Mozilla Says Microsoft Went Too Far With Windows 10

[captaincharisma]

thinking about this i don't know why mozilla is ticked about this because really when you install firefox for the first time it tries to make you use it as the default browser all web browsers do it. this is an OS install but is basically the same thing

 

[Vlad Rose]

thinking about this i don't know why mozilla is ticked about this because really when you install firefox for the first time it tries to make you use it as the default browser all web browsers do it. this is an OS install but is basically the same thing

That is very true. So Firefox tries hijack your computer when you install it, but when you upgrade your Microsoft OS, their browser (Edge) isn't allowed to do the same? Sounds kind of hypocritical, especially against an OS they have no intellectual property to.

Mozilla, stop whining and make your own OS if it bothers you that much that Microsoft would like people to use MS products on their Windows OS. Heck Microsoft isn't even forcing you to; it's not that hard to switch the browser.

 

[aaronrobertjohnson83]

it is a outrage that windows 10 has cut a lot of the features that a lot of media center pc nerds care about,

and i agree with mozilla

windows needs to fix their act
and have a windows 10.1

just like when they had windows 8.1

but they are going to need to reboot windows media center
new look, same features as 7 and 8 but updated to 10
like have a wider range of apps not just netflix
have the return of the internet tv app for all versions
and they should also introduce into 7, 8 and 10 versions of wmc a hulu app where its in the same style as the netflix app on wmc
they should also improve the dvr functions on wmc for 7, 8, and 10
where its like the tivo, where if you start recording during the middle, rather than it starting from the middle, it will buffer and go back to the beginning of the program

 

[nukemaster]

it is a outrage that windows 10 has cut a lot of the features that a lot of media center pc nerds care about,

and i agree with mozilla

windows needs to fix their act
and have a windows 10.1

just like when they had windows 8.1

but they are going to need to reboot windows media center
new look, same features as 7 and 8 but updated to 10
like have a wider range of apps not just netflix
have the return of the internet tv app for all versions
and they should also introduce into 7, 8 and 10 versions of wmc a hulu app where its in the same style as the netflix app on wmc
they should also improve the dvr functions on wmc for 7, 8, and 10
where its like the tivo, where if you start recording during the middle, rather than it starting from the middle, it will buffer and go back to the beginning of the program

Media center is dead. No 2 ways about it. I will use it until it stops working, but I do NOT expect to see it continue. Most cable/satellite providers offer PVR's for cheap enough with 2 or more tuners.

New apps for hulu and whatnot can fit right into the Windows store. I honestly hoped 8 was going to get a new media center with the "modern" theme. Never happened, they just keep using the same old same old.

Tivo can record back to the start of a show because it is always recording. Most PVR's do this as well. It can only do this on the channels you re tuned to. You can not swap several channels and still record the start of something(unless you have that many tuners).

As much as I could love a media center option, I think it is dead.

Streaming has replaced disc's for many people just like mp3/m4a replaced CDs. Quality loss does not seem to be much of a concern compared to convenience.

 

[michaelmouse]

Mozilla you fired your ex leader because of his religious views and now you complain about m.s. typical liberal hypocrisy, get a life.

 

[gangrel]

Streaming has replaced disc's for many people just like mp3/m4a replaced CDs. Quality loss does not seem to be much of a concern compared to convenience.

Convenience, and cost. And remember back then: your choices were buying...expensive...or renting...which had serious issues with scratched or unplayable disks.

Also: go back a ways to...I think Win 95. A web browser has never been an implicit part of the OS, but most definitely now, it is an essential part of the installation of a new system. The problem with IE back in the Win 95ish days, was MS over-integrated the browser functionality into the system. IE and Edge are standalone at this point.

In contrast, a media player is also not an integral, implicit part of the OS...but it also is NOT required in the way a web browser is. At least one web browser is needed to access the web, in order to download anything else. A media player can simply be downloaded when desired.

I'll grant: I don't play videos much...either from a few DVDs I've got burned, or streamed. I do play music back from time to time. Media Player? I'll never miss it. Got Music Bee for audio; if/when I feel like a video player, I'll go find one.

And I think the entire streaming environment is changing. Roku, Fire TV, Chromecast...why stream to a PC when you can stream right to your TV?

Yep. WMC is dead, autopsied, slid into its coffin, and planted. No zombies allowed.

 

[mondotone]

lol.. I didn't even realize it. after my upgrade I was taking my time and disabling all the extra crap and installing my 3rd party programs.. one of the 1st programs was chrome and firefox. But then again I guess if you're a noob then you'd go with all the default settings..

 

[ubercake]

Does anyone actually read the install messages? It TELLS you that it is going to set Edge as the default browser if you continue with the "Express" install and don't click the link to customize options. If you do click that link, you can review and modify all of your settings very easily and obviously during the upgrade.

If you are one that just clicks "next" without reading, then you are exactly the kind of person who Microsoft wants to protect by defaulting things like defender, etc. to be known (to them) as secure.

This is true. All part of the upgrade process setup. The setup process even indicates what the 'Express' install settings will set on the screen by which you choose 'Express' or 'Custom'. Choose 'Custom' and you can set whatever browser you want as the default.

If you miss that, you can click on the little Window/Start button and then settings and in the 'Find a Setting' box enter 'default apps', then click 'web browser' and it will take you where you need to be to set the default browser. There are other ways to get there, but Windows 10 makes finding what you want to do pretty easy no matter how you poke around.

 

[MidnightDistort]

It's amazing that this is even a problem. Firefox can have it's browser ask if you want to change the browser to the default one. If it takes you more than 20 seconds to fix that then i don't know what to tell you but it shouldn't be an inconvenience. It's like buying a new wireless keyboard and the manufacturer gave you Eveready batteries instead of Duracell, what difference does it make long as the batteries work.

Had MS deliberately force people to keep Edge as the default browser then i could understand but it's a simple fix.

 

[surphninja]

It's amazing that this is even a problem. Firefox can have it's browser ask if you want to change the browser to the default one. If it takes you more than 20 seconds to fix that then i don't know what to tell you but it shouldn't be an inconvenience. It's like buying a new wireless keyboard and the manufacturer gave you Eveready batteries instead of Duracell, what difference does it make long as the batteries work.

Had MS deliberately force people to keep Edge as the default browser then i could understand but it's a simple fix.

I think it's understandable that they're upset. They've had to fight tooth and nail for every single user they have, and for Microsoft to just switch people over like that by default... ugh, that's gotta be tough to swallow. For as many users that switch back, there will surely be plenty more that don't switch back either out of laziness or not knowing how.

It's gotta be tough competing against the OS's browser that comes packaged, and this is a fairly big hit. I'm not entirely without sympathy for them.

 

[mondotone]

It's amazing that this is even a problem. Firefox can have it's browser ask if you want to change the browser to the default one. If it takes you more than 20 seconds to fix that then i don't know what to tell you but it shouldn't be an inconvenience. It's like buying a new wireless keyboard and the manufacturer gave you Eveready batteries instead of Duracell, what difference does it make long as the batteries work.

Had MS deliberately force people to keep Edge as the default browser then i could understand but it's a simple fix.

Don't forget to smear a little dielectric grease on the connectors. I had 1 battery that leaked and it was so easy to clean up the mess cause of it.

 

[TJohn]

This is a non-issue. Smoke. I have been using 10 for 6 months AND I am a FF user.
Mozilla needs to learn to compete. sorry. If Edge blows them away it means they have fallen behind. Period. I do not see it happening.

 

[ubercake]

What happened is there's now another player in the 'standards' market with Edge. Mozilla just needs to gather themselves and make a better product.

 

[somebodyspecial]

This is a non-issue. Smoke. I have been using 10 for 6 months AND I am a FF user.
Mozilla needs to learn to compete. sorry. If Edge blows them away it means they have fallen behind. Period. I do not see it happening.

Incorrect. Mozilla can't use their OS monopoly to force you to see their next product (or even the current one) and pray you never figure out how to change it. Microsoft can, and has, done this repeatedly. This is why Microsoft was CONVICTED of being a monopoly. We are dealing with these issues yet again, because they didn't have the balls to break them up into 3 companies like they should have. MSFT just paid a bunch of states off with a few million each when they all were financially hurting...ROFL... and rolled right on.

This isn't about the quality of the product or the competition's quality. It's about having the ability to push your stuff via your monopoly in the hopes nobody will go back to their old ways (the competition), or even know how to. We aren't talking about tech people here, who would have no issues loading multiple browsers, jumping between them for different stuff etc. You can argue they are doing the very same thing with windows 10/consoles/dx12 now. Sony can't use an operating system to push PS4 sales right? OpenGL vs. DX has always been the same fight. Only now that Android/iOS are here with such a large base does Vulkan have a chance against DX, and I'd argue will win, or at worst hopefully knock MSFT down a peg while google gets FULL PC's out the door at some point with NV/AMD discrete cards etc (games first, then full apps like adobe's suite etc). IF MSFT doesn't cut Vulkan off right now, devs will defect due to sheer numbers of units on ARM once games can be made there (or anywhere) and easily ported anywhere else.

http://www.cnet.com/news/judge-calls-microsoft-a-monopoly/
There are worse articles, just a quick google gets this and dozens of others.
"Prosecutors have argued that Microsoft unfairly leverages this market dominance to force acceptance of other products, most notably its Internet Explorer Web browser. "

"No consumer benefit can be ascribed...to Microsoft's refusal to offer a version of Windows 95 or Windows 98 without Internet Explorer or to Microsoft's refusal to provide a method for uninstalling Internet Explorer from Windows 98," Jackson wrote."

"Through its conduct toward Netscape, IBM, Compaq, Intel, and others, Microsoft has demonstrated that it will use its prodigious market power and immense profits to harm any firm that insists on pursuing initiatives that could intensify competition against one of Microsoft's core products."

We are looking at at the exact same situation of 15 years ago right NOW. Only this time if they get their way, it will affect Vulkan, PS4, Nintendo, Firefox/Chrome etc etc for the next decade or two. They are using OS dominance to push Xbox1/Dx12/Edge browser among other things that they could NOT do without owning the OS. See the point? BTW, Netscape had a better product for years, but when the enemy can give it away for free (and call it part of the OS features...ROFL - again forcing their browser on users who may not know how to change it back) until you go bankrupt, that is NOT fair to the competition and in doing so they were convicted! I was really miffed when netscape went down. I'll be really miffed if Edge wins, not because it is good, but because people just can't seem to find Firefox/Chrome/Opera etc easily AFTER the OS change. They just end up getting weaker, and losing eventually as users go down, followed by their earnings etc until they're gone like netscape etc.

We finally have a shot of getting off the (rather expensive) WINTEL train over the next decade, or at least lessening their power and getting some cheaper choices forcing more competition and better innovation (ARM/Android/Vulkan/SteamOS/Linux etc together). As AMD gets weaker we need ARM, especially if ZEN doesn't turn out good. Microsoft is (wisely, though not good for users) moving to attempt to ensure dominance for the next wave in many things. They are not giving away an OS for nothing. It is to stop everyone else, be it firefox, android/google, arm (everyone), sony/nin, linux, vulkan etc.

 

[ubercake]

To me this seems so funny. When you upgrade the OS, you can choose the browser you want as the default. If you missed that selection, you can then choose to set your default browser after the fact.

If this does not appeal to you, you can CHOOSE to buy an Apple product. If you don't want to do that, you can CHOOSE to buy a Chromebook or some variant, etc...

No one forces you to use Windows. If you don't like it, CHOOSE not to use it.

There are other options out there.

 

[gangrel]

No, ubercake, you CAN'T do that. There are many semi-specialized, narrow apps that exist ONLY in Windows; Mac is the other viable choice on this basis, as a Mac version is fairly common. But not a Linux version. And Chromebooks? Get real. Those aren't general-purpose computers; you can't run standalone programs. I do have one, and I do like it...but it's NOT a replacement for a full-blown PC. Any Linux variant? No way. The tech level required for even the most 'user-friendly' distros is seriously higher.

What you totally miss is the OS is not the key point for most users. What matters is the apps. Now, there's a circular relationship here...you can't get apps until you have installed base, and you can't build installed base without apps. Windows DOMINATES in the apps market. It dominates in name recognition (again, with Apple being the only other really viable option).

You're thinking the average user is a THG reader. Nope. You know the currently-running cars.com ad, that has the husband say "I clicked on a few links" as he cowers while his wife looks at what he's done? THAT is the kind of user where this is an issue. And that user type is *probably* still in the majority.

And avoiding the update is risky. You can do that for quite a while, to be sure, but security issues grow over time. Windows 7 is already out of mainstream support; how much longer will it be before there are no more updates?

I used to have a co-worker that said, well if you're having issues like harassment or discrimination at work, change jobs. You're showing the same arrogant attitude. Got news for ya: it ain't that simple.

 

[Coonah]

Jump through hoops? The default Edge app is absolutely no different from IE being default since Windows XP... Sounds like and advertisement for Mozilla.
I used Edge for about 2.5 seconds before changing the default to Chrome. As easy as in previous version of windows, just in a different location...
If that's the worst complaint about Windows 10 you can come up with your not using it right.... lol

 

[ah]

When I first upgraded to W10, I was then asked by my Norton Internet Security which browser to choose as default browser, so I don't think W10 forces users into using Edge at all. Every free app u install will try to force u into using this and that that u don't want...That's how they do things.

 

[somebodyspecial]

To me this seems so funny. When you upgrade the OS, you can choose the browser you want as the default. If you missed that selection, you can then choose to set your default browser after the fact.

If this does not appeal to you, you can CHOOSE to buy an Apple product. If you don't want to do that, you can CHOOSE to buy a Chromebook or some variant, etc...

No one forces you to use Windows. If you don't like it, CHOOSE not to use it.

There are other options out there.

Actually my company forces me. As such I have to have IT certs too

But, it's not really about windows itself. It's about using it to kill other companies. You're not getting what this problem is really about. I want to use other apps, but if as quoted above, MSFT continues to kill them VIA the OS, I won't have a browser choice I like left to use...LOL. Tell it to netscape, AMD, etc. Sure I have a choice to buy AMD, but after Intel has dealt major financial blows to them (same kind of cheating, and also as a monopoly), it's kind of pointless unless I am such a fanboy for AMD (I bought a 5850 due to this alone at that time), that perf means absolutely nothing to me. Today my wallet smacks me first...ROFL. I'm holding out upgrading my dad's pc for a ZEN choice, but I can only wait so long. His board failed already & has been replaced once in his trying to hold off. Sure I can go linux too, but not if I like gaming and pro app choices. Sure I can choose mac, but only if I like (IMHO) an inferior product at ridiculous pricing and again fewer choices in ALL things (games or apps). I remember when I was selling PC's, microsoft had a product called IE on a shelf for $29.99 ALONE (hmm, same price as Netscape BTW). Then they put it in the OS (hiding the price in the OS, just giving it free), and not long after that netscape was dead. I was a BEOS 5/Gobe Productive (their office product) reseller too but even with a faster/powerful product, OS dominance killed them both too. It's power then was awesome as a multimedia OS. You could run a cube with vids running on all sides while spinning back then. I still can't believe that KILLER power was ~2000. But a monopoly killed them too. Monopolistic practices KILLS choice. That is the point here.

Check out BeOS.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZVonGKJ8Ak4
There are probably better ones out there (vids), but an awesome OS done by about 20 people which is just...WOW. Go to about 15 mins and things get interesting in the original demo from BEOS. Look at the reversed PLAYING video on the back side of the page curl on a running video...LOL. Awesome. At 17 minutes he really starts to show off for ~2000 time frame. You couldn't pull this stuff on windows back then. I was blown away by a LIVE beos demo from these guys so much I started selling it and even gave away 10 free copies (they gave them to promote it). Still going as HAIKU now last I checked, but even 15yrs later, just can't get app support. Too bad MSFT didn't just buy it and incorporate it's best ideas. Sound in that demo shown too, moving around in real time 16 different sources one at a time or all at once. That demo is impressive and even better live where they could really show off (demos got better up to v5.03 IIRC, this demo is an older version I think).

https://www.haiku-os.org/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qv6twfh2SgI
This guy shows a bunch of stuff being done at once back then too. I can't find the cube vid (not sure if it's out there). But it is impressive to see in person and impossible back then. Best multimedia OS ever.. Hands down Windows was trash in comparison then. Total control of threads, app kill, total parallel threading (everything treated as a thread) etc. It sure would have been nice to see what a billion dollar company would have done with it, but like netscape...DEAD. IIRC it was $59 or something with Gobe Productive. It might have been an oem deal I think, as they were dying I got on board, hence 10 copies free/great price to push it etc, I can't remember...I'm too old...LOL. A great deal then, powerful, and something like 45MB. Even had tech similar to multiple desktops today (work environments then). That is in that demo vid I think too. We're just getting to that today on windows.

Back on point though, how many PC users that do NOT read tech sites actually do much other than accept defaults on the way in (not knowing customize installs give you browser options that don't take over the PC etc)? As an IT tech, I can say I'd bet 90% of PC users just hit default for almost everything as experience has shown, after fixing tons of stuff like crapware that goes in, I might say higher than 90% don't click "advanced options" or "customized install". My dad's brother is one, who has never used anything more than what was built in (didn't even know there were other choices for most things). Most of their generation just wasn't PC literate or even had them around like I did in the 80's. I had a computer in my life since 12, but dad's brother? Not until 50+ and can't be bothered to do much more than use what is included (not stupid, just ignorant about choices on pc's). I was trying to show him winamp/vlc etc and it came down to "well I've only known windows and media player is good enough". Discussion over. Now windows is a media player, browser, virus, firewall, burning app, blah blah blah. Anything that competes or could, gets shot down via the OS for many no matter how crappy the internal apps are. Many people feel that after paying $100-300 for windows (and all the crap in it now) they're done paying for stuff like DVD players, Burning apps, media players, virus apps etc. How long until all we have left is junk in windows?

If mozilla can't sell to enterprise (because nobody uses it at home a few years from now, thus not familiar with it) they're on their way to the grave like netscape. Firefox is already having to be given away free to home users because you simply can't sell a browser today to home users (chrome too etc). Some manager will make the decision to not use it and just go EDGE, since he doesn't use Mozilla at home now. Boom, tons of users do the same. If the OS company was separate from all this other junk and the browser still had to be sold (dvd player, burner etc too) you would have more competitors in the market because you could still actually sell this stuff as everyone would have to ADD it to their OS, thus making a choice forced.

It isn't just as simple as saying, well don't buy windows. The last time I did that was apple //e, and I loved the computer, but games and apps went to IBM PC's then. We go where the monopoly tells us for the most part. You like the idea of Vulkan? If DX12 and free windows for year succeeds massively, vulkan probably ends up just like OpenGL for the last 2 decades. You wish Linux (or some format of it) would succeed? Not likely if Vulkan never takes off due to DX12 being the standard due to what MSFT is trying to do giving away windows for just long enough to hurt both options, along with push xbox1 (kill ps4, nintendo etc), kill android/iOS gaming etc etc. Not sure how anyone doesn't see what this is. 15yrs ago again today. I hope Mozilla and others sue immediately BEFORE they end up dead. Complaining isn't enough.

Nobody forces people to stay on welfare. But once they get there, the free food/money etc seems alright to a lot of people. Nobody forces people to keep smoking, but ask them how hard it is to quit once on it. Same with heroin, crack etc...Not quite the same thing but the basic analogy should make sense. I can't even quit windows if I wanted to, unless I choose to learn some new job too! No way. If the choices suck or simply more pain than choosing is worth, that's not simply "choose not to use it". I can't really afford ANOTHER education, nor loss of a good wage for that long in this economy. I've thought about learning linux for a job, but...For me it would probably be give up windows=give up job=give up house=jeez just give up life...ROFL. Welfare and homeless really doesn't appeal to me thanks Due to my own situation, I didn't even fight my dad's brother on his "it's good enough for now, maybe later when I get time" stuff even knowing he's missing SO MUCH MORE. I get it. Heck it's tough for a baby to give up the nipple...LOL. I don't know many kids that gave those up without force, and usually with mass amounts of crying. C'mon, that at least had to make you laugh I guess we just agree to disagree on this.

 

[Vlad Rose]

Check out BeOS.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZVonGKJ8Ak4
There are probably better ones out there (vids), but an awesome OS done by about 20 people which is just...WOW. Go to about 15 mins and things get interesting in the original demo from BEOS. Look at the reversed PLAYING video on the back side of the page curl on a running video...LOL. Awesome. At 17 minutes he really starts to show off for ~2000 time frame. You couldn't pull this stuff on windows back then. I was blown away by a LIVE beos demo from these guys so much I started selling it and even gave away 10 free copies (they gave them to promote it). Still going as HAIKU now last I checked, but even 15yrs later, just can't get app support. Too bad MSFT didn't just buy it and incorporate it's best ideas. Sound in that demo shown too, moving around in real time 16 different sources one at a time or all at once. That demo is impressive and even better live where they could really show off (demos got better up to v5.03 IIRC, this demo is an older version I think).

https://www.haiku-os.org/

I used to run Beos. It was fine unless you needed network connectivity of any form since their entire stack was broken from the get go. I was originally designed for Apple. When Jobs came back, they went with his NEXT platform; killing Beos for Apple. They tried to recover by coming out with an incomplete PC port and suing Microsoft for not being able to get into the market.

 

[ubercake]

No, ubercake, you CAN'T do that. There are many semi-specialized, narrow apps that exist ONLY in Windows; Mac is the other viable choice on this basis, as a Mac version is fairly common. But not a Linux version. And Chromebooks? Get real. Those aren't general-purpose computers; you can't run standalone programs. I do have one, and I do like it...but it's NOT a replacement for a full-blown PC. Any Linux variant? No way. The tech level required for even the most 'user-friendly' distros is seriously higher.

What you totally miss is the OS is not the key point for most users. What matters is the apps. Now, there's a circular relationship here...you can't get apps until you have installed base, and you can't build installed base without apps. Windows DOMINATES in the apps market. It dominates in name recognition (again, with Apple being the only other really viable option).

You're thinking the average user is a THG reader. Nope. You know the currently-running cars.com ad, that has the husband say "I clicked on a few links" as he cowers while his wife looks at what he's done? THAT is the kind of user where this is an issue. And that user type is *probably* still in the majority.

And avoiding the update is risky. You can do that for quite a while, to be sure, but security issues grow over time. Windows 7 is already out of mainstream support; how much longer will it be before there are no more updates?

I used to have a co-worker that said, well if you're having issues like harassment or discrimination at work, change jobs. You're showing the same arrogant attitude. Got news for ya: it ain't that simple.

Again, back to the argument of if you are a casual user, why do you even care what browser you're using? How did you even get firefox on your PC if you don't have the skills required to install software? If you know how to install software and use a browser, why is it you can't use a browser and search engine to find out how to set your default browser? How is it you can effectively play farmville through an elaborate facebook page and set up your new wireless printer, but can't set your default browser? If people want to set their default browser, they'll look for ways to do it. My guess is most casual users don't have a preference and are happy when the link they clicked on takes them where they want to go. The people you alluded to who are afraid to click a link definitely don't care what browser they're using and have never switched from IE so they'll be fine with Edge.

I'm making some basic assumptions about the intelligence and motivation of humans in general. If you want to call it arrogance, that's fine. If I'm wrong, we can call it ignorance. But one thing (among the three; you don't want to know the other two) I've learned throughout life is if people really want to know how to do something within their means, they learn how to do it. If some user is hell-bent on using Opera with Windows 10, by golly, they're going to watch the youtube video or call their geeky relative to figure out how to set it as their default.

What I'm saying is people have everything available to them to easily make the changes they want to make to set up their desired browser. Windows 10 makes it simple to set a default browser. I don't consider people powerless or victims of an OS/browser. If it's not important to people, they won't do anything different than the default.

Browsers seem to be a commodity software product anymore with few features differentiating one from another. How can Mozilla make their browser important enough to people for people to use their product? That's what I'd like to know.

The reason most business apps run on a Windows platform is because it is a decent platform that is familiar. I really don't see anything wrong with that. I foster no hatred of the Windows OS or the Edge browser. Are there things about it I would have rather seen done differently, sure. For the most part, I can do just about anything, work or play, that I need to - requiring a computer - within Windows.

 

[GObonzo]

if it is too hard to type "Firefox" in your new horribly-nazi-agenda Edge browser, click download, and install. then you need to take a class on using Windows before you even go any further.
if you're using Windows for work-related tasks and can't figure it out, you should be fired.

 

[GObonzo]

http://www.cnet.com/news/judge-calls-microsoft-a-monopoly/
There are worse articles, just a quick google gets this and dozens of others.
"Prosecutors have argued that Microsoft unfairly leverages this market dominance to force acceptance of other products, most notably its Internet Explorer Web browser. "

well, evolution is a rough game. when one species gains the advantage that's usually the end of others, unless they can come up with some new adaptation that ensures their survival or the end of the others above them on the food chain.
if some company, developer, or advertising agent can come up with something better and cheaper than Windows then it will be the end of it as the top reigning OS that everyone builds for and 90% of customers buy.

But, until that happens Windows is like humans: killing off everything else whether it be unfairly or not.

If you hate MS and Windows so much, come up with something better and save everyone from the threat you are trying to advocate.

 

[pippin3]

I'm glad Mozilla is taking a stand on this. After all preferences were invented for users to be able to customize their "preferred choices". And in all the years before that has never changed from OS to OS.

Not only is it annoying for us savvy users but just imagine what its like for those who don't know what happened or how to change it. There are more pc users out there that just want to turn their machines on and everything works, than there are people like us who can either figure it out ourselves or know where to go to get the steps to fix it.

They could've had a friend or relative do the upgrade for them or perhaps just bought a new pc with 10 already installed, (I'm sure MS isn't going to limit this change just to the upgrades) and not know how to change it or they might not even know that it can be changed. Its not fair to them is it?

This can be a test to see if MS listens to their all important product consumers. Who knows maybe they'll surprise us with a positive response that shows they do care what we think & are willing to work on it. (but just in case..... don't hold your breath)

 

[GObonzo]

I'm glad Mozilla is taking a stand on this. After all preferences were invented for users to be able to customize their "preferred choices". And in all the years before that has never changed from OS to OS.

Vista, 7, and 8\8.1, and i believe those before even came with Internet Explorer as their default browser, pre-installed. what is the difference now with Edge?
i just don't understand why now it's such a huge deal. you can install whatever browser you want, the same as it ever was.