News Intel Core i9-13900K and Core i5-13600K Review: Raptor Lake Beats Ryzen 7000

[Alvar "Miles" Udell]

Honestly with the temperatures Ryzen 7000 processors are reaching, and with the heat issues plaguing 3D cache chips along with the price premium, I can't see a Ryzen 7000X3D beating Raptor Lake...

 

[-Fran-]

Honestly with the temperatures Ryzen 7000 processors are reaching, and with the heat issues plaguing 3D cache chips along with the price premium, I can't see a Ryzen 7000X3D beating Raptor Lake...

Oh, please tell me more.

What issues are plaguing my 5800X3D, which I have inside a small box, next to a 6900XT, with a beQuiet! Shadow Rock TF2 for VR, which never goes over 85°C placed under my TV with very little airflow?

I am most definitely curious.

Regards.

 

[KyaraM]

For power consumption , watch the diferences , 13600k is more power hungry between 60w - 100+w more than 7700X , just look at the charts.And you can make 7700X more eficient . And maybe AM5 will last a few years like they did with AM4 , just swap the CPU.

You can also make the 13600K more efficient. That's not a valid point. And gaming is a completely different thing than multi-threaded applications.

I can't help but wonder how much Intel is paying you to write this. The benchmarks clearly show that AMD is faster at multi-threaded applications and Intel is better at gaming, but your articles ALWAYS publish with titles saying that Intel is faster. But more importantly, you still refuse to run realistic benchmarks. Post a run for each Intel chip with a $100 cooler on quiet mode--what users will actually have. Then let the system thermal throttle and post performance AFTER throttling. Maybe Intel wins there, but I've NEVER seen it. The ONE article I found that actually tried it, had Intel lose 30% performance due to throttling and lose handily to AMD.

Are you trolling?

 

[escksu]

They aren't recommended power limits but the power limits and going beyond them does void your warranty since only up to PL2 is warrantied operating conditions...you can stick to PL2 forever and that is warrantied but lifting that limit is not.

Just because intel doesn't dictate mobo makers or reviewers on what settings they are forced to use (to make benches look better) doesn't mean that they cover it in their warranty.

I would the warranty thing is rather dumb. Unless there are visible damage like burnt marks, it's not possible to know if chip died because it was overclocked or not.

 

[escksu]

Oh, please tell me more.

What issues are plaguing my 5800X3D, which I have inside a small box, next to a 6900XT, with a beQuiet! Shadow Rock TF2 for VR, which never goes over 85°C placed under my TV with very little airflow?

I am most definitely curious.

Regards.

You should at least google about why AMD prevents overclocking on the X3D

 

[-Fran-]

You should at least google about why AMD prevents overclocking on the X3D

Yes, because the VCache has issues with it, so they can't allow you to raise the voltage. It has nothing to do with temps (as alluded) or power draw (it is still the most efficient gaming CPU). It's a problem with the gen1 VCache implementation; nothing more, nothing less.

EDIT: I forgot to mention... You can OC the 5800X3D, though. Much like you can OC using a B660 and a locked Intel SKU (wth an external clock generator for them). With AMD you just increase the BCLK and pray you don't cause PCIe signals to make everything blow up

Regards.

 

[btmedic04]

You should at least google about why AMD prevents overclocking on the X3D

the 3d stacked L3 Cache in that particular chip has a 1.35v limitation, not heat.

 

[btmedic04]

interesting perspective from Toms. From what Ive seen elsewhere (including gamers nexus, hardware unboxed, anandtech) it seems like 13th gen and zen 4 trade blows, but thats not quite the case here. I'd be VERY interested to see an article comparing testing methodologies between toms and the aforementioned reviews that led to quite a different performance picture here compared to elsewhere.

 

[btmedic04]

another interesting perspective is the lack of any mention of forward compatibility with current AM5 motherboards, or the lack thereof with Z790. Yet when Z690 launched, its forward compatibility with raptor lake was touted while AM4 was announced as a dead-end socket.


Just some food for thought as to why people consider Toms biased.

 

[LOUTZ!]

Watch Der8auer's video.

You don't have to run the 13900K flat out to beat everything else.

This 13900K power limited to 90W...

Wow! How is that even possible?

 

[btmedic04]

Lastly, I'd like to point out that this is not the first, nor the last time that the performance of the 5800x3d has been called bi-polar in a Toms article. The term bi-polar evokes a strong negative emotional response in most people and quite frankly is unprofessional. While it would be completely fair and unbiased to say that its performance is inconsistent, Toms continues to insist on using bi-polar to describe the inconsistent performance of the 5800x3d.

 

[Phaaze88]

Been around the review block - Tom's, TPU, HWUB, Der8auer, LTT, Jay, Paul, Kitguru - holy crap, that was a lot to chug down... and:
[Why does Der8auer run CB20 and not 23? I also noticed that TPU ran their 13th gen test bed at DDR5 7400... ]
Games
1)13th gen performance is trading blows with AM5, and even AM4(5800X 3D) in some instances. Unfortunate that some titles did not react well to the dual CCX Ryzens - incoming fix anytime later?
The best gaming cpu(overall)? ~Ehh... everyone has their 'flavors', making this not accurate for everyone.

2)Lower cost of entry compared to the competition.

3)While DDR4 is an option to pair with it, I feel that would be a waste if one is building brand new; may as well go DDR5.

4)The rules have changed regarding cooling on both sides. You don't have to go balls to the wall on a 200+ quid cooler. They can be cooled on air just fine. Adjust your fan curves accordingly.
*There's still the issue of the uneven contact pressure caused by the ILM frame which likely would help cooling the cpus.

5)This is the end of the road for LGA 1700. AM5 has 2(?) more gens to go. How much this matters depends on one's upgrade cycle.


Productivity, or time is money
1)Performance is trading blows with AM5.

2)Lower cost of entry, but may not make as much as the competition over time; application dependent, I believe. I mean, these workhorses are going to be used for at least a year before possibly moving on to the next greatest thing, yeah?
To make the most money out of the i9, the user needs to be willing to utilize bios or XTU to fine tune power limits and Vcore.
The out of box power efficiency is not very good, and you're missing out on money if the cpu is left to its own devices(or any mobo/software auto OC crap).

Ryzen 9 also benefits from some tuning, but is more efficient than i9 at stock; sure, AM5 costs more initially, but one will easily make that difference - and more - back in no time, yes?
I'm not sure any of the reviewers brought that detail up, but I went through so many reviews that it may have slipped by me.

3)Cooling rules have changed.
*ILM frame thing.

4)DDR5 if one isn't already on 12th gen, IMO.

5)LGA 1700 is over, AM5 continues, and personal upgrade cycles.


TL;DR: I got nothing Chief, and I believe that's a good thing. Pick whichever platform based on your requirements.

 

[WINTERLORD]

The times when people upgrade every generation or every other generation are over for most with that said

I just wonder how a i5 or even a i7 and when it comes out how an i3 stands up to a 8700k

I know a i5 prolly smokes a 8700k a i3 prolly beat it to but itwould be nice to see

Otherwise is a good article

 

[Co BIY]

Yeah, I might've made the mistake of buying a 12700KF last week for $300 on sale during Amazon Prime day.

This week the freaking $330 13600K wipes the floor with every Zen 4 / Alder Lake in games, and can keep up with 12900K / 7900X in productivity apps.

sigh

Do you need the extra FPS at 1080 with your 4090?

 

[RodroX]

The times when people upgrade every generation or every other generation are over for most with that said

I just wonder how a i5 or even a i7 and when it comes out how an i3 stands up to a 8700k

I know a i5 prolly smokes a 8700k but still would be nice to see

If you see any Core I5 (10gen, 11gen, 12gen,13gen), smoking or trading blows against a Core i7/Core i9 (10gen, 11gen, 12gen,13gen), then you should have no doubt about the outcome of modern i5/i7 vs the i7 8700K.

 

[Co BIY]

Seriously how many people are going to purchase a $400+ unlocked Intel i9 / i7 cpu and run it with a $100 air cooler?

Probably quite a few.

And I bet their websites load snappy!

Also can I pay more for an air cooler?

Running tests of Raptor vs Zen 4 on the biggest air cooler possible is something I would read/watch.

 

[PaulAlcorn]

Tom's has always used the max certified JEDEC speeds.

This has played against Intel when for example they used DDR5-4800 for Alder Lake, and DDR5-5200 for AMD. It also played against Intel when they used DDR4-2933 vs DDR4-3200 for AMD.

If they had deviated from that pattern, that would be bias. What they did is consistent.

Yes, for stock settings, we always use the warrantied memory speed for every chip (JEDEC). This is the only way to make fair comparisons when testing an out-of-the-box config.

For overclocking, we use either XMP or an overclocked configuration if we can do better than the XMP kits we have on hand.

 

[Brian D Smith]

I do so wish the Stockfish Benchmarks - Multi-threaded were included. I do think the top AMD would be the top Intel once again and by a nice margin. Given the Multi-thread improvement, bit might be closer though.

 

[papaspud]

I didn't know anyone bought a 13900K and started up some Cyberpunk at 1080p... Who cares about 1080p gaming anymore? These benchmarks are stupid

because if you use higher resolutions= they tend to become GPU bound and are no longer stressing the CPU.

 

[dalauder]

Watch Der8auer's video.

You don't have to run the 13900K flat out to beat everything else.

This 13900K power limited to 90W...

That's pretty cool info. I'd be interested to see a major review site do something like that.

 

[dalauder]

Seriously how many people are going to purchase a $400+ unlocked Intel i9 / i7 cpu and run it with a $100 air cooler?

Most people using one will actually buy prebuilts, which will have even worse coolers. And I meant $100 water cooler. Most people think any 280mm AI cooler will do.

 

[ottonis]

"Intel's 13th-Gen Raptor Lake processors deliver explosive generational performance increases that beat AMD's similarly-priced Ryzen chips in gaming, single- and multi-threaded work at every price point."

According to the table, Ryzen 7950x multicore performance was set to 100%, while Core i9 13900 was at 96.5%.
So, according to this table Intel's fastet raptor lake CPU still trails its AMD competitor in multi tasking performance while consuming more power at that.

 

[TerryLaze]

I would the warranty thing is rather dumb. Unless there are visible damage like burnt marks, it's not possible to know if chip died because it was overclocked or not.

It is dumb, that's why it's important to tell people what's what because if they need to use the warranty they need to know not to tell the person on the phone that the power limit was out-of-the-box or lifted.

Yes, for stock settings, we always use the warrantied memory speed for every chip (JEDEC). This is the only way to make fair comparisons when testing an out-of-the-box config.

But you do have power limits lifted which is not stock settings, so why is it fair to reduce the ram settings if they are higher out-of-the-box but you can't reduce the power draw to stock? You are not using PBO for stock settings so why do you use lifted limits?

 

[Coffee Fueled Curmudgeon]

Der Bauers video on these is interesting.

The much vaunted Eco mode for AMD seems to be very similar on the Intel chips and the two flagships trade blows to appease the fanboys (or not, because rabid) at 90W and still blow away previous generation chips.

Frankly, most people would get by with room to spare on a 5800X3D or 12600K/13600K for 3-4 years at least given the build costs for either platform is similar.

Who knew that fanboyism in 2022 would boil down to who can run their CPU with the least power at a time when both companies went all out for clock speed and benchmarks at the cost of power draw, heat, and ultimately noise.

 

[escksu]

13600K looks good... OC it as high as possible!!