Question UPS & PSU problem.

[Vky Rhodes]

Hey there,
I want to purchase a UPS for my PC.
Here's my build: https://in.pcpartpicker.com/list/9WgnsZ

I already have an inverter installed at my house but without UPS feature. It has a 150AH battery connected to it.
Now I'm looking for a UPS so that my Computer doesn't Shut off during power outage (that's obvious!).

My concern is:
Do i need to care about the back up time of the UPS? Will the UPS run through the inverter and keep my computer ON?

Please correct me, if I'm wrong here. As I don't now how all these things work.

What do I need to do in this scenario?

Inverter link: https://www.microtekdirect.com/product/microtek-digital-ups-e²925/

Please let me know
Thanks.

 

[jonnyguru]

Obviously the backup time of the PSU is going to vary based on the load of your PC. For example: A 1760W UPS (your typical 2000VA model) would run a PC with an average load of 500W for over an hour on battery power.

So you're looking at a 740W model, but your PSU is 650W. I seriously doubt you're pushing anywhere near 650W with that build. If you were, that UPS wouldn't last 10 minutes.

I'd say with your parts, you're probably doing about 400W average while gaming. So you'll probably get about 15 minutes out of that UPS before the battery dies.

 

[Vky Rhodes]

Obviously the backup time of the PSU is going to vary based on the load of your PC. For example: A 1760W UPS (your typical 2000VA model) would run a PC with an average load of 500W for over an hour on battery power.

So you're looking at a 740W model, but your PSU is 650W. I seriously doubt you're pushing anywhere near 650W with that build. If you were, that UPS wouldn't last 10 minutes.

I'd say with your parts, you're probably doing about 400W average while gaming. So you'll probably get about 15 minutes out of that UPS before the battery dies.

Thanks a lot for response,
I really need to sort this thing out.

I'd say with your parts, you're probably doing about 400W average while gaming.

Yeah, thats's fair enough. Though, I use my PC for content creation. No gaming

My issue is: I already have an inverter with a 150AH battery installed at my house but it doesn't has UPS feature. At the time of power outage, it takes about a second to provide the back up. That means my PC will shut off.
That 1 second of delay. I just need to fix this.

Now what should i do to tackle this?
1. Should i buy an inverter with UPS feature for pc? like this: https://www.luminousindia.com/zelio-1100.html
or
2. Should I buy a UPS for PC? like this

What'd you suggest?

 

[jonnyguru]

Thanks a lot for response,
I really need to sort this thing out.


Yeah, thats's fair enough. Though, I use my PC for content creation. No gaming

My issue is: I already have an inverter with a 150AH battery installed at my house but it doesn't has UPS feature. At the time of power outage, it takes about a second to provide the back up. That means my PC will shut off.
That 1 second of delay. I just need to fix this.

Now what should i do to tackle this?
1. Should i buy an inverter with UPS feature for pc? like this: https://www.luminousindia.com/zelio-1100.html
or
2. Should I buy a UPS for PC? like this

What'd you suggest?

What's the inverter for? Are you running off solar? "Inverter" is a link in your post, but clicking on it just takes us to that Microtek UPS.

 

[Vky Rhodes]

What's the inverter for? Are you running off solar? "Inverter" is a link in your post, but clicking on it just takes us to that Microtek UPS.

There are frequent & at times long power outages in my region. That's why we have that inverter to back up household devices. But i doubt that it'd back up my PC because everytime there is a outage. The inverter takes a second to provide the back-up. I'm afraid that during that 1 second period my PC will shut off and I don't want that.
The inverter is powered by 150AH battery.

The psu i'm gonna use is Corsair RMX650W..

 

[jonnyguru]

Ah.. Ok.


So yeah... Nothing wrong with hooking a UPS up AFTER the inverter. UPS doesn't care. Inverter doesn't care. And it will allow you to shut down your PC in time.

The one you linked will be fine if you're just doing some content creation (we're not talking about compiling video with Blender, are we?) and will be there to shut the PC down once you realize you're off the inverter AND it comes with software that will shut the PC down for you if you're not there to do so.

 

[Vky Rhodes]

What's the inverter for? Are you running off solar? "Inverter" is a link in your post, but clicking on it just takes us to that Microtek UPS.

An inverter converts the DC electricity from sources such as batteries or fuel cells to AC electricity. The electricity can be at any required voltage; in particular it can operate AC equipment designed for mains operation, or rectified to produce DC at any desired voltage. [Wikipedia]

Inverter and UPS are almost same. Any 12V battery can be used in both inverter or UPS (car battery, inverter battery etc). They look same as well. The only difference is between their response time.

Inverter gives backup when there is no electricity. It take 1–2 seconds to start backup. Meanwhile, your computer will shut down, any unsaved data will be lost and you need to power it up again.

Sorry, If you know it already.

 

[Karadjgne]

I would choose a line interactive type of UPS. What that does is regulate the AC voltage that's input by combining it with the battery, it's extra insurance during brown-out or funky voltage conditions so that your psu gets the full voltage it's supposed to. If power dies for any reason, the battery kicks in fully in a few milliseconds, so the pc doesn't shut off.

Depending on the size of the backup will determine the possible run time vs load. So you can expect 3 minutes to over an hour.

A UPS is there to allow you chance to save data, not necessarily to continue using data, so when the household inverter kicks in, saving your work is a must do first thing and be prepared for any inconvenience since batteries only last so long and will last less time with higher loads.

 

[Vky Rhodes]

The one you linked will be fine if you're just doing some content creation (we're not talking about compiling video with Blender, are we?)

I just do basic 1080p video editing (using stock clipss) to upload on YouTube.

What UPS should I buy? Do i need to care about output waveform or design?

I only need UPS to give me back up for that 1 second period (b/w outage & inverter back up) to avoid the PC from shutting down. Thereafter, inverter will take care.
Plus inverter will give a atleast 1-2 hours of backup easily.

 

[Vky Rhodes]

I would choose a line interactive type of UPS. What that does is regulate the AC voltage that's input by combining it with the battery, it's extra insurance during brown-out or funky voltage conditions so that your psu gets the full voltage it's supposed to. If power dies for any reason, the battery kicks in fully in a few milliseconds, so the pc doesn't shut off.

Depending on the size of the backup will determine the possible run time vs load. So you can expect 3 minutes to over an hour.

A UPS is there to allow you chance to save data, not necessarily to continue using data, so when the household inverter kicks in, saving your work is a must do first thing and be prepared for any inconvenience since batteries only last so long and will last less time with higher loads.

Thanks for the response.
Does it has to be a pure sinewave UPS?
or
Will this one do a good job? link: https://www.vguard.in/product-details/sesto-600

 

[jonnyguru]

Thanks for the response.
Does it has to be a pure sinewave UPS?
or
Will this one do a good job? link: https://www.vguard.in/product-details/sesto-600

With that RMx, you do not need pure sine.

Can't be much help with suggesting a particular brand UPS. India seems to have their own wacky brands that I've never seen anywhere else.

 

[Vky Rhodes]

I would choose a line interactive type of UPS.

This one is line interactive but underpowered i guess. But does it matter? Because I only need the UPS for 1 sec sec to prevent shut down after that the inverter will take on.

What'd you say?

 

[jonnyguru]

Most consumer grade UPSs are line interactive, including the two you linked previously.

 

[Vky Rhodes]

With that RMx, you do not need pure sine.

Can't be much help with suggesting a particular brand UPS. India seems to have their own wacky brands that I've never seen anywhere else.

Just to clarify:
I've read somewhere that it is suggested to use a apure sinewave UPS with a PSU with active PFC?
Is it necessary though?

 

[Vky Rhodes]

Most consumer grade UPSs are line interactive, including the two you linked previously.

So will this one do the job without any issues or is it underpowered?
Keeping in mind that I only need the UPS for 1 sec to prevent shut down because after that the inverter will take on.

 

[jonnyguru]

360W, one battery. Yeah. That should last about 10 minutes.

 

[Vky Rhodes]

360W, one battery. Yeah. That should last about 10 minutes.

Thanks for confirming.

I think this battery should last more than 10 minutes. It's a huge battery. Isn't it?

 

[jonnyguru]

Thanks for confirming.

I think this battery should last more than 10 minutes. It's a huge battery. Isn't it?

I was talking about the battery inside the UPS. 😀

 

[Vky Rhodes]

With that RMx, you do not need pure sine.

I've read somewhere that: it is suggested to use a pure sinewave UPS with a PSU with active PFC? Corsair RMX750W is the right?
Is it necessary though?

Could you please clarify?

 

[Vky Rhodes]

I was talking about the battery inside the UPS. 😀

My understanding:
When there will be a power outage, that 350W UPS would prevent the computer from shutting down.
Then, within a second or two, I'll get the power back up from the inverter battery. The UPS has no role to play now.

And that's that. Right?

 

[jonnyguru]

My understanding:
When there will be a power outage, that 350W UPS would prevent the computer from shutting down.
Then, within a second or two, I'll get the power back up from the inverter battery. The UPS has no role to play now.

And that's that. Right?

If you only need a second or two, you can get away with the smallest UPS out there! (That's not garbage, that is)

 

[Karadjgne]

There's basically 3 kinds of waves used by ups.

1. Square wave. This type is easiest to produce and most often used by only the cheapest ups. It is the wave that has issues with active pfc. You get a constant + voltage, then a drop at 0v then a constant - voltage. It's the drop at 0v that causes the issue as it takes time to go from + to - and in that time there's literally 0v and the psu freaks out and shuts down. Longest power on time.
2. Modified/stepped is the most common wave and has a sloped not constant output, far reducing the 0v state. For almost all active pfc psus, the 0v state is under the psu hold time limit, so there's no issues with shut down. But it can affect a few. Slightly less battery on time than square wave.
3. Pure sinewave. That's a square wave that's modified to the extreme point of becoming a simulated ac sinewave. Least common, most expensive and by far the fastest battery drain due to the sheer amount of power required to create the wave. Full draw times are measured usually 3-6 minutes.

The Corsair RMx won't have issues with 2 or 3,but will with 1.

 

[jonnyguru]

There's basically 3 kinds of waves used by ups.

1. Square wave. This type is easiest to produce and most often used by only the cheapest ups. It is the wave that has issues with active pfc. You get a constant + voltage, then a drop at 0v then a constant - voltage. It's the drop at 0v that causes the issue as it takes time to go from + to - and in that time there's literally 0v and the psu freaks out and shuts down. Longest power on time.
2. Modified/stepped is the most common wave and has a sloped not constant output, far reducing the 0v state. For almost all active pfc psus, the 0v state is under the psu hold time limit, so there's no issues with shut down. But it can affect a few. Slightly less battery on time than square wave.
3. Pure sinewave. That's a square wave that's modified to the extreme point of becoming a simulated ac sinewave. Least common, most expensive and by far the fastest battery drain due to the sheer amount of power required to create the wave. Full draw times are measured usually 3-6 minutes.

The Corsair RMx won't have issues with 2 or 3,but will with 1.

The RMx does not have an issue with square wave.

 

[Karadjgne]

Huh, well that's good to know, it's hard to get accurate info on specifics like that since ups waves aren't part of any reviews I can remember. It's seriously hit and miss. I know my Evga G2 550w absolutely does not like even stepped or modified square waves at all. I'm stuck with pure sinewave or nothing.

 

[Vky Rhodes]

If you only need a second or two, you can get away with the smallest UPS out there! (That's not garbage, that is)

Does it matter what waveform the inverter is? I guess not. Because during outage, the power from the inverter the power will go through the UPS to PSU and then to the PC.
It's a square wave inverter by the way.