PS4 and Xbox 720 Graphics Specs Toe-to-Toe, Says Insider

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Seriously? Firstly, neither MS or Sony is going to license a reference design card and make their own copies of it. In order to fit it into a console it will obviously have to be completely redesigned which costs money believe it or not. Secondly, you do realize that every company that sells a 680GTX card does not buy the parts for $500, correct? Just as you stated they buy for less than retail then sell at a higher price so they can make a profit. The exact same thing that MS and Sony would like to do with their consoles. They aren't going to pass the savings on to you, so it doesn't matter what the wholesale price is, you aren't going to see it.
 
ye obviously publishers don't want games to run on as many platforms as possible

that's why epic megagames moved from developing for pc exclusively to consoles... and that's the development company who used to push cutting edge hardware with unreal engine on pc, look at them now, swimming in mediocrity of console casualism just to get more cash for less work (they even renamed to epic games because they knew the *** they produce will only be a shadow of what they used to make since they moved onto consoles)

that's business for you m8
 
Seriously? Firstly, neither MS or Sony is going to license a reference design card and make their own copies of it. In order to fit it into a console it will obviously have to be completely redesigned which costs money believe it or not. Secondly, you do realize that every company that sells a 680GTX card does not buy the parts for $500, correct? Just as you stated they buy for less than retail then sell at a higher price so they can make a profit. The exact same thing that MS and Sony would like to do with their consoles. They aren't going to pass the savings on to you, so it doesn't matter what the wholesale price is, you aren't going to see it.[/quotemsg]
who said anything about passing the savings on to me? i was stating that this delirious person's wishful thinking was exactly what you just said

if you read his previous posts, he said he wishes for 6 cell cpus and gtx680 for $400, several times

and that's beside the point, his whole idea is out of reason no matter how you look at it
 
my idea is out of reason?

an idea doesn't have to have any reasons. it is an idea.

and my idea is not even anything novel. my idea is for sony to stick to cell and nvidia. i know i am not the only one who has come up with this.

the amd idea is new though, which i have refuted in favor of the older idea.





 
[citation][nom]kinggremlin[/nom]No, they aren't, but you are.No company can sell a console to the mass market for $650 that doesn't include any sort of input device (THG PC includes no mouse or keyboard, and obviously no game controller), and can't even boot up because it doesn't have the required $100 OS installed (No OS included in THG system price) on it to allow it to run anything.Add $140 for the OS and 1 game controller (even a gaming only PC is basically useless w/out a mouse a keyboard, but I'll leave the costs of those out), and now you're looking at a $790 console. Only a retard would think that could be a mainstream commercial success.[/citation]read and think, thats why I am referencing Radeon 7770, instead of 6950 $240. 7770 being $130 thats already $110 down from $650 = $540. Thats the price for NOW. NOT 2 YEARS LATER. Do u actually think Radeon 7770 gonna sell at the same price 2 years Later?(counting in year 2012). It is obviously they are the one retard for using 6670. 2 years from now I can easily build a $500 PC box that have graphic performance easily exceed 6670.
 
you obviously don't like my idea or think i am preaching the "cell religion." let me assure you that i am not a cell worshiper. my numerous posts here might be read as such, but the reasons behind them are not from delirium as you imply or from blind worshiping for a piece of silicon. alas, if one was to ask me why i posted so many times today, my reply would simply be of boredom. why else would someone post in forums?

you stated that my idea is out of reason. this and that would be too expensive. and you imply the most popular grievances of the cell processor as something developers would rather not develop for.

 
also, you say that i am wishful thinking... i guess you could say that... but i prefer to call it dreaming. the difference is that wishful thinking is farther from possibility and dreaming is closer to possibility. it's a small difference. but my preference for the upcoming ps4 to have this and that to be more dreamy than wishy.... just to say....
 
When the PS3 was in it's development phase, wasn't it thought that it was going to outshine the power of modern computers?

This doesn't even seem to make an attempt to come close to the top potential a gaming system could harness.
 
[citation][nom]Tomfreak[/nom]read and think, thats why I am referencing Radeon 7770, instead of 6950 $240. 7770 being $130 thats already $110 down from $650 = $540. Thats the price for NOW. NOT 2 YEARS LATER. Do u actually think Radeon 7770 gonna sell at the same price 2 years Later?(counting in year 2012). It is obviously they are the one retard for using 6670. 2 years from now I can easily build a $500 PC box that have graphic performance easily exceed 6670.[/citation]

No, you could not. 2 years from now, an OEM Windows license is still going to be $100, and a console controller is still going to be in the $40 range at least. Subtract out these two required components, and you are left with $360. Absolutely no way at all, will you be able to build a PC with equivalent gaming capabilities of either of these consoles for that price when buying new retail parts. None.
 
[citation][nom]techwizard08[/nom]This doesn't even seem to make an attempt to come close to the top potential a gaming system could harness.[/citation]

Of course it doesn't. Building a 6GHz nitrogen cooled Ivy Bridge system with an HD 7970 Xfire setup would be a complete waste of money for a system intended to drive a display with a maximum resolution of 1920x1080. The capabilities of today's top end PC's far exceed the necessary computing power to game at HD TV resolutions, so there is no reason a console should try to compete with that.
 
[citation][nom]kinggremlin[/nom]No, you could not. 2 years from now, an OEM Windows license is still going to be $100, and a console controller is still going to be in the $40 range at least. Subtract out these two required components, and you are left with $360. Absolutely no way at all, will you be able to build a PC with equivalent gaming capabilities of either of these consoles for that price when buying new retail parts. None.[/citation]u forgot that the components price will drop at least for CPU and gpu side. 7770 is a very small chip, 2 yrs from now when TSMC move to 20nm, 28nm it is going to be very cheap to manufacture. OS in PS are linux base, this does not cost $100. I dont think microsoft are going to charge themselves $100 on their own console. u also ignored the fact that manufacturing the same hardware in mass quantity could bring down the cost.
 
Single console hardware to optimize code on
>
USD2000 PC hardware with billions of driver combinations
 
At least DirectX 11 support is there and we may start to see native Dx11 games. Native Dx11 game would be much better than a Dx9 + some Dx11 featured games as of today.
 
It's quite a departure from the excitement of the launch of Xbox 360 from the original Xbox. I remember watching a preview of the Xbox 360 hardware and hearing multiple cores was music to my ears back when I had my P4 478 computer. Now this is just disappointment.
 
[citation][nom]Tomfreak[/nom]read and think, thats why I am referencing Radeon 7770, instead of 6950 $240. 7770 being $130 thats already $110 down from $650 = $540. Thats the price for NOW. NOT 2 YEARS LATER. Do u actually think Radeon 7770 gonna sell at the same price 2 years Later?(counting in year 2012). It is obviously they are the one retard for using 6670. 2 years from now I can easily build a $500 PC box that have graphic performance easily exceed 6670.[/citation]

Do you know how much it would cost Sony or MS to licence 7770 design and tweak it? At least 3 times more than 6670 because it's current generation of products. You say it's $130, I say add to that $100 for licencing and tweaking. Then think about it being 28nm, who can produce it in decent volume? With AMD and Nvidia switching to 28nm design TSMC and GF have free 40nm capacities that can be rented by Sony and MS at much lower price than their 28nm capacities, and with higher yields. Problem with your argument is that you presume that they, Sony and MS, are buying chips from AMD or Nvidia, no they buy chip design and there is also a question of would they sell them design of latest generation. Then what you think how much cost PSU for consoles? Yes just 180W but silent and with much better cooling than average PC PSU. Then passively cooled CPU, then network modules, TV tuner, controller, marketing expenses and so on.
 
Ceeblueyonder is right up to a point. The reason the PS3 (and to a somewhat lesser extent the 360) are doing so well is because of the hardware that was put in them. When you have a 7 core (they disabled one for some reason and I forget why) cpu in the Cell, and at the time of the ps3 launch, the rsx was MORE powerful than any pc card on the market. The chip was then announced as the 7800gtx gpu soon after... so PC's caught up pretty quickly and surpassed them a year later. Sony put a bluray player in their device which was really expensive to do at the time as well. And lets not forget about the ageia (now bought by nvidia) physx ppu, and bluetooth connectivity either. hell they even offer an SSD currently.

At launch an 8 core (well 7 core) cpu was unheard of even in your average home cpu... so the Cell was a huge leap forward. At the time of the PS3 lauch the home users were just getting dual core cpus... The biggest problem is that the 360 put 3 cores in theirs IIRC that all ran at 3.2ghz which effectively cut the number of threads that games would use by limiting them to 2 cores... which at the time was fine for pc owners because thats all we had too. But as time went on PCs got 4 and 6 physical cores and some even have HT giving them a corresponding amount of logical cores as well... so you have some PCs that can execute up to 12 threads at once... While games are still using 2 or 3 threads. Could be using 7 but nooo microsoft's console had to be cheaper.

The issue is that the CEO that believed in high end hardware pushing games forward (and honestly thinking 10 years ahead as well)... stepped down and a new CEO that doesnt believe in hardware as much took his place. So that's why youre seeing them going essentially bargain basement for parts this time around. Could they go high end again and even outdo the current PC market and sell it at a loss like they did the first PS3s? yes... but the new CEO doesnt want to. Plus with dx11 it can scale the tessellation based on your hardware so the PC market will have better looking games but still play at the same or better frame rate than the consoles.

The good news about them going bargain basement this time is that they are able to get multicore cpus (and even a cpu with a gpu on it) and add in a more powerful (roughly twice as powerful as the rsx) gpu for less money. Plus I have one of the first PS3s right now (only bought it for bluray, I dont console game much... stupid thumbsticks) and the fan on the thing is super loud after a few minutes of use. Its not loud enough to make me stop using it but its probably 40db across a 15 ft living room. So its just loud enough to be a distraction. Using a lower end GPU thats still more powerful than their current one will mean a quieter (and possibly slimmer) console.
 
ceeblueyonder and soda-88:

We try to run a G-rated forum here. I selectedly edited your last few posts to remove profanity and personal attacks. I left the "useful" content in place.

Any more profanity and personal attacks and I will do a wholesale deletion of posts, dust off my seldom used banhammer, and close this thread.

John
 
[citation][nom]gray_fox_98[/nom]Errrghh.... Wrong. The Xbox360 can emulated many old Xbox games , i played panzer dragoon orta , shenmue 2 and halo in my xbox360 with no problems.Where the hell did you got your info from?[/citation]

I didn't say that the 360 can't run the older games. But "officially" it is not backwards compatible for licensing reasons. Back before the 360 was released I read an article saying that the XBox 360 wouldn't be backwards compatible because of the switch in GPU vendors. The original XBox had an old nVidia Geforce 3 chip- the games use NV code, which is proprietary, and hence MS didn't want to bother trying to hammer out a way to pay nVidia licensing fees to allow NV code to run on the new ATi hardware. I might be botching the explanation a bit, but essentially I believe I am correct on this.
 
[citation][nom]caedenv[/nom]So... You need a PC anyways, because consoles still will not run Office and many other necessary functionality programs, so instead of buying a seperate $500 console why not just add $3-500 to your PC budget?You can emulate all of your old games as far back as the original NES/ATARI, and play all of the modern games with higher settings, with higher frame rates, better textures, better filtering, and still have the option of a USB controller if that strikes your fancy.I'm really unclear as to how these consoles sell so well...[/citation]

Because there aren't enough games developed for PC. Consoles are known to be dedicated gaming systems, PC as you've said, are multi-functional systems. Playing games at max settings are more demanding on PCs than consoles and many developers find it cheaper to build games for consoles and port it over to PC (which takes away from the PC experience).
 
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