'm aware
of your lack of personal religious history)?
c) Because the Heroes Always Win (Eventually)?

--
Christopher Adams - Sydney, Australia
What part of "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn" don't you
understand?
http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/mhacdebhandia/prestigeclasslist.html
http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/mhacdebhandia/templatelist.html

Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the
leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked,
and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to
danger. It works the same in any country.
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

On Tue, 31 May 2005 21:08:41 -0700, "Malachias Invictus"
<capt_malachias@hotmail.com> carved upon a tablet of ether:

> > How about a game set after the War of Ring, but in which Sauron wins,
> > and has the One Ring? See
> > <http://www.livejournal.com/users/whswhs/3061.html> for such a
> > campaign background. Dark enough for you?
>
> Nifty stuff. Ever check out the Midnight setting?

Can't say that I have.


--
Rupert Boleyn <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz>
"Just because the truth will set you free doesn't mean the truth itself
should be free."
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

On Tue, 31 May 2005 21:08:41 -0700, "Malachias Invictus"
<capt_malachias@hotmail.com> carved upon a tablet of ether:

> > How about a game set after the War of Ring, but in which Sauron wins,
> > and has the One Ring? See
> > <http://www.livejournal.com/users/whswhs/3061.html> for such a
> > campaign background. Dark enough for you?
>
> Nifty stuff. Ever check out the Midnight setting?

Oh, and in case anyone is confised, I didn't write the setting I
linked to. William H Stoddard, author of several GURPS books, did -
that's his Livejournal page. He's put a number of his campaign
writeups up, and IMO they're all worth reading, if only for stealing
cool stuff from.


--
Rupert Boleyn <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz>
"Just because the truth will set you free doesn't mean the truth itself
should be free."
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

"Christopher Adams" <mhacdebhandia@yahoo.invalid> wrote in
message
news:Ucane.8715$BR4.3220@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> Sea Wasp wrote:
>
> (Games in Middle Earth where Sauron wins)
>
>> I ran one of those, called Sauron's Triumph. Of course,
>> it was
>> EVENTUALLY Sauron's Failure, but it was about 500 years
>> later that he
>> finally Got His.
>
> Now, I have a question. Is that because:
>
> a) You honoured Tolkien's crypto-Catholic Evil Always
> Loses motif?
> b) You feel Evil Always Loses (Eventually) yourself
> (bearing in mind I'm aware of your lack of personal
> religious history)?
> c) Because the Heroes Always Win (Eventually)?

These are all essentially the same answer "good guys win,
bad guys lose".

Maybe it was d) No person/group stays in power indefinitely.


--

-smithdoerr
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

On Wed, 1 Jun 2005 19:24:51 +0200, "smithdoerr"
<askmeforname@vodafone.it> dared speak in front of ME:

>
>"Christopher Adams" <mhacdebhandia@yahoo.invalid> wrote in
>message
>news:Ucane.8715$BR4.3220@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
>> Sea Wasp wrote:
>>
>> (Games in Middle Earth where Sauron wins)
>>
>>> I ran one of those, called Sauron's Triumph. Of course,
>>> it was
>>> EVENTUALLY Sauron's Failure, but it was about 500 years
>>> later that he
>>> finally Got His.
>>
>> Now, I have a question. Is that because:
>>
>> a) You honoured Tolkien's crypto-Catholic Evil Always
>> Loses motif?
>> b) You feel Evil Always Loses (Eventually) yourself
>> (bearing in mind I'm aware of your lack of personal
>> religious history)?
>> c) Because the Heroes Always Win (Eventually)?
>
>These are all essentially the same answer "good guys win,
>bad guys lose".

Replace "Heroes" with "Protagonists," and it becomes different.

--
Address no longer works.
try removing all numbers from
gafgirl1@2allstream3.net

--
Posted via NewsDemon.com - Premium Uncensored Newsgroup Service
------->>>>>>http://www.NewsDemon.com<<<<<<------
Unlimited Access, Anonymous Accounts, Uncensored Broadband Access
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

Christopher Adams wrote:
> Sea Wasp wrote:
>
> (Games in Middle Earth where Sauron wins)
>
>
>>I ran one of those, called Sauron's Triumph. Of course, it was
>>EVENTUALLY Sauron's Failure, but it was about 500 years later that he
>>finally Got His.
>
>
> Now, I have a question. Is that because:
>
> a) You honoured Tolkien's crypto-Catholic Evil Always Loses motif?
> b) You feel Evil Always Loses (Eventually) yourself (bearing in mind I'm aware
> of your lack of personal religious history)?
> c) Because the Heroes Always Win (Eventually)?
>

(D) Because the PCs did the right things at the right time. The
campaign was SET 500 years later, when the Baddies Were In Charge.
They didn't defeat Sauron directly, but they helped set up the chain
of events that brought down him and his two co-conspirators.

--
Sea Wasp
/^\
;;;
Live Journal: http://www.livejournal.com/users/seawasp/
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz> wrote in message
news:befq91l4t5iqeod6r5dfc59iahul8d4km2@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 31 May 2005 21:08:41 -0700, "Malachias Invictus"
> <capt_malachias@hotmail.com> carved upon a tablet of ether:
>
>> > How about a game set after the War of Ring, but in which Sauron wins,
>> > and has the One Ring? See
>> > <http://www.livejournal.com/users/whswhs/3061.html> for such a
>> > campaign background. Dark enough for you?
>>
>> Nifty stuff. Ever check out the Midnight setting?
>
> Can't say that I have.

It is pretty much "Middle Earth after Sauron wins" with the serial numbers
filed off. Fun setting, actually, especially if you like hopeless battles
against unbeatable foes.

--
^v^v^Malachias Invictus^v^v^

It matters not how strait the gate,
How charged with punishment the scroll,
I am the Master of my fate:
I am the Captain of my soul.

from _Invictus_, by William Ernest Henley
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

In article <429D1C50.3070800@sgeobviousinc.com>,
Sea Wasp <seaobviouswasp@sgeobviousinc.com> wrote:

> Rupert Boleyn wrote:

> > How about a game set after the War of Ring, but in which Sauron wins,
> > and has the One Ring?
>
> I ran one of those, called Sauron's Triumph. Of course, it was
> EVENTUALLY Sauron's Failure, but it was about 500 years later that he
> finally Got His.

I sketched out plans for a game to be titled Common Men, which was to be
about a group of Men who battled evil despite not being Numenorean
ubermenschen.

I was going to use the Iron Crown "Court of Ardor" supplement (set far
to the south and east of Gondor and Mordor) though, and respect the
novels' continuity by having the War of the Ring taking place in the
background.

--
Kevin Lowe,
Tasmania.
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

smithdoerr wrote:
> Christopher Adams wrote:
>> Sea Wasp wrote:
>
>> (Games in Middle Earth where Sauron wins)
>>
>>> I ran one of those, called Sauron's Triumph. Of course,
>>> it was
>>> EVENTUALLY Sauron's Failure, but it was about 500 years
>>> later that he
>>> finally Got His.
>>
>> Now, I have a question. Is that because:
>>
>> a) You honoured Tolkien's crypto-Catholic Evil Always
>> Loses motif?
>> b) You feel Evil Always Loses (Eventually) yourself
>> (bearing in mind I'm aware of your lack of personal
>> religious history)?
>> c) Because the Heroes Always Win (Eventually)?
>
> These are all essentially the same answer "good guys win,
> bad guys lose".

Yes, I know - but what I'm interested in is Sea Wasp's reasons *why* that's so.

--
Christopher Adams - Sydney, Australia
What part of "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn" don't you
understand?
http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/mhacdebhandia/prestigeclasslist.html
http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/mhacdebhandia/templatelist.html

Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the
leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked,
and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to
danger. It works the same in any country.
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

Sea Wasp wrote:
> Christopher Adams wrote:
>> Sea Wasp wrote:
>>
>> (Games in Middle Earth where Sauron wins)
>>
>>> I ran one of those, called Sauron's Triumph. Of course, it was
>>> EVENTUALLY Sauron's Failure, but it was about 500 years later that he
>>> finally Got His.
>>
>>
>> Now, I have a question. Is that because:
>>
>> a) You honoured Tolkien's crypto-Catholic Evil Always Loses motif?
>> b) You feel Evil Always Loses (Eventually) yourself (bearing in mind
>> I'm aware of your lack of personal religious history)?
>> c) Because the Heroes Always Win (Eventually)?
>
> (D) Because the PCs did the right things at the right time. The
> campaign was SET 500 years later, when the Baddies Were In Charge.
> They didn't defeat Sauron directly, but they helped set up the chain
> of events that brought down him and his two co-conspirators.

Hmm. For some reason, I never picked you as the kind of person who'd run games
where there's a serious chance the bad guys could Really, Really Win.

--
Christopher Adams - Sydney, Australia
What part of "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn" don't you
understand?
http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/mhacdebhandia/prestigeclasslist.html
http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/mhacdebhandia/templatelist.html

Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the
leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked,
and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to
danger. It works the same in any country.
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz> wrote in message
news:tbpp91104urn2tna03gasa24ubmpguos11@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 31 May 2005 14:34:59 +0100, "Symbol" <jb70@talk21.com> carved
> upon a tablet of ether:
>
> >
> > "Christopher Adams" <mhacdebhandia@yahoo.invalid> wrote in message
> > news:1WDle.3043$BR4.1474@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> >
> > > Tolkien, even Tolkien jazzed up by Jackson, just isn't my kind of
> > fantasy. Nice
> > > worldbuilding, I can appreciate the craft of it, but it does nothing
for
> > me.
> >
> > That's fair enough. FWIW for gaming purposes it wouldn't be my cup of
tea.
> > I like darker settings and more ambigious heroes and villains. As
novels,
> > however, I enjoyed them and I thought the extended versions of the
movies
> > were excellent.
>
> How about a game set after the War of Ring, but in which Sauron wins,
> and has the One Ring? See
> <http://www.livejournal.com/users/whswhs/3061.html> for such a
> campaign background. Dark enough for you?

Pretty good but there are still elements that aren't my cup of tea like a
totally polarised good and evil. IMC I have a relaxed view on alignment
and but for one Kingdom dominated by an order of Paladins freely mix and
work towards joint ends (and their own). There is, for example, an order
of primarily Lawful Evil Clerics and Monks who act in an inquisitor role
and are present in all but the Paladin controlled Kingdom. They are
tolerated because they hunt undead who are a major bane in my campaign.
(They are associated with a God of the Underworld and believe that souls
of the dead should be delivered to him rather than trapped in undeath).
They constitute the single, largest religion.

Another nation is virtually run by a secret police force composed of a
mixture of Wizards, Rogues, Fighters and Multiclass variants. The force
contains large numbers of goods and neutrals but is so concerned with
monitoring external threats that the internal situation is frequently
neglected. In the Northerly independent states strong and sometimes
tyrannical warlords are tolerated because they act as a buffer against
threats from humanoids and giants but they have also gained control of
trade with the Dwarves who are the only race with access to uncorrupted
Adamantine (they're like the Marcher lords in Medieval Europe).

At the same time you have a Sauron type villain in an ancient triumvirate
containing a Lich Wizard, Lich Cleric and Vampiric Fallen Paladin
Blackguard. They are the only epic level characters in the game but are
simultaneously attempting to control the Prime Material and hold back
potential rivals from the outer planes. They live in a part of the world
inhospitable to the living (the result of an ancient accident) and are
virtually unknown. Below them villains are often former allies and vice
versa, it is much less clear cut because the overriding problem (a hole
which is allowing the Negative Energy Plane to seep in and spread undeath)
frequently changes the status quo.
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

Christopher Adams wrote:
> Sea Wasp wrote:
>
>>Christopher Adams wrote:
>>
>>>Sea Wasp wrote:
>>>
>>>(Games in Middle Earth where Sauron wins)
>>>
>>>
>>>>I ran one of those, called Sauron's Triumph. Of course, it was
>>>>EVENTUALLY Sauron's Failure, but it was about 500 years later that he
>>>>finally Got His.
>>>
>>>
>>>Now, I have a question. Is that because:
>>>
>>>a) You honoured Tolkien's crypto-Catholic Evil Always Loses motif?
>>>b) You feel Evil Always Loses (Eventually) yourself (bearing in mind
>>>I'm aware of your lack of personal religious history)?
>>>c) Because the Heroes Always Win (Eventually)?
>>
>>(D) Because the PCs did the right things at the right time. The
>>campaign was SET 500 years later, when the Baddies Were In Charge.
>>They didn't defeat Sauron directly, but they helped set up the chain
>>of events that brought down him and his two co-conspirators.
>
>
> Hmm. For some reason, I never picked you as the kind of person who'd run games
> where there's a serious chance the bad guys could Really, Really Win.
>

On paper, there's always a chance. In short term, they DO win
sometimes. The players can take some comfort in the idea that some
other group of good guys will eventually beat the baddie, but they can
lose if they screw up too badly, or -- in the case of the
just-concluded campaign -- if they just do mediocre. That campaign
reached power levels I've never done before and may never do again.
I'm now temporarily retired from GM'ing (well, I have one PBEM still
going, but that's different) due to that game. I can't follow that one
up with anything for a while; that was The Grand Finale, and the
players agreed. They'll be running me for a while.

As to why I see evil as EVENTUALLY losing, because it's inherently
destructive and inherently uncooperative.

--
Sea Wasp
/^\
;;;
Live Journal: http://www.livejournal.com/users/seawasp/
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

On Thu, 02 Jun 2005 08:30:24 GMT, "Christopher Adams"
<mhacdebhandia@yahoo.invalid> wrote:

>smithdoerr wrote:
>> Christopher Adams wrote:
>>> Sea Wasp wrote:
>>
>>> (Games in Middle Earth where Sauron wins)
>>>
>>>> I ran one of those, called Sauron's Triumph. Of course,
>>>> it was
>>>> EVENTUALLY Sauron's Failure, but it was about 500 years
>>>> later that he
>>>> finally Got His.
>>>
>>> Now, I have a question. Is that because:
>>>
>>> a) You honoured Tolkien's crypto-Catholic Evil Always
>>> Loses motif?
>>> b) You feel Evil Always Loses (Eventually) yourself
>>> (bearing in mind I'm aware of your lack of personal
>>> religious history)?
>>> c) Because the Heroes Always Win (Eventually)?
>>
>> These are all essentially the same answer "good guys win,
>> bad guys lose".
>
>Yes, I know - but what I'm interested in is Sea Wasp's reasons *why* that's so.
>

I can think of a few alternatives to those options.

For example:

Evil doesn't always lose but I like seeing it lose.

The players decided to oppose Sauron and it would be no fun for them
if all their efforts came to naught.
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

On Wed, 1 Jun 2005 23:33:07 -0700, "Malachias Invictus"
<capt_malachias@hotmail.com> wrote:

>
>"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz> wrote in message
>news:befq91l4t5iqeod6r5dfc59iahul8d4km2@4ax.com...
>> On Tue, 31 May 2005 21:08:41 -0700, "Malachias Invictus"
>> <capt_malachias@hotmail.com> carved upon a tablet of ether:
>>
>>> > How about a game set after the War of Ring, but in which Sauron wins,
>>> > and has the One Ring? See
>>> > <http://www.livejournal.com/users/whswhs/3061.html> for such a
>>> > campaign background. Dark enough for you?
>>>
>>> Nifty stuff. Ever check out the Midnight setting?
>>
>> Can't say that I have.
>
>It is pretty much "Middle Earth after Sauron wins" with the serial numbers
>filed off.

Which is probably better since it gets you past the "No spellcasters
in Middle Earth" problem.
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

"David Johnston" <rgorman@telusplanet.net> wrote in message
news:429eae93.1292135@news.telusplanet.net...
> On Wed, 1 Jun 2005 23:33:07 -0700, "Malachias Invictus"
> <capt_malachias@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz> wrote in message
>>news:befq91l4t5iqeod6r5dfc59iahul8d4km2@4ax.com...
>>> On Tue, 31 May 2005 21:08:41 -0700, "Malachias Invictus"
>>> <capt_malachias@hotmail.com> carved upon a tablet of ether:
>>>
>>>> > How about a game set after the War of Ring, but in which Sauron wins,
>>>> > and has the One Ring? See
>>>> > <http://www.livejournal.com/users/whswhs/3061.html> for such a
>>>> > campaign background. Dark enough for you?
>>>>
>>>> Nifty stuff. Ever check out the Midnight setting?
>>>
>>> Can't say that I have.
>>
>>It is pretty much "Middle Earth after Sauron wins" with the serial numbers
>>filed off.
>
> Which is probably better since it gets you past the "No spellcasters
> in Middle Earth" problem.

However, spellcasters have a rough time. They are hunted by default, and
more or less under a death sentence if ever caught.

--
^v^v^Malachias Invictus^v^v^

It matters not how strait the gate,
How charged with punishment the scroll,
I am the Master of my fate:
I am the Captain of my soul.

from _Invictus_, by William Ernest Henley
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

On Thu, 2 Jun 2005 10:36:02 -0700, "Malachias Invictus"
<capt_malachias@hotmail.com> wrote:

>
>"David Johnston" <rgorman@telusplanet.net> wrote in message
>news:429eae93.1292135@news.telusplanet.net...
>> On Wed, 1 Jun 2005 23:33:07 -0700, "Malachias Invictus"
>> <capt_malachias@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz> wrote in message
>>>news:befq91l4t5iqeod6r5dfc59iahul8d4km2@4ax.com...
>>>> On Tue, 31 May 2005 21:08:41 -0700, "Malachias Invictus"
>>>> <capt_malachias@hotmail.com> carved upon a tablet of ether:
>>>>
>>>>> > How about a game set after the War of Ring, but in which Sauron wins,
>>>>> > and has the One Ring? See
>>>>> > <http://www.livejournal.com/users/whswhs/3061.html> for such a
>>>>> > campaign background. Dark enough for you?
>>>>>
>>>>> Nifty stuff. Ever check out the Midnight setting?
>>>>
>>>> Can't say that I have.
>>>
>>>It is pretty much "Middle Earth after Sauron wins" with the serial numbers
>>>filed off.
>>
>> Which is probably better since it gets you past the "No spellcasters
>> in Middle Earth" problem.
>
>However, spellcasters have a rough time. They are hunted by default, and
>more or less under a death sentence if ever caught.

<shrug> I'd expect the entire group to be hunted criminals in a world
like that anyway.
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

"David Johnston" <rgorman@telusplanet.net> wrote in message
news:429eeb3b.5257559@news.telusplanet.net...
> On Thu, 2 Jun 2005 10:36:02 -0700, "Malachias Invictus"
> <capt_malachias@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>"David Johnston" <rgorman@telusplanet.net> wrote in message
>>news:429eae93.1292135@news.telusplanet.net...
>>> On Wed, 1 Jun 2005 23:33:07 -0700, "Malachias Invictus"
>>> <capt_malachias@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz> wrote in message
>>>>news:befq91l4t5iqeod6r5dfc59iahul8d4km2@4ax.com...
>>>>> On Tue, 31 May 2005 21:08:41 -0700, "Malachias Invictus"
>>>>> <capt_malachias@hotmail.com> carved upon a tablet of ether:
>>>>>
>>>>>> > How about a game set after the War of Ring, but in which Sauron
>>>>>> > wins,
>>>>>> > and has the One Ring? See
>>>>>> > <http://www.livejournal.com/users/whswhs/3061.html> for such a
>>>>>> > campaign background. Dark enough for you?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Nifty stuff. Ever check out the Midnight setting?
>>>>>
>>>>> Can't say that I have.
>>>>
>>>>It is pretty much "Middle Earth after Sauron wins" with the serial
>>>>numbers
>>>>filed off.
>>>
>>> Which is probably better since it gets you past the "No spellcasters
>>> in Middle Earth" problem.
>>
>>However, spellcasters have a rough time. They are hunted by default, and
>>more or less under a death sentence if ever caught.
>
> <shrug> I'd expect the entire group to be hunted criminals in a world
> like that anyway.

Yes, but there are special creatures that specifically target arcanists
(incidentally, *anyone* can cast spells if they take the feats - Wizard is a
Prestige Class).

--
^v^v^Malachias Invictus^v^v^

It matters not how strait the gate,
How charged with punishment the scroll,
I am the Master of my fate:
I am the Captain of my soul.

from _Invictus_, by William Ernest Henley
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

On Thu, 02 Jun 2005 08:30:24 GMT, "Christopher Adams"
<mhacdebhandia@yahoo.invalid> wrote:

>smithdoerr wrote:
>> These are all essentially the same answer "good guys win,
>> bad guys lose".
>
>Yes, I know - but what I'm interested in is Sea Wasp's reasons *why* that's so.

Does there need to be a reason beyond, "It makes a good story?"
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

On Fri, 03 Jun 2005 00:00:09 GMT, Chad Lubrecht
<chad.lubrecht@verizon.net> dared speak in front of ME:

>On Thu, 02 Jun 2005 08:30:24 GMT, "Christopher Adams"
><mhacdebhandia@yahoo.invalid> wrote:
>
>>smithdoerr wrote:
>>> These are all essentially the same answer "good guys win,
>>> bad guys lose".
>>
>>Yes, I know - but what I'm interested in is Sea Wasp's reasons *why* that's so.
>
>Does there need to be a reason beyond, "It makes a good story?"

Actually, yes. Not everything that makes for a good story will make
for a good game.

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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

Chad Lubrecht wrote:
> Christopher Adams wrote:
>> smithdoerr wrote:
>
>>> These are all essentially the same answer "good guys win,
>>> bad guys lose".
>>
>> Yes, I know - but what I'm interested in is Sea Wasp's reasons *why*
>> that's so.
>
> Does there need to be a reason beyond, "It makes a good story?"

Absolutely. Besides, I happen to know - from long acquaintance - that if there's
one thing Sea Wasp demands from himself, it's consistency. Therefore, I knew
there would be *some* reason.

--
Christopher Adams - Sydney, Australia
What part of "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn" don't you
understand?
http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/mhacdebhandia/prestigeclasslist.html
http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/mhacdebhandia/templatelist.html

Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the
leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked,
and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to
danger. It works the same in any country.
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

Chad Lubrecht wrote:
> On 27 May 2005 15:01:21 -0700, julian814@hotmail.com wrote:
>>Someone has been trying to tell me that Palpatine said he didn't know
>>how to save people from dying. I seem to remember that he suggested he
>>might know, and never let Anakin think that he didn't. Anyone know
>>who's right, here?
> After Annakin agreed to be his apprentice, Palpatine said that only
> one person ever had that power, but with the two of them working
> together he knew they would be able to rediscover the secret.

Wasn't he refering to his former Master? The one he probably killed before he
figured out the secret to immortality.
--
"... respect, all good works are not done by only good folk. For here, at the
end of all things, we shall do what needs to be done."
--till next time, Jameson Stalanthas Yu -x- <<poetry.dolphins-cove.com>>
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

Terry Austin wrote:
> Perhaps. That isn't always very easy to do. They could, for Buddy Epsen in
> the Wizard of Oz, but then, they'd have had to anyway, since the makeup in
> that case would certainly have killed him. But delays in filming are *very*
> expensive, and contracts are contracts, and there are many reasons why
> reducing the part might have been a better idea.

Speaking of characters, the guy who played the hobbits to scale when with
humans, he's also been used in the upcoming Charlie and the Chocolate Factory
movie with Johhny Depp, and they had to dupe him for 10 different parts.
--
"... respect, all good works are not done by only good folk. For here, at the
end of all things, we shall do what needs to be done."
--till next time, Jameson Stalanthas Yu -x- <<poetry.dolphins-cove.com>>
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

Matt Frisch wrote:
> On Sun, 29 May 2005 03:13:25 -0000, Terry Austin <taustin@hyperbooks.com>
>>>>Not everyone agrees with that. It is conventional wisdom that you
>>>>_must_ have a romantic interest for your hero, in an action film.
>>>T2 seemed to do pretty well without it...but then that's Cameron.
>>Sara Conner sorta filled that spot, if you don't look too close.
> With...who? The Terminator? They clipped out the scene with Reese in it.

T2 and whatshisname, the kid. :) Freakin template for Michale Jackson.
--
"... respect, all good works are not done by only good folk. For here, at the
end of all things, we shall do what needs to be done."
--till next time, Jameson Stalanthas Yu -x- <<poetry.dolphins-cove.com>>
 
Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

No 33 Secretary wrote:
> ~consul <consul@INVALIDdolphins-cove.com> wrote in
> news:d82kv2$p71$2@gist.usc.edu:

> > Wasn't he refering to his former Master? The one he probably killed
> > before he figured out the secret to immortality.
>
> That's what he implied, but he never said directly that the "apprentice who
> killed his master" was himself.

The actual existence of any such Master strikes me as highly
questionable. Why should WE (as opposed to Anakin) believe
Palpatine? The story works just as well if it is all lies, and
we know Palpatine is willing to lie.

OTOH Anakin believing Palpatine is fine. As far as I'm concerned
Yoda's little speech about the virtues of anyone Anakin cares
about dieing in agony finally and fully explain why the Jedi let
his mother die.

Given that he obviously can't trust the Jedi's advice or aid
Anakin has little choice but to try trusting someone or something
else. Shame he picks another villian and causes a self-fufilling
prophesy, but he TRIED doing nothing last time, presumably on
advice from the same people he now knows cared nothing for his
desires.

DougL
 
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