[SOLVED] Wanting to upgrade graphic card... wise / worth it?

[hondoman]

Right then,

I have a PC I built connected to a flat screen TV in my living room. I use it mostly to watch the odd movie on the weekends and has done me well. Not long after I set it up, I got hooked on the ESO game. I play about three - four time per week for about 2 hours, maybe three. Does this make this 59 years old lad a gamer? The other night I noticed that the graphics were set at low. I set it to medium and after a rather long wait, I was playing again. The graphics were defo stunning, but the game lagged - badly! I set it back to low. The PC also has 8GB of RAM.

The Mainboard in the PC is an MSI A320M-A Pro Max, more of an office type board. According to CPU-ID, it has an onboard 2GB graphic. The board has only one expansion slot - 1 x PCI-E 2.0

Is it worth it to upgrade to a 4GB card, such as an NVIDIA GeForce GTX (or a GT) with GDDR5 or GDDR6, PCIe 2.0 x16? These cards won't break the bank, but I do wonder if it will make any difference?

Cheers!

 

[boju]

Hi gamer 🤘

If this is your motherboard, https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/A320M-A-PRO-MAX/Specification it has pcie 3 slot and you have options regardless if it were pcie 2 anyhow.

The limiting factor here is lack of information regarding the power supply that's in it and cpu. Might as well include all specs including if this is a pre-built and from which company, if 8gb ram is made up of two or a single stick of ram and other details regarding case, for dimensions etc.

Being an Amd Ryzen system, dual channel ram, two working together does improve performance. Not implying you should spend more but exploring your recent discoveries might extend to further upgrades.

Most importantly is power supply and what it's capable of will determine which graphics card is suitable or if you need to upgrade power supply too. If not sure then take a photo of description label.

Integrated graphics has never been all that great so you'll be quite impressed what's possible given the right hardware.

 

[Tac 25]

would definitely make a difference if you put a 1050ti in there. The lag should greatly lessen or disappear completely.

what PSU do you have installed there?

 

[hondoman]

Hi gamer 🤘

If this is your motherboard, https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/A320M-A-PRO-MAX/Specification it has pcie 3 slot and you have options regardless if it were pcie 2 anyhow.

I hope the photos answer your questions. The PC I built, meaning I bought the components I wanted and installed them. Thinking on it, the power supply was the one item I did not replace. So, if memory serves, it's about 7 year old. Not only due to age, but at only 350W, and regardless of new graphic card, I might want a new one with a slightly higher output 450 or 500W.

Thoughts?

Cheers!

would definitely make a difference if you put a 1050ti in there. The lag should greatly lessen or disappear completely.

what PSU do you have installed there?

PSU info below.

The 1050ti would suit. Cheers!

https://imgur.com/a/c6IOyON

View: https://imgur.com/a/c6IOyON

 

[geofelt]

The first suggestion is to look in the bios for a setting that determines how much system ram to allocate to graphics.
The max is 2gb. The default may be much less than that.
Setting to 2gb is best for graphics, but that may impact the rest of your system.

Regardless, try to upgrade the ram to dual channel and likely 16gb.
The performance of integrated graphics is highly dependent on fast ram.
dual channel operation effectively doubles ram speed.

You could try adding another 8gb stick of the ram you now have.
But, ram must be matched to operate properly so just adding 8gb may not work.
Ryzen is particularly sensitive to ram.
It might be best to buy a 2 x 8gb kit.

Your current psu should be sufficient to add a graphics card that does not need aux 6 or 8 pin power from the psu.
The pcie slot can deliver up to 75w.
The GTX1050ti is about the strongest that would work.

Past that, you need a stronger psu.
Here is a handy chart of your options:
http://www.realhardtechx.com/index_archivos/Page362.htm

If you do buy a new psu, DO NOT buy a cheap unit.
Look for at least a 5 year warranty, preferably 7 years.

 

[Avro Arrow]

I guess that it would depend on what you want, what you want to spend and whether you want to buy new or used.

I don't know where you live so I won't get into used parts because that will change based on where you are, what day it is, etc. It's all over the place and is impossible to be accurate so I'll stick with new parts and use USA prices.

I saw someone mention the GTX 1050 Ti and yes, that would be better than the IGP that you're using but it's objectively a bad value and I can prove it.

The GTX 1050 Ti has a TDP of 75W and costs at least $185. That 75W is good because it means that it doesn't need an auxillary power connector from your PSU and draws all it needs from the PCI-Express slot on your motherboard.

The problem arises when you consider that the RX 6400 has a TDP of only 53W (so it also doesn't need a PSU connector), has a performance advantage of 23% over the GTX 1050 Ti and only costs $140. Therefore, the RX 6400 is cheaper, faster and draws less power than the GTX 1050 Ti so there's no reason to get the GTX 1050 Ti. Why pay 32% more than the price of the RX 6400 when the RX 6400 is 23% faster and draws 22 fewer watts?

Even though the RX 6400 is a better value than the GTX 1050 Ti (and the GTX 1650 for that matter), it's still not a great value overall. The best performance for the money is the RX 6600 and it's not even close. At $235, it's 27% more expensive than the GTX 1050 Ti and 68% more expensive than the RX 6400. However, it is.. (are you ready for this?) Almost TRIPLE the speed of the GTX 1050 Ti (282%) and more than DOUBLE the speed of the RX 6400 (230%).

The only possible snag with the RX 6600 is the 132W TDP but that's probably not a big deal because AMD recommends a 300W PSU which means that your PSU should be able run it but it would be close, too close for comfort if you ask me. The thing is, you'd probably be better off getting a new PSU than just running it as-is. The RX 6600 isn't exactly a power gobbler and Newegg has an amazing sale on a real brand-name PSU right now:
Thermaltake ToughPower GX2 80+ Gold 600W SLI/Crossfire Ready - $50

A 600W brand-name PSU that's 80+Gold-Certified for $50 with a 5-year warranty is what I like to call "An offer you can't refuse". If you put that in with an RX 6600, you'll be in gaming heaven for less than $300. The RX 6600 will be bottlenecked by a Ryzen 1000-series CPU but not enough to prevent it from being an order of magnitude better than the RX 6400 and (especially) the GTX 1050 Ti. When you add the price of the PSU to the mix with the RX 6600 not much changes with regard to value:

The RX 6600 with PSU is still 182% faster than the GTX 1050 Ti but only costs 54% more.

The RX 6600 with PSU is still 130% faster than the RX 6400 but only costs 103% more.

Either way, the RX 6600 is a better value than any card ranked below it in performance even when you include the $50 for that 600W 80+Gold PSU, a PSU that would be worth buying just on its own because it's going to be stable and reliable for years to come. The RX 6600 has 8GB of VRAM which means that it will be usable for far longer than the other two. In fact, if all you play is that one game, you'll probably never need to upgrade it.

I guarantee that you won't find better than this (assuming you live in the USA) for the money. Also yes, a 59 year-old lad who loves to play video games (even if it's only one) is still a gamer. Welcome to the club old chum!

All of my performance figures are taken from the TechPowerUp GPU Database.

 

[ohio_buckeye]

Also if you are ok with used hardware, keep an eye on eBay. Recently picked up a miner’s card, an old 5700xt. Not gonna lie the card looks rough and has clearly been well used. There’s actually corrosion on the heat pipes and heat sink. On the other hand it functions and I practically got a steal for $140 bucks.

Considering taking it apart and maybe dunking the heatsink in some Coca Cola or clr and repasting it. On the other hand it’s functional so maybe I’ll leave well enough alone.

 

[hondoman]

The first suggestion is to look in the bios for a setting that determines how much system ram to allocate to graphics.
The max is 2gb. The default may be much less than that.
Setting to 2gb is best for graphics, but that may impact the rest of your system.

Regardless, try to upgrade the ram to dual channel and likely 16gb.

You could try adding another 8gb stick of the ram you now have.

Your current psu should be sufficient to add a graphics card that does not need aux 6 or 8 pin power from the psu.

Past that, you need a stronger psu.

If you do buy a new psu, DO NOT buy a cheap unit.

What an interesting way to start the day. Last night whilst having supper, I had a thought. I booted the PC and went to the BIOS and the graphics tab. Oddly, it was set for PEG and no IGD. Odd indeed! I set the graphics to IGD, 'Force' (not Auto) and 2GB. I then rebooted, went to the game and changed to Medium graphics. After about 5 seconds (compared to 15 minutes the other time) all was well and no game lag. Aye, my supper was cold at this point!

The graphics are good and I am not complaining, but no over all brilliant. I still might want to look at a card, upgrade the RAM and PSU.

Now I come to work and see you suggested that very idea. Solid advise!

Cheers!

 

[hondoman]

I guess that it would depend on what you want, what you want to spend and whether you want to buy new or used.

I don't know where you live so I won't get into used parts because that will change based on where you are, what day it is, etc. It's all over the place and is impossible to be accurate so I'll stick with new parts and use USA prices.

I saw someone mention the GTX 1050 Ti and yes, that would be better than the IGP that you're using but it's objectively a bad value and I can prove it.

The GTX 1050 Ti has a TDP of 75W and costs at least $185. That 75W is good because it means that it doesn't need an auxillary power connector from your PSU and draws all it needs from the PCI-Express slot on your motherboard.

The problem arises when you consider that the RX 6400 has a TDP of only 53W (so it also doesn't need a PSU connector), has a performance advantage of 23% over the GTX 1050 Ti and only costs $140. Therefore, the RX 6400 is cheaper, faster and draws less power than the GTX 1050 Ti so there's no reason to get the GTX 1050 Ti. Why pay 32% more than the price of the RX 6400 when the RX 6400 is 23% faster and draws 22 fewer watts?

Even though the RX 6400 is a better value than the GTX 1050 Ti (and the GTX 1650 for that matter), it's still not a great value overall. The best performance for the money is the RX 6600 and it's not even close. At $235, it's 27% more expensive than the GTX 1050 Ti and 68% more expensive than the RX 6400. However, it is.. (are you ready for this?) Almost TRIPLE the speed of the GTX 1050 Ti (282%) and more than DOUBLE the speed of the RX 6400 (230%).

The only possible snag with the RX 6600 is the 132W TDP but that's probably not a big deal because AMD recommends a 300W PSU which means that your PSU should be able run it but it would be close, too close for comfort if you ask me. The thing is, you'd probably be better off getting a new PSU than just running it as-is. The RX 6600 isn't exactly a power gobbler and Newegg has an amazing sale on a real brand-name PSU right now:
Thermaltake ToughPower GX2 80+ Gold 600W SLI/Crossfire Ready - $50

A 600W brand-name PSU that's 80+Gold-Certified for $50 with a 5-year warranty is what I like to call "An offer you can't refuse". If you put that in with an RX 6600, you'll be in gaming heaven for less than $300. The RX 6600 will be bottlenecked by a Ryzen 1000-series CPU but not enough to prevent it from being an order of magnitude better than the RX 6400 and (especially) the GTX 1050 Ti. When you add the price of the PSU to the mix with the RX 6600 not much changes with regard to value:

The RX 6600 with PSU is still 182% faster than the GTX 1050 Ti but only costs 54% more.

The RX 6600 with PSU is still 130% faster than the RX 6400 but only costs 103% more.

Either way, the RX 6600 is a better value than any card ranked below it in performance even when you include the $50 for that 600W 80+Gold PSU, a PSU that would be worth buying just on its own because it's going to be stable and reliable for years to come. The RX 6600 has 8GB of VRAM which means that it will be usable for far longer than the other two. In fact, if all you play is that one game, you'll probably never need to upgrade it.

I guarantee that you won't find better than this (assuming you live in the USA) for the money. Also yes, a 59 year-old lad who loves to play video games (even if it's only one) is still a gamer. Welcome to the club old chum!

All of my performance figures are taken from the TechPowerUp GPU Database.

An absolute load of info, background and research on your part! Cheers! More than I would have expected. Aye, I'm no in the USA. British, but live in Germany. I will defo give this RX6600 a solid think. Although no needed, I do feel a new PSU is in order as the current one is old and will give the 600W a view. Cheers! Regards, Old Gamer 🆒

 

[hondoman]

Also if you are ok with used hardware, keep an eye on eBay. Recently picked up a miner’s card, an old 5700xt. Not gonna lie the card looks rough and has clearly been well used. There’s actually corrosion on the heat pipes and heat sink. On the other hand it functions and I practically got a steal for $140 bucks.

Considering taking it apart and maybe dunking the heatsink in some Coca Cola or clr and repasting it. On the other hand it’s functional so maybe I’ll leave well enough alone.

Oh aye. I've been with eBay since 1998 and use the site often. I near on always give it a wee search to see what the prices are compared to actual shops. What's nice about where I live (EU) is finding an item cheaper in another country and easy posting to me. It does help. Thank you!

 

[Avro Arrow]

An absolute <Mod Edit> load of info, background and research on your part! Cheers! More than I would have expected. Aye, I'm no in the USA. British, but live in Germany. I will defo give this RX6600 a solid think. Although no needed, I do feel a new PSU is in order as the current one is old and will give the 600W a view. Cheers! Regards, Old Gamer 🆒

Ah good, well, I can give you something to look at in Germany then. The one I saw in the USA was completely overkill for your purposes but it was so cheap that it made nothing below it worth buying. There is a much more suitable Gigabyte 450W 80+Bronze at alza.de for 38,90 € and it would be splendid for your purposes:
Gigabyte 450W 80+Bronze ATX PSU - €38.90 (alza.de)
As for the RX 6600, Mindfactory has got you covered:
Powercolor Radeon RX 6600 Fighter Edition - €262 (mindfactory.de)

Let me give you a bit of Canadian wisdom (or what little of it that we have anyway):

IF YOU CAN'T STAY YOUNG, YOU CAN AT LEAST STAY IMMATURE!

Cheers mate! (From a Canadian who is also a citizen of the UK and Eire)

 

[hondoman]

Gigabyte 450W 80+Bronze ATX PSU - €38.90 (alza.de)
As for the RX 6600, Mindfactory has got you covered:
Powercolor Radeon RX 6600 Fighter Edition - €262 (mindfactory.de)

Let me give you a bit of Canadian wisdom (or what little of it that we have anyway):

IF YOU CAN'T STAY YOUNG, YOU CAN AT LEAST STAY IMMATURE!

Cheers mate! (From a Canadian who is also a citizen of the UK and Eire)

Hey Avro, so you took a wee look at Mindfactory! Brilliant site. The first PC I took on to build, I did from items they offered back in 1998. I recall little of the components other than the graphic card name: Voodoo. The name was cool as the card itself. I too looked at Mindfactory last night. 262€ is no bad price. A wee more than I wanted to spend, but again will no break the bank.

I do have a concern lad. The PC is more along the lines of an 'office' model truth be told. It's nothing elaborate or exciting. The housing itself is roughly 12 or 13 year old ATX. It suits. My concern is (dealing with the Mainboard) I am pouring 28 year old whisky in a plastic cup. Nothing wrong with that, but.... 8GB card in that PC on a basic mainboard. Again, is that wise? Is this overkill to one single component? Can that mainboard tolerate this card?

Mindfactory recommend a min 500W PSU for that card, so the Gigabyte is a non-starter, sadly. I've been rather impressed with Be Quiet! PSUs of late. Mindfactory have one for about 65€. The PSU I can sort, I just worry on the graphics card.

Thoughts?

Ah, so no 'Northern Ireland', eh? Loads of political <Mod Edit> at present on the isle. Loads!

 

[Avro Arrow]

Hey Avro, so you took a wee look at Mindfactory! Brilliant site. The first PC I took on to build, I did from items they offered back in 1998. I recall little of the components other than the graphic card name: Voodoo. The name was cool as the card itself. I too looked at Mindfactory last night. 262€ is no bad price. A wee more than I wanted to spend, but again will no break the bank.

I remember the 3dfx Voodoo. I did my first build back in 1986 with a 286-16 and an ATi EGA Wonder video card. When the Voodoo existed was the best of times with so many video card makers competing instead of just 2 or 3. I remember 3dfx, Diamond, Matrox, Orchid, Oak, CirrusLogic and S3. Those were the days!

I do have a concern lad. The PC is more along the lines of an 'office' model truth be told. It's nothing elaborate or exciting. The housing itself is roughly 12 or 13 year old ATX. It suits. My concern is (dealing with the Mainboard) I am pouring 28 year old whisky in a plastic cup. Nothing wrong with that, but.... 8GB card in that PC on a basic mainboard. Again, is that wise? Is this overkill to one single component? Can that mainboard tolerate this card?

Oh, absolutely! Truth be told, for the first half of 2022, I was running a mining PC to try and recover from what I paid for my RX 6800 XT. I was using an old Gigabyte 990FX motherboard from 2011 which only had PCI-Express v2.0 on it. I was running said RX 6800 XT along with my RX 5700 XT at the same time with no issues. Remember that the PCI-Express x16 slot only provides 75W to any card.

Mindfactory recommend a min 500W PSU for that card, so the Gigabyte is a non-starter, sadly. I've been rather impressed with Be Quiet! PSUs of late. Mindfactory have one for about 65€. The PSU I can sort, I just worry on the graphics card.

Thoughts?

I would ignore what Mind Factory recommends for that card because they want you to buy a bigger (and more expensive) PSU. While 300W can do it in a very basic system, Guru3D recommends a 450W PSU and Guru3D is one of the most respected video card review sites in the world. Just to be safe, I looked at the BeQuiet! PSU Calculator (BeQuiet! makes PSUs) and since I know that you have an APU but not which one, this is what I gave as your system specs (I overdid it on purpose):
APU: A12-9800E
GPU: RX 6600
RAM DIMMS: 2
SATA DEVICES: 3
PATA (IDE) DEVICES: 0
M.2 SSD: 1
CASE FANS: 4

MAXIMUM REQUIRED WATTAGE: 347W

Feel free to try it yourself with your own specifications (It'll most likely be lower). For a really worst-case scenario, I selected the Ryzen 7 1800X on the Seasonic calculator (Seasonic makes PSUs) and Seasonic recommends a 450W PSU. If the PSU makers themselves say that you only need 450W, you should trust them because they also want you to get a more expensive PSU than you need. I think that MindFactory is trying to up-sell you.

Let's face it, you're not constantly running 3DMark on this PC, you're using it for online gaming (which counts as light gaming), internet browsing and watching 2D videos. You're not going to even approach the maximum wattage requirement of 347W doing any of that. You'll be more than fine with a 450W 80+Bronze PSU. Of that, you can rest assured!

Ah, so no 'Northern Ireland', eh? Loads of political <Mod Edit> at present on the isle. Loads!

As a matter of fact, "Me ma's from Belfast!" so yes, I know what's going on there. The troubles are happening again because of Brexit. Her birth in Belfast gives me my UK citizenship right there. My Eire citizenship comes from the fact that when my grandparents were born in Belfast, it wasn't in the UK but the Irish Free State. I hold my Eire citizenship more dear than my UK citizenship because it means I'm a citizen of the EU and can live anywhere within it without any immigration papers. So, I guess that makes me a tri-citizen and as my great-uncle Joe used to say "That's a grand thing!".