Microsoft Responds to Windows 8 Hate From Game Devs

Page 3 - Seeking answers? Join the Tom's Hardware community: where nearly two million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.
Toggle sidebar Toggle sidebar
Status
Not open for further replies.
90% of PC users would have no clue how to run linux
Click to expand...

Put in the CD, graphical interface appears, click Install, type in your name and other stuff like computer name, timezone, etc... wait for install to finish, auto reboot...

There you go, internet ready Linux machine.

What you said "90% of PC users would have no clue how to run linux" is very-very outdated. Since Ubuntu appeared, all that was changed...
Of course, to learn more complex features you need to study, but the SAME 90% users never learn those things on Windows either...

Go try this with some relative which is clueless about computers, give him a freshly burned Ubuntu or Mint Linux CD/DVD, tell them to put it in the drive and install the OS then go browse the internet. I'm fairly sure they'll be able to do it easy... tried this with several people (Mother, Aunt, 10 year old kid, etc.), it worked flawlessly.
 
[citation][nom]wavetrex[/nom]Put in the CD, graphical interface appears, click Install, type in your name and other stuff like computer name, timezone, etc... wait for install to finish, auto reboot...There you go, internet ready Linux machine. What you said "90% of PC users would have no clue how to run linux" is very-very outdated. Since Ubuntu appeared, all that was changed...Of course, to learn more complex features you need to study, but the SAME 90% users never learn those things on Windows either...Go try this with some relative which is clueless about computers, give him a freshly burned Ubuntu or Mint Linux CD/DVD, tell them to put it in the drive and install the OS then go browse the internet. I'm fairly sure they'll be able to do it easy... tried this with several people (Mother, Aunt, 10 year old kid, etc.), it worked flawlessly.[/citation]

yet for most ppl the usefuleness of linux stops there , you can brows the net, listen to music if you did't format the drive or an online service, watch some movies and thats it. they won't be able to install many things, games aplications etc... yes there may be an echivalent to photoshop, corel, word and so on, but most of the ppl i know who work with photoshop have like a ton of plugins and you can't even get them to switch to a newer version let alone to a new program, try it and get bonked on the head with something. Like it or not linux is nowhere near the user friendliness of windows, it has made strides but i think its much more close to what windows 95 was when it apeard and people were just dabbling with it.

 
[citation][nom]velocityg4[/nom]What I don't get is MS takes a loss on XBox sales the first few years the console is out to keep the price down. How about make it so that XBox games work on Windows and vice versa from now on. That way developers don't need to develop for both platforms.Developers can target their games for the XBox specs. That way gamers know if they buy the console it will run well. Then users with uber gaming computers can crank up the details like they do now and let the game really shine. While people with wimpy computers can tone down the settings for their older hardware. Then have a keyboard and mouse for the XBox for games that require it or work much better on it. One of the things Microsoft has pointed out is that despite the "Metro" interface (yep, we said it), the new OS will offer backwards compatibility for older Windows games.I don't believe that. None of my 16 bit DOS games from the 80's and early 90's work in Win 7 x64. I know there are workarounds. Many more recent Direct X 8 and 9 games don't work either without some sort of patch or hack.[/citation]

64 bit Windows doesn't support 16 bit code. I bet even Win XP x64 wouldn't support those games, yet Windows 7 x86 probably would (or at least would do a better job of it) because 32 bit Windows still supports 16 bit code. Regardless, Windows 8 will still support modern games that are supported in Windows 7 and that's a fact.
 
[citation][nom]velocityg4[/nom]]I don't believe that. None of my 16 bit DOS games from the 80's and early 90's work in Win 7 x64. I know there are workarounds. Many more recent Direct X 8 and 9 games don't work either without some sort of patch or hack.[/citation]Regarding DOS games, there's a lot bigger problems than just OS version. Even if you installed ACTUAL MS-DOS on a modern box, assuming you got that working, most games would still be broken for various reasons. Basically, you're a bleeping tard if you're running DOS games on Windows without using DOSBox or similar.

Regarding compatibility of older Windows games on Vista/7/8 - That's not strictly Microsoft's fault. They actually have been making every effort to make Windows backwards compatible, and for the most part they've succeeded. Unfortunetely, a lot of developers, in particular game devs, aren't very careful when they write code. They only care if it works on the current version(s). They could be using horrible coding practices that are abhorred, and almost guaranteed to break the game on the next OS version, and they just don't care. With that being said, if it runs on Vista and Win7 64-bit, it's almost guaranteed to run on Win8 64-bit.
 


Actually, there has been software to make Windows look like older versions for years. Classic Shell is one such example.
 
[citation][nom]pocketdrummer[/nom]...Or they can not be stupid and officially support 1 (Ubuntu... as Valve mentioned).[/citation]That would go over great with the Linux community. That chosen distro could fork and do whatever they wanted, they'd be like the new MS, only with worse backwards compatibility, hardware compatibility, and performance.[citation][nom]notsleep[/nom]it also sucks that win8 won't let you execute apps with the built-in admin account. i'm a power user who only use the built-in admin account so i'll never be able to run metro apps. oh, well. no big lost.[/citation]You're a power user alright... user of drugs. You're better off not running in admin 24/7, that's just not a good idea anymore. Software should be written so it doesn't have to escalate all the time anyway, and when it does, you just authorize it and move on.
 


By supporting Ubuntu, derivative distros should also be supported and other distros should be able to be supported with minor hacks. Linux doesn't necessarily have worse backwards compatibility nor performance (many things actually have superior performance to Windows, then again, many don't) but sure, hardware compatibility can often have problems. However, if companies get more active in Linux, then that would probably be resolved.
 
Once a monopolist always one at heart. Time for all the developers to start supporting Linux too and tell Windows to F off. They will still get their cash from the kiddie consoles.
Click to expand...

Honestly, I think it's time for developers to just do what they want because I fail to see how we have any right to dictate their actions in such a way. If some developers want to abandon Windows, then they can do that and maybe they will. I think that most current Windows developers probably don't want to do that and that most probably won't do it.

If I've been developing for Windows for a few years, then I'd just keep doing that with the desktop shell rather than with Metro or whatever it's called. This shouldn't be any more expensive or difficult than it has been in the past, so I see no reason to stop just because Metro and such might be non-free options.
 
guys, the prime complainers here have created a means to distribute software into the PC eco system. By microsoft creating a store, this means those companies get the shaft. The question is, do we care? I don't care if i'm using origin (to be honest, i can't wait for origin to go away), or steam. Just so long as my games are kept in the cloud and i don't need media any more. Right?
 
[citation][nom]mydasx[/nom]guys, the prime complainers here have created a means to distribute software into the PC eco system. By microsoft creating a store, this means those companies get the shaft. The question is, do we care? I don't care if i'm using origin (to be honest, i can't wait for origin to go away), or steam. Just so long as my games are kept in the cloud and i don't need media any more. Right?[/citation]

Using the cloud is something that I'm always weary of. It's about as unreliable and out of personal control as a computer system can get. I like Steam for its prices, not for being an internet-based service. Having my own storage medium is letting me control the content that goes through my computer better and that is a privilege that I enjoy having.
 
supporting GFWL? That is shit, you should just back off and save yourself money, along with many gamers frustration from having to deal with that horrid system.

Turning W8 into Xbox, the reason I play PC is to stay away from shitty consoles, if more devs start supporting Linux I'll definitely be switching over, but for now, W7 I stay, with the occasional Linux if I'm feeling exploratory.

As for OUYA
HELLLLLLLLLLL NO
 
Seriously, what is the problem? I've been using Win8 CP since about a week or two after it became available, and honestly, aside from a driver issue with my girlfriend's [six- or seven-year-old printer], the only issue I've noticed is something about desktop gadgets that pops up just about every time I log in. I'm guessing it's related to the Norton Internet Security gadget, but that doesn't really matter to me anyway, as I don't use it. Oh, and the wallpapers that are supposed to change... don't. Beyond that, I have had ZERO problem with Windows 8 - AND THIS IS JUST THE CONSUMER PREVIEW!

I mean, yeah, if you don't have a REASON to upgrade, then DON'T; it's literally THAT SIMPLE. If you're buying a new computer, though, or you need to install a new OS for whatever reason, wtf is really the problem? So you've got Metro now instead of a Start button? Guess what! You can just click where the Start button used to be, in order to switch between Metro and the desktop! Something you wanna run isn't pinned to the Metro screen? Right-click and select "All Apps"!

From my experience, Windows 8 looks to be leaner and faster than Windows 7 (and THAT'S saying something!), and so far, it doesn't look like it's going to be the driver nightmare that Vista was. Admittedly, the only games I play much nowadays are Star Wars: The Old Republic, World of Warcraft, sometimes Diablo III, and I just reinstalled The Sims 3 for some reason, but I can't imagine there's going to be anything you can't play on Windows 8 that you COULD play on Windows 7.

Now, if Micro$oft DOES make moves to try to keep services like Steam and Origin at bay... well, it's Micro$oft, so is it really a surprise to anyone? Do what everyone else does, and take 'em to court. Beyond that, all it amounts to in my book is rich guys fighting other rich guys for the rights to the ease of taking money from our pockets. ::shrug::
 
Consider Valve's director complains about everything, I couldn't care what the hell he has to say. I'm tired of seenig that media seeker's name plastered on everything negative. We get it. You own steam. Steam is great. The end. Your opinion on how things run doesn't matter!
 
if windows 8 brint XBOX 360 GAMES ( HALO 3, HALO ODST, HALO REACH, HALO 4, GEARS OF WAR 2, GEARS OF WAR 3)

i will support it with all my heart if not

i will not support it the metro interface its for tablets not for pc
 
[citation][nom]PH03N1XPC[/nom]if windows 8 brint XBOX 360 GAMES ( HALO 3, HALO ODST, HALO REACH, HALO 4, GEARS OF WAR 2, GEARS OF WAR 3) i will support it with all my heart if not i will not support it the metro interface its for tablets not for pc[/citation]

If you don't like Metro, then don't use it. You don't need to just because you use Windows 8. It still has a desktop shell and you can install a new start menu (hacks don't work anymore, so installing a new one is necessary to get a start menu in Windows 8) such as with ViStart/ViOrb or with Classic Shell. Then again, there's always the option of simply not using Windows 8. Besides, Metro isn't bad if you know how to use it. The problem is that it seems to have a ;earning curve compared to simply using the desktop in mostly the same way as we have for over a decade.
 
Microsoft talk about the "features" of Windows 8 as a gaming platform as if they actually play games themselves. I can't believe that anyone who uses their verbiage in describing what a beneficial, jack of all trades, potential multi-crossplatform gaming-centric OS Window 8 is, could possibly be an actual gamer. I've never once even thought of Games for Windows as being anything but a pre-Origin era annoyance. I remember buying Fallout 3, my first time experiencing GFWL, and not even being able to play the game until about two weeks after Christmas, all thanks to GFWL.
 
Ohhhh I get it now, Windows 8 want complete monopoly to the extent of controlling WHICH games have the respect to use Windows 8 architecture for MORE money. How sinister and diabolical really.. What's next? Certain Cable channels for MORE money? OH WAIT...
 
[citation][nom]tryyoubuntu[/nom]90% of web servers run Linux, are all of those vulnerable right now?[/citation]

Yes they are, because nobody writes exploits for the OS, they write exploits for the applications that run on it.
 
[citation][nom]velocityg4[/nom]I don't believe that. None of my 16 bit DOS games from the 80's and early 90's work in Win 7 x64.[/citation]
The reason 16 bit games don't work in x64 "long mode" is because the processor architecture doesn't support "real mode" or "virtual 8086 mode", eliminating nearly all 16 bit compatibility. This has less to do with Windows and more with the x64 architecture deprecating old features (to save silicon and complexity costs, no doubt).
 
[citation][nom]Fokissed[/nom]The reason 16 bit games don't work in x64 "long mode" is because the processor architecture doesn't support "real mode" or "virtual 8086 mode", eliminating nearly all 16 bit compatibility. This has less to do with Windows and more with the x64 architecture deprecating old features (to save silicon and complexity costs, no doubt).[/citation]

Actually, 64 bit Windows dropped 16 bit support. I won't argue over whether or not the CPUs play a part, but even with the same CPU, running a 64 bit Windows OS or a 32 bit Windows OS is a defining factor between supporting 16 bit code. For example, With my Core 2-based Pentium Dual-Core 2180 CPU, I can run 16 bit code just fine in XP x86 and still a lot of it runs in Windows Vista x86 and Windows 7 x86 (some things won't full-screen without crashing, but will run if I don't try to full-screen them), but Windows 7 x64 won't run any of it. I've tested this with some older programs and games that use 16 bit code, among other ways such as simply looking it up.
 
MS, you better dump Win8 right now and think twice about this disaster you are about to embark on. I've been a loyal supporter for years, but I'm being tested hard with Win8 and how horrible it is. I can wait until Win9 without much problem, but you are not going to score any points either.
 
As it is windows 8 is perfectly fine. The metro UI is esentially your start menu in the background or a secondary desktop for the hundreds of rarely used applications. I hardly ever need to use metro and stopped using the crappy metro apps after the first day.

Navigating is a learning curve sure, but once your past that it is essentially the same with modest improvments so UI and functionality.

The developers fears are completely unfounded( for win8 at least), unless they see the app store as a preemptive move to close windows up in win9,10 or 12.

I have played many games made by these "key developers" on windows 8 and they work just as good as they ever did on win7.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

TRENDING THREADS

Latest posts

Moderators online

Share this page

COMPANY
RESOURCES
FOLLOW
Top Bottom