Question Spontaneous and Frequent Reboots Possibly Caused by PSU? [PSU Still Works in Another System]

[Sefix]

Hey everyone. About 2 weeks ago, I bought a (barely) used PC set from FB Marketplace from a reputable and trusted builder who's a PC hobbyist. A week later of consistent use (video editing, gaming, and browsing) for more than 6-8 hours a day, I've been experiencing spontaneous reboots with no BSODs at all. It's honestly a mystery and by this point I'm kind of looking for answers.

During low loads (not even in gaming and editing sessions), the computer would turn off, then boot into Windows, I'd be able to log in, and it would die for a couple of minutes or around 1-3 hours. This has happened in various uptimes of the system. Once it happens, the uptimes get shorter and shorter due to the reboots. It even happened in Safe Mode and when I was trying to verify if my RAM is the issue via Windows Memory Diagnostic.

This might be a long post but to give some initial context, here's my specs when I was experiencing the issues:
CPU: Intel Core i5 12600K
CPU Cooler: Themlright Peerless Assassin White aRGB
Motherboard: Gigabyte Z690 AERO G DDR4
Ram: Corsair Vengeance LPX 32GB (2x16 Dual Channel)
SSD: Samsung SSD 850 EVO 250GB & CT1000MX500SSD1 1TB SSD
GPU: ZOTAC GeForce 1070
PSU: Inwin P85 850w Gold Fully Modular
Chassis: Lian Li Lancool 216 with stock 160mm aRGB Fans and 2 more LianLi SL120 fans with a single Thermalright 120mm white aRGB
OS: Windows 11 Pro 64-bit
Monitor: HP Z27n

The parts (except the PSU) were bought and used in November 2023. According to the seller, the PSU was bought firsthand by him on June 2023 and he used it in his personal rig before switching to another PSU after buying a new one. I bought his PC set on August 27

The BIOS version is F27. You can view my BIOS (before and after) switching PSUs here.

I also don't use an UPS. It did crash when using my AVR and I've plugged the PC in a different wall outlet but the reboot still happened.

I also don't overclock (don't know how as well). I've had XMP enabled and disabled but the problems still exist.

Event Viewer showed two consistent errors before and after the PC would shut down:

1. Event ID 56 - Image containing Details can be found here

The description for Event ID 56 from source Application Popup cannot be found. Either the component that raises this event is not installed on your local computer or the installation is corrupted. You can install or repair the component on the local computer.

If the event originated on another computer, the display information had to be saved with the event.

The following information was included with the event:

ACPI
2

The message resource is present but the message was not found in the message table

Weirdly enough, this seems to be a somewhat common error code among Gigabyte motherboards. There's a number of Reddit posts experiencing boot issues too but most resolutions I've found did the ff:

• Replaced their PSUs
• Fixed Cables/reseat them/replaced faulty ones
• Replaced their MOBOs

Despite replacing my PSU (more about this at the bottom), it still pops out but it hasn't led to any reboots.
2. Kernel-Power (Event ID 41) - Image containing Details can be found here

The system has rebooted without cleanly shutting down first. This error could be caused if the system stopped responding, crashed, or lost power unexpectedly.

When it first happened, I had the rams reseated, removed the GPU, and the issues persisted. Used another power cord, issues still happened.

A computer technician friend checked up on the PC and suspected that it's a PSU issue as well. He reseated the cables and reinstalled the mobo drivers. We didn't risk updating the BIOS since we were afraid it might happened while the update as well ( a reset happened once even in BIOS). He didn't mention anything about loose cables but he did notice that the CPU cable is connected to the overclocking slot of the motherboard. He connected it back to the normal slot and it worked for about 3 hours but the next morning, it started rebooting again while browsing.

Later that day, he brought his PSU and it worked for more than an hour. No reboots during a stress test with OCCT. My brother suggested using my old system's PSU (a FSP Hexa HE-700) and it has been working for about 3 days now with no dipping of performance or apparent issues. Managed to play for more than 5 hours and edit for about 10 hours. Typing this post as of now too. I plan to do a Memtest later tonight or tomorrow morning.

We decided to test and monitor the InWin P85 PSU in my old system but it hasn't crashed for about 8 hours now (using OCCT) and with a YouTube tab opened- which leads to me making this post. Is it possible that the PSU is still an issue? Or is it more of a motherboard issue by this point? I'm looking for some possible answers just to ensure stability. I'm a video editor and I unfortunately don't have much of a backup device.

Another thing to consider is grounding. My technician friend was kinda weirded out by our house's electricity. He got grounded a bit when it was plugged in and was reseating cables and parts. So that's also a possibility or another factor for the weirdness.

Any information would be helpful. Thanks for reading as well. Have a good day.
---
EDIT 1: Corrected some typos, updated links, and specified RAM
EDIT 2: Clarified a bit more in regards with Event ID 56

 

[Lutfij]

Welcome to the forums, newcomer!

Since a donor PSU solved the issue, it's very likely that your original PSU was the culprit all along. If your home's electrical situation is compromised, bring in a certified electrician and scope out the wiring and your grounding in your abode and your room where the PC resides.

FYI, grounding issues are another killer of parts, not just your PSU. I learned the hard way...after spending a lot of money. Thankfully architecture school taught me a thing or two about electrical wiring(not to mention in Physics) so I was able to get to the bottom of the issue sooner than later.

 

[Sefix]

Welcome to the forums, newcomer!

Since a donor PSU solved the issue, it's very likely that your original PSU was the culprit all along. If your home's electrical situation is compromised, bring in a certified electrician and scope out the wiring and your grounding in your abode and your room where the PC resides.

FYI, grounding issues are another killer of parts, not just your PSU. I learned the hard way...after spending a lot of money. Thankfully architecture school taught me a thing or two about electrical wiring(not to mention in Physics) so I was able to get to the bottom of the issue sooner than later.

Thanks for the reply and taking the time to read my post! The forum has been incredibly helpful and it really expanded my knowledge on PC hardware.

I see. I guess I have some more questions if you don't mind me asking since I really want to know more about the way PSUs work and be educated in general.

If the PSU is the culprit, how come has the P85 been working on my old system? Is the constant reboots with the InWin P85 PSU just a symptom of it dying it a bit early with the computer's more demanding components? It's a bit hard to replicate but the guy that sold the PC to me is understanding enough to return it just in case. But just to be sure, I would really like to replicate the issue with my old computer. I tried the OCCT Power test and it managed to get through it yesterday. Might do another run today.

I might get his lesser used Corsair RM850e PSU (2 months old) instead or read around and just buy a brand new unit in the coming months instead.

Thanks for the heads-up with the grounding issues too! I currently have a surge protector for the PC now as of the moment and will definitely look for a UPS next month. If I were to reach out to an electrician, is there a term for me to refer to when I'd bring it up to him?

 

[ex_bubblehead]

Could be either bad ground or excessive ripple. It's not worth the expense trying to troubleshoot.

 

[Sefix]

Could be either bad ground or excessive ripple. It's not worth the expense trying to troubleshoot.

Can you help elaborate what's an excessive ripple in this context?

 

[ex_bubblehead]

Can you help elaborate what's an excessive ripple in this context?

Anything more than pure DC is excessive and will cause random problems such as what you are seeing.

 

[Sefix]

Anything more than pure DC is excessive and will cause random problems such as what you are seeing.

Thanks for the response man. Just in case, would it help protect my PC from grounding if I get a UPS while we probably consult an electrician about our house's wiring?

 

[Misgar]

I group mains power supplies used in the home into two types:-

1). Standard, with a metal case that must be connected to earth (ground). These power supplies come with a 3-pin inlet connector or plug.

2). Double isolated, often (but not always) housed in a plastic case, that do not require an earth. These PSUs (e.g. laptop) come with a 2-pin inlet or plug.

An ATX PSU falls into the first category and needs a safety earth.

Inside an ATX PSU, you often find several X-Class and Y-Class high voltage capacitors used for transient filtering, soldered to the back of the inlet connector. There may be more X/Y capacitors on the main printed circuit board too.

https://www.techpowerup.com/articles/overclocking/psu/160/3

X-Class capacitors are connected across Line and Neutral.

Y-Class capacitors are connected from Line to Chassis and from Neutral to Chassis in the PSU.

In the photo above, the Y-Class capacitors are the two small blue discs. The X-Class capacitor (with parallel bleeder resistor) is the larger yellow component.

If the PSU chassis is not earthed, the leakage currents caused by high voltage transients will have nowhere to go and the metal case will just "float", electrically speaking.

If you touch bare metal on a computer with with no safety earth and with the other hand reach out and touch a metal water pipe, you may experience a mild shock if a small leakage current flows to ground through your body.

Leakage currents flowing through Y-Class capacitors from Line to Chassis are is usually only a few hundred microAmperes, but they are designed to flow down to earth and not through your body.

If an ATX PSU isn't properly grounded, the computer case will sometimes sit at roughly half the mains supply voltage, e.g. 55V AC for a nominal 110V 60Hz supply, or 115V AC for a 230V 50Hz mains supply.

The connection to the Line side of the AC supply via Y-Class capacitors is high impedance, so most people will not detect a computer without a proper earth connection, unless they brush the back of a finger across bare metal. They may then experience a slight buzzing sensation (mild electric shock).

If you check with a multimeter set to the 200/500/600V AC range and connect one probe to a computer chassis (with no ground connection) and the other probe to a good earth, you might see a reading of several tens of Volts or higher.

It is difficult to guess what will happen in a computer with an ATX PSU and no safety ground connection, but it could result in unexpected behaviour.

If you connect another item of equipment which does have a good earth, e.g. monitor, TV, laser printer, etc., leakage currents from the Y-class capacitors in the ATX PSU will flow through the connecting lead down to earth, with possible damage to sensitive circuits.

Swapping out ATX PSUs will not effect a cure. Nor will fitting a UPS or a surge arrestor strip, if the computer stays disconnected from earth. The only fix is to provide a good earth.

Of far more concern is what might happen if a dangerous fault occurs inside the ATX PSU and the Line supply rail shorts down to chassis through a damaged component.

When an ATX PSU is correctly earthed and a fault occurs, a very high current (often tens of Amps) will flow briefly down to ground, until a fuse or breaker blows. This isolates the PSU, reduces the chance of fire and renders the whole system safe.

If there is no earth on a "live" ATX PSU and you touch bare metalwork at mains potential, a fault current of more than 20mA flowing through your heart is enough to kill.

My recommendation is to stop using the computer until you've checked the earth connection on the wall outlet, or ask a trained electrician to test the house wiring if you don't feel confident yourself.

Use a laptop instead (if you have one) whilst the potential earth fault is checked out and fixed. Most laptop PSUs are "double isolated" and hence do not require a safety earth.

If you do get electrocuted, you've only got yourself to blame. It's no good blaming the guy who installed the house wiring 30 years ago when you're deceased.

 

[Sefix]

Thanks for all the detailed explanation so far. I figured to ask my father regarding our house's electricity. To provide some additional context, I reside in the Philippines where the power is connected line-to-line by an electric company through an electric post. It's not underneath in the earth much like the ones in the US or other regions.

A local electrician said that the voltage supply our electric company fluctuates. They noticed it would go both under and above 220V. I guess we have to verify it with our electric company to assess if the earthing of their lines to ours is going bad.

My dad said he's sure that the house's wiring itself isn't compromised. Although he suggested getting a better AVR and connecting it to the house's breaker. I'm considering getting a UPS and a PSU that has higher tolerance or has more capable filters. I already have a surge protector but I'm not entirely sure if this is a "fix". Though I acknowledge that the long-term fix is verifying the line to line connection isn't compromised and the wall outlet is earthed. I definitely won't be using the InWin P85 in the meantime.

If you have concerns to bring up, it'll be a big help.

 

[Misgar]

I doubt that your electricity company provides the safety earth (ground) connection for the mains supply inside your house. Instead, I suspect you should have a local earth connection made at the distribution box, which is then wired to 3-pin outlets where appropriate.

The electricity company's feed to a domestic property usually consists of two wires (Line and Neutral), not three (including Earth). It doesn't matter if these two wires enter your property underground (as in my house) or overhead suspended from wooden poles (as in my mother's house).

In both cases, underground or overhead, there is no third wire provided by the electricity company for use as a safety earth. Instead, the electrician wiring up the house looks for (or provides) a local earth point and connects it to the house wiring, when an earth is required.

In the case of my house, the mains earth up to tne distribution board is connected to a strap on a metal water pipe, buried in the ground. The water pipe continues on underground to the water mains supplying my housing estate and provides a good earth.

If the wiring regulations are the same in the Philippines, it is the responsibility of the house builder/electrician to provide a safety earth, whilst the electricity company provides a two wire (Line and Neutral) mains supply. I suggest you check to see where your mains earth is connected, or get a qualified electrician to confirm it's OK.

In the UK, the Neutral wire is earthed at the local electricity sub-station, but this is not always the case in other countries. This has nothing to do with the provision of a separate safety earth at the property.

A good quality Automatic Voltage Regulator should help to reduce large voltage swings, e.g. down below 200V AC. These AVRs are typically heavy bulky boxes containing a large variable voltage transformer (variac) and are commonly used with Air Conditioning Units.

An Uninterruptible Power Supply will "fill in the holes" if you experience short duration voltage drop outs, or brief power cuts, but unless you pay a lot of money, most UPS will only provide power for a few minutes at full rated output, sufficient for you to shut down your desktop computer gracefully.

Modern (quality) ATX PSUs will work quite happily all the way from 100V to 240V AC, so brown outs around 220V shouldn't be a problem. Here in the UK, the mains regularly exceeds the 240V upper limit printed on the PSU label. I regularly see voltages approaching 250V at my mother's house, but her computers continue to function.

You might consider buying a new ATX PSU with a long "hold up" time. I think the ATX spec calls for at least 17ms (milli-seconds), but some of the better quality units manage 25ms. Cheaper models may achieve only 10 to 12ms and are far more susceptible to short duration power glitches. The reviews of ATX PSUs on Tom's usually mention the "hold up" time.

Good luck.