Intel's Future Chips: News, Rumours & Reviews

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What Yuka said! We only get a peak at how things are going. Public owned companies are more transparent, because they have stock holders to answer too. That's why earnings calls, analyst, investor meeting, and SEC filings are important for finding out little tid bits of truth because they can't lie or they can be sued!!! "Marketing Statement" or forward thinking statements they can get away with telling you their vision of where they want to be, which from all the PR statements will dazzle you into a false sense of the future!
 
Samsung extends its number one ranking and sales lead over Intel to 23%.
http://www.icinsights.com/news/bulletins/Thirteen-Top15-1Q18-Semi-Suppliers-Register-DoubleDigit-Gains-/
Intel was the number one ranked semiconductor supplier in 1Q17 but lost its lead spot to Samsung in 2Q17 as well as in the full-year 2017 ranking, a position it had held since 1993. With the continuation of the strong surge in the DRAM and NAND flash markets over the past year, Samsung went from having 5% less total semiconductor sales than Intel in 1Q17 to having 23% more semiconductor sales than Intel in 1Q18!
bulletin20180515Fig01.png

It is also worth to note:
- A pure play foundry like TSMC is #3.
- Nvidia has grown an amazing 58% year to year.
 
I try to judge all information on it's own merit. I try to look for the scientific method or testing methodology. Some people won't believe the truth even if it's posted by the majority. They will look for that 1 outlier that publishes the version of the "truth" they want to hear! Once someone "believes" something all reason goes out the door.
 


~25% is from Crypto!

Also,
2017 saw two semiconductor industry milestones — revenue surpassed $400 billion, and Intel, the No. 1 vendor for the last 25 years, was pushed into second place by Samsung Electronics," said George Brocklehurst, research director at Gartner. "Both milestones happened due to rapid growth in the memory market as undersupply drove pricing for DRAM and NAND flash higher.
DcD7M7vWsAA5B8r.jpg

https://www.gartner.com/newsroom/id/3872763
 
Well these are Intel's Q1 2018 results summarized:

Revenues: Intel booked $16.1bn in the first quarter of the year, a new record for the company. That's up nine per cent on this time last year. Chief beancounter Bob Swan said he was expecting second quarter revenues to be even higher.

Net income: Intel banked $4.5bn for the quarter, up 50 per cent year-on-year. Operating income rose 23 per cent over the same period.

Earnings per share: Those profits buoyed the EPS to $0.93 this quarter, up 53 per cent form the first quarter of last year. To tempt shareholders even more Swan reported that Intel will spend $1.9bn in stock buybacks this quarter and another $1.4bn will be spent on dividends, an increase of 10 per cent from last year.

Client Computing Group: All this growth didn’t come from PCs. Revenues in Intel's CCG rose just three per cent to $8.2bn. PC volumes were flat, which Intel hailed as a success since PC sales across the board are shrinking at the moment. Notebook average selling prices (ASP) rose one per cent and desktop ASP rose seven per cent, reflecting Intel's "who else are you going to buy from?" monopoly strategy.

Data Center Group: DCG was Intel's star performer, with revenues of $5.2bn, up 23 per cent year on year. Cloud systems showed the strongest growth at 45 per cent, closely followed by Communications revenues which rose 33 per cent. The sad sack of the division was enterprise and government sales which were up just 3 per cent.
https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/04/27/intel_q1_2018/



For comparison purposes AMD revenue for the first quarter of 2018 of $1.65 billion, operating income of $120 million, net income of $81 million, and diluted earnings per share of $0.08. On a non-GAAP basis, operating income was $152 million, net income was $121 million, and diluted earnings per share was $0.11. The company successfully beat analyst expectations of 6 cents EPS on the dollar by 5 cents. That the company blew away conservative estimations of this quarter is an understatement.
 
Intel Cannon Lake m3 processor spotted on 3DMARK
https://www.overclock3d.net/news/cpu_mainboard/intel_cannon_lake_m3_processor_spotted_on_3dmark/1

Today we have a new Intel m3-class processor, a product segment that typically sits in the 4.5-watt power category, built on Intel's new 10nm process node using the company's new Cannon Lake CPU architecture. Unlike Intel's recently revealed Cannon Lake i3-8121U, this new processor seems to have an active GPU component, making the processor suitable for a broader range of applications.

This new processor is listed under the Core m3-8114Y name, offering two CPU cores, four threads and UHD series graphics. Like most low-TDP offerings the base clock of this processor is rather low, with 3DMARK listing it as 1.5GHz, though this is acceptable for a processor designed for use in ultra-low-power tablet PCs.

Another interesting aspect is this CPU's support for LPDDR4 memory, low power memory which typically used in the mobile market. This data suggests that Intel's Cannonlake i3-8121U is made from defective Core m3-8114Y silicon, explaining the former's lack of iGPU functionality and why Intel has not discussed the product much openly.
 
When is Intel’s 10nm process scheduled for
Not the PR stunts, not the “shipping” parts, the real 10nm
May 21, 2018 by Charlie Demerjian

Intel has been a bit economical with the truth on 10nm but SemiAccurate can give you the real story. Officially 10nm is shipping now, and technically speaking it is, but when will it be more than a PR stunt?

On April 26, Intel held their Q1/2018 earnings call. It was a wealth of information about how things are going badly off the rails at Intel, as long as you knew how to interpret the doublespeak. Take this quote from Brian Krzanich for instance.

“We continue to make progress on our 10-nanometer process. We are shipping in low volume and yields are improving, though the rate of improvement is slower than we anticipated. As a result, volume production is moving from the second half of 2018 into 2019. We understand the yield issues and have defined improvements for them, but they will take time to implement and qualify. We have leadership products on the roadmap that continue to take advantage of 14-nanometer, with Whiskey Lake for clients and Cascade Lake for the data center coming later this year.”

Sounds great doesn’t it? They understand the problem, have a fix, and anticipate the ramp to take place next year. Lets parse this a bit, starting with the admission that 10nm was set for 2H/2018, something we told you was unquestionably not going to happen last December. We knew the schedule then, it seems curious that Intel management did not know. Then again SemiAccurate has been pointing out curious statements in Intel’s 10nm messaging since we exclusively revealed that they had Cannon Lake silicon back two and a half years ago.

Then comes the biggest shock, the ‘logic’ about the ramp. Officially speaking Intel directly stated it has identified the problem, has a fix, but the ramp is now set for 2019 rather than the mythical 2H/2018 target. If you know anything about semiconductor manufacturing, a new spin of a device takes about three months to pass through the fabs for production wafers. A high priority test lot can be done in possibly two months, but the manufacturing takes a lot of time, there are no shortcuts. If what Mr Krzanich said was true, Intel has the ability to run about four tests of their ‘fix’ and still hit a January 1, 2019 ramp start, assuming no overlapping test cases which they are undoubtedly doing.

Why is this problematic? It sure looks like the bit about, “defined improvements” is more of the blind panic guesswork SemiAccurate moles are describing and far less of the fix Intel wants you to believe it is. We will state for the record that there is no way a known fix would take eight months to implement, period. Do recall that is for the start of the ramp, not production parts for sale, add 4-5 months to the tally for that.

There is nothing stated that we can call out as intentionally inaccurate but taken together they both do not logically parse and, for some people, point to something that isn’t the case. If people ‘misinterpret’ that on their own, it isn’t Intel’s fault, right? The real problem is putting this messaging up against the real schedules which Intel doesn’t dare talk about in public, then things look really grim.

Lets start out with a question from Stacy Rasgon, again from the same call, asking of the 2019 release was first half or second half. Brian Krzanich replied, “So I’m just going to correct you. You said that supposedly we have the solutions. We do understand these, and so we do have confidence that we can go and work these issues, Stacy. Right now, like I said, we are shipping. We’re going to start that ramp as soon as we think the yields are in line. So I said 2019. We didn’t say first or second half, but we’ll do it as quickly as we can based on the yield.”

The above is classic PR speak for “2nd half”, so the 10nm ramp just moved from 2H/2018 to 2H/2019, not January 1, 2019 as they probably hoped you would believe. This is not a minor slip, again. Also note the confidence level BK portrays, it isn’t the strong, confident tone you would expect for a solved problem. Better yet is what they are telling partners.
https://www.semiaccurate.com/2018/05/21/when-is-intels-10nm-process-scheduled-for/

I also linked this same quote with some others in a previous post hidden in the 3rd spoiler here:
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/id-1581001/intel-future-chips-news-rumours-reviews/page-63.html#20920876

But also, look what else I included in that same spoiler:
the yield improvements that we're making are just that, more focused on yield. So think of them as improvements to the various edge stuff, the lithography stuff, thin cleans (33:54) and things like that in order to really drive the multi-patterning and, in some cases, multi-multi-patterning, where you have four, five, six layers of patterning to produce a feature. It's really about that. They aren't necessarily around performance.
Now look at the very first spoiler in that some post:
A), we understand the yield issues. They're really tied to this being the last technology tied to not having EUV and the amount of multi-patterning and the effects of that on defects.

This suggests that BK thinks EUV will fix these problems in the future. TSMC is going to try and deploy EUV this year for vias and contacts, and Samsung is also going to implement EUV this year.
 


Perhaps, but there's a reason why Intel's stock is double what it was when he brought in. Granted, there's no guarantee that trend will hold, but by the same token, I don't see any real evidence for a slowdown either.
 


Losing it's competitive advantage that they have maintained for ~20 years would affect that stock price! AMD's 7nm vs 14nm is going to be on display next year, and we will see how it goes. They start loosing serious market share, and $INTC share price will fall with it.
 


More fuel for the fire: (8 months ago)
Intel 8-Core CPU and Z390 Motherboards Coming in 2H 2018
Ben Jones / 8 months ago

Those who are disappointed with the minuscule jump need not to worry about waiting long for the next version. A representative at Eurocom (via NotebookReview.com forum) just happens to casually drop the fact that the Z390 platform is coming out on the second half of 2018. The wait in fact is short enough that the representative states that Eurocom is skipping the Z370 line entirely.

Moreover, the Eurocom representative states that the Z390 platform also brings 8-core CPUs to the mainstream. That is 8-core with 16-threads, just like Coffee Lake brings six-core with 12-threads with the Z370. Notice the motherboard change requirement as well, although it is not clear yet whether it will be the same socket or not. It does not really matter since as the company made clear with the Z370, even if it is physically compatible, they will require a new motherboard. Intel has reserved their 6-core and 8-core processors to their HEDT line up until AMD released Ryzen, so now they are pushing for more multi-core options down the line.
https://techreport.com/news/33671/rumor-eight-core-coffee-lake-desktop-cpu-appears-in-sisoft-database
 


Very interesting!
Z390 boards in 2H2018, 8 Core mainstream processors, and nothing mentioned from Intel about Skylake-X refresh/HEDT. Who else are those Z390 motherboards for if the only thing being released is an 8 core processor?
 


Maybe some un-discovered / un-published bugs they squashed in the chipset? Some future features they want to expose now and see how they work?

I can think of a couple "long-stretch" things why, but I'd say the simplest explanation is the best: just because they can.

Cheers! 😛
 


Yeah sure and they are testing out a new method of delivery to your door by carrier pigeon! Motherboard vendors releasing motherboards without any new release of CPUs to put in them! That happen all the time lol! :pt1cable:
 


That is probably an exageration, in response to this coment:

David Schor @david_schor
Replying to @CDemerjian

Interesting, your dates seem more optimistic than what I heard. I'm hearing of a "small ramp in late 2019 and larger ramp in 2020" (where did I heard of something like this before? lol).


However the rumours pointing to late 2019 - early 2020 keep poping-out from diferent sources.

 
Samsung Plans 3nm Gate-All-Around FETs in 2021
Dylan McGrath
5/23/2018 00:01 AM EDT

GAA_FET_500.png

Yongjoo Jeon, a principal engineer with Samsung Foundry, said Tuesday that Samsung will use an internally developed EUV mask inspection tool. This is a significant advantage for Samsung, since no commercial tool has been developed, Jeon added.
Samsung's process technology roadmap also includes 5nm FinFET production in 2019 and 4nm FinFET production in 2020.
https://www.eetimes.com/document.asp?doc_id=1333318
With little out of Intel about process road maps and a broken 10nm process TSMC and Samsung continue to update their process road maps. Samsung is seemingly very aggressive with EUV, which may push them into a close battle with TSMC at 3nm to be first.
 
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