[SOLVED] Trouble cooling a 60W Xeon

[InSovietRussiaComputerBuildsYOU]

I got a mobo bundle for one of my friends, it included a Supermicro server mobo, a Xeon L5640 and some RAM. Unfortunately, it came with a very small passive cooler, which wasn't enough to cool the Xeon, so I recommended him getting a freezer 13, the most affordable block cooler.
It does a good job the majority of the time, but when I attempted to test the temps with Prime95, they eventually got to 70-75C and kept climbing (Stock turbo, no overclock). I stopped the test, because the server Supermicro mobo is set to start beeping at 75C to avoid overheating. Is this normal?
Now, it's not a problem for his daily tasks but he might eventually start streaming, etc and I thought that the Freezer 13 is quite beefy and will manage the heat with it's 3 copper pipes, especially since it's only a 60W chip, but it's not the case.
Is there something I should know about the Freezer coolers, I assumed they will work fine, but maybe there is a reason why they are the cheapest? (costed him about 22 euros)
My other idea is that he only has one 120mm fan in his case and the PC is located under his desk, so maybe the Xeon eventually produces enough heat for sort of a heat bubble under the desk/inside the case?
Would adding a second (suction) fan on the cooler help? I've seen some coolers come with two fans on each side.
If it's not decent I can buy him a new one (no idea which one) and keep the Freezer 13 for myself.

P.S. Originally I was also thinking of looking at the settings and seeing if I can get a bit of an overclock with that chip and mobo, since this Xeon runs quite low at 2.26 GhZ. It's the L-series (low-powered) version that uses only 60W, so I was hoping I can bump it up a bit without too much heat.

 

[laviniuc]

there's not a lot you can do in daily work to replicate the abuse prime95 does... so no worries there.

did you apply thermal paste properly? does the case have any more fans for coolling?

 

[geofelt]

What is your idle temperature?
I expect to see 10-15c. over ambient if the cooler is mounted well.

If it is significantly higher, here are two common mounting mistakes:

1. Using too much paste acts as an insulator. A small drop in the center will spread under heat and pressure.

2. The cooler must not be loose and must be tightened down evenly.
Use a crossing pattern and tighten a little bit at a time.

Any cooler needs a good source of fresh air to do it's job.
Does your problem go away if you remove the case covers?
If so, look to install a front intake fan 120mm at least.

Lastly, Intel generally throttles at 100c.
Not certain about Xeon.
Consider raising the 75c. limit in the bios to 95c.

 

[Karadjgne]

TDP is somewhat misleading. It's the average power used by several specific programs Intel uses. Prime95 is not one of them. The problems arise because they are average usage programs, not extreme exasperated by the fact TDP is power used not heat output. Generally power used and °C are pretty close, so TDP was adopted as defacto temps as well, but that's a 6c/12t cpu, not a quad core. The apps used do not test the full extent of what 12threads can do to temps under extreme usage.

For extreme usage, figure heat output as being 1.5-2x for a quad-HT, with 8threads being closer to if not slightly over 2x. With your cpu at 12 threads, you should be looking for coolers in the 2.5-3x TDP range if you want to keep Prime95 temps under 70. The arctic freezer is a 140w cooler. That's inadequate for Prime95 testing or rendering or any other program that's going to tax all 12 threads to anywhere close to 100% usage. You'll need something closer to a Cryorig H5, beQuiet Darkrock 3/4, Noctua NH-D14 or other similar 180w-200w cooler.

Those Arctic Freezer coolers are good budget coolers, but like any budget cooler, it has limits. Prime95 and other 100% load programs can easily exceed those limits that normal usage doesn't reach.

 

[InSovietRussiaComputerBuildsYOU]

What is your idle temperature?
I expect to see 10-15c. over ambient if the cooler is mounted well.

If it is significantly higher, here are two common mounting mistakes:

1. Using too much paste acts as an insulator. A small drop in the center will spread under heat and pressure.

2. The cooler must not be loose and must be tightened down evenly.
Use a crossing pattern and tighten a little bit at a time.

Any cooler needs a good source of fresh air to do it's job.
Does your problem go away if you remove the case covers?
If so, look to install a front intake fan 120mm at least.

Lastly, Intel generally throttles at 100c.
Not certain about Xeon.
Consider raising the 75c. limit in the bios to 95c.

I think I tightened and installed it correctly - the ambient temps were fine (40-45C in a 30C room), but sadly I don't think the BIOS limit can be increased. He's planning on buying a new case, so I'll make sure the one he buys has at least 2-3 fans.

 

[InSovietRussiaComputerBuildsYOU]

TDP is somewhat misleading. It's the average power used by several specific programs Intel uses. Prime95 is not one of them. The problems arise because they are average usage programs, not extreme exasperated by the fact TDP is power used not heat output. Generally power used and °C are pretty close, so TDP was adopted as defacto temps as well, but that's a 6c/12t cpu, not a quad core. The apps used do not test the full extent of what 12threads can do to temps under extreme usage.

For extreme usage, figure heat output as being 1.5-2x for a quad-HT, with 8threads being closer to if not slightly over 2x. With your cpu at 12 threads, you should be looking for coolers in the 2.5-3x TDP range if you want to keep Prime95 temps under 70. The arctic freezer is a 140w cooler. That's inadequate for Prime95 testing or rendering or any other program that's going to tax all 12 threads to anywhere close to 100% usage. You'll need something closer to a Cryorig H5, beQuiet Darkrock 3/4, Noctua NH-D14 or other similar 180w-200w cooler.

Those Arctic Freezer coolers are good budget coolers, but like any budget cooler, it has limits. Prime95 and other 100% load programs can easily exceed those limits that normal usage doesn't reach.

Thanks, this was helpful. I thought the low TDP and clock speeds can come to an advantage with thermals, I guess I was wrong.

 

[Karadjgne]

They do have an advantage with thermals for sure. A quad core at 60w runs considerably cooler than a quad at 95w. At full 4 core, 100% loads, a 60w quad would be looking at @ 100w or so, very easy for a budget 140w cooler to keep at 70ish. That 95w cpu under same conditions would be closer to 150w. Slightly over what a budget cooler can handle. So you'd move up 1 notch in cooler ability. Cooler choice is relative to the loads the cpu will see, whether OC or not.

Idle temps and load temps are very different. Idle heat output is well under what any cpu cooler can handle, so is only really affected by ambient temps and cooler efficiency. Not it's size or ability. It's just as easy for a big 280mm liquid cooler to get 40° at 30° ambient as a Intel stock cooler.

Load temps are different. There, exact temps are dictated by cooler capacity, efficiency, size and ability. The cooler might start at 40° idle but it's upto capacity whether it gets to 55° with a 280mm AIO or 100° on a Intel stock cooler. OC just makes cooler choice more critical since the further away from stock you get, the higher the heat output is away from power used. TDP might be 60w, but crank that Xeon up close to 4GHz and it's heat output will be far closer to 5x TDP, you'd need a 250w+ range cooler pushing that 6 cores/12 threads under Prime95.

It's why you'll almost always see the big lga2011/2066 builds with OC and full custom loops. The cpu literally needs that amount of radiator space to keep that 400w+ in check. Even if they are 140w cpus.

Oh, and the CM hyper212 series is a royal pain in the a.. to get seated right, if that adjustment knob is a little loose, you won't get a good seat on the cpu and load temps will run high. If it's too tight, there's too much pressure on the cpu and you have to be very careful how you tighten the cooler down or the paste gets shoved to one side and you'll know that's happened when 1-2 cores are very hot and the rest are 10° or more cooler. It's honestly one of the more badly designed mounts, but being so cheap ppl bought them anyways.

 

[geofelt]

I second the thought that the hyper212 is a PITA to install.

If the case can install a 120mm fan in front to draw in fresh air, that should do it.
Prioritize intake air capability. Whatever air that comes in will exit somewhere, taking component heat with it.

If you are looking for a really good cooler with a 120mm fan, I can personally recommend the scythe kotetsu, a $35 cooler.
Here is a review:
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article1391-page1.html